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If a German regime took over the running and planning of Ireland in the 1950s..

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    #32
    Fritzbox
    Registered Users Posts: 490 ✭✭Fritzbox


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    Look in fairness the Brits while they did commit atrocities from time to time they never put people in concentration camps and systematically murdered whole races of people

    Didn't the British set up concentration camps in South Africa during the Boer War, and what about the native Aborigines of Tasmania?


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    #33
    Stacksofwacks
    Registered Users Posts: 1,544 ✭✭✭Stacksofwacks


    Fritzbox wrote: »
    Didn't the British set up concentration camps in South Africa during the Boer War, and what about the native Aborigines of Tasmania?

    Quite possibly I haven't looked into these incidents, Im sure there were episodes in the British colonial era that would be considered bordering on genocidal acts, but I doubt anything as blatant and callous as what the Nazis did to the Jews


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    #34
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,517 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Much of the problems in Ireland are deep in the Irish mentality.
    Bringing in a governmental regime from somewhere like Germany would be a disaster.
    Irish people talk about improved standards and a tighter ran ship, but they really mean they want that don’t on other people rather than themselves or their household.

    Cute hoorism, parish pump politics, nepotism are all Irish traits, it’s silly to think we then wouldn’t see them in Irish governmental officials.


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    #35
    Snails pace
    Registered Users Posts: 601 ✭✭✭Snails pace


    kona wrote: »
    Pavee point would have a awful time .

    I dont think they'd exist, probably the only good thing I can think of


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    #36
    banie01
    Registered Users Posts: 16,573 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    Look in fairness the Brits while they did commit atrocities from time to time they never put people in concentration camps and systematically murdered whole races of people

    The Brits are the inventors of the concentration camp.
    Aside from that, gassing was much too labour intensive for the Brits.
    Take a look at what they did to cause the Bengal famine and the death toll there.
    Not all that long ago either.


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    #37
    mikemac2
    Registered Users Posts: 2,932 ✭✭✭mikemac2


    Who is ready to pay the religion tax to attend your local church?


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    #38
    Stacksofwacks
    Registered Users Posts: 1,544 ✭✭✭Stacksofwacks


    banie01 wrote: »
    The Brits are the inventors of the concentration camp.
    Aside from that, gassing was much too labour intensive for the Brits.
    Take a look at what they did to cause the Bengal famine and the death toll there.
    Not all that long ago either.

    I hear people say too that the brits deliberately caused the Irish famine, which I believe is incorrect. There was definitely ambivalence and neglect to what was happening in Ireland but not outright malice.


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    #39
    badabing106
    Registered Users Posts: 1,433 ✭✭✭badabing106


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    Quite possibly I haven't looked into these incidents, Im sure there were episodes in the British colonial era that would be considered bordering on genocidal acts, but I doubt anything as blatant and callous as what the Nazis did to the Jews

    What about the blatant and callousness of what Oliver Cromwell did to the Irish

    [URL] https://www.historyireland.com/cromwell/how-many-died-during-cromwells-campaign/[/URL]


    And I'm sure this callousness applies to every country that has ever existed


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    #40
    LirW
    Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    Sincere Big Mountain wrote: »
    I see the thread title has changed from Nazi to German.

    So, do the points in the OP still stand?


    Childcare in some parts of Germany exceeds €900 per month. Utilities cost approx. €250 per month. An apartment in Munich is €2,250+ per month.

    Munich is an outlier though and not really representative for a couple of reasons: there's pretty much no domestic building. Also Munich attracts international high society and a lot of rich people are spending insane money to live there. It is an unspeakably rich city with a lot of investment and it has a rental shortage for decades now.

    Also unless you send your child into a really fancy private facility you won't pay 900 euros. For one child that needs 35 hours you'll pay anywhere from 0 - 400 euros depending on where you live and what they earn. There is a difference between council and private facilities and private ones have no guidelines, but 400 would be a really high fee to pay for a state facility.


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    #41
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,517 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    I hear people say too that the brits deliberately caused the Irish famine, which I believe is incorrect. There was definitely ambivalence and neglect to what was happening in Ireland but not outright malice.

    There was no Irish famine.
    Yea the potato crop failed.

    But ireland was full of other crops and plenty of livestock.

    What we had was genocide committed by the English occupying force. They used the failure of the potato crop as a convenient method to decimate the population and make us far easier to deal with.

    There are lists of the food exported by English landlords from Ireland during the time that Irish people were dying in ditches from starvation.

    Genocide not famine.


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    #42
    cj maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,614 ✭✭✭✭cj maxx


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    I hear people say too that the brits deliberately caused the Irish famine, which I believe is incorrect. There was definitely ambivalence and neglect to what was happening in Ireland but not outright malice.
    They didn't cause the blight , but they did cause the famine by denying the irish the food available and shipping loads of it to England. My history books said anyway


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    #43
    LirW
    Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    mikemac2 wrote: »
    Who is ready to pay the religion tax to attend your local church?

    That's why people simply leave the church, you can do that over there.
    And for everyone wanting to go, that's part and parcel of being a Christian; the tax is also not collected by the state but by the church.


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    #44
    banie01
    Registered Users Posts: 16,573 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    I hear people say too that the brits deliberately caused the Irish famine, which I believe is incorrect. There was definitely ambivalence and neglect to what was happening in Ireland but not outright malice.

    Wanton incompetence and indifference played quite a part in it.
    Turning high quality arable land over to cash crops whilst forcing marginal land over to the growing of a single staple crop all had considerable impact on the causes of the famine.
    As did the rents, the lack of reliefs available and numerous other contributory factors that were all in the gift of the landlord class and the Parliament.

    Where stupidity leads to genocide, do you fell that no culpability accrues via a lack of malice then?
    Or are you just feigning historical ignorance in an effort to troll?


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    #45
    Stacksofwacks
    Registered Users Posts: 1,544 ✭✭✭Stacksofwacks


    banie01 wrote: »
    Wanton incompetence and indifference played quite a part in it.
    Turning high quality arable land over to cash crops whilst forcing marginal land over to the growing of a single staple crop all had considerable impact on the causes of the famine.
    As did the rents, the lack of reliefs available and numerous other contributory factors that were all in the gift of the landlord class and the Parliament.

    Where stupidity leads to genocide, do you fell that no culpability accrues via a lack of malice then?
    Or are you just feigning historical ignorance in an effort to troll?

    Im not saying the brits were blameless and they definitely didn't help the situation but I don't think it amounted to Genocide. Just a difference of opinion, that's all


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    #46
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,517 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    Im not saying the brits were blameless and they definitely didn't help the situation but I don't think it amounted to Genocide. Just a difference of opinion, that's all

    Difference of opinions is a human trait and always encouraged.

    It happens on this occasion that your is wrong.


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    #47
    banie01
    Registered Users Posts: 16,573 ✭✭✭✭banie01


    Stacksofwacks wrote: »
    Im not saying the brits were blameless and they definitely didn't help the situation but I don't think it amounted to Genocide. Just a difference of opinion, that's all

    Perhaps if you could qualify your position on what does constitute a genocide?
    The Irish famine is an object lesson in ensuring the deaths of the most maligned portion of Irish society in the eyes of the British establishment at the time, in a manner that needed very little input or expenditure in men or material.

    A masterclass in efficient genocide, as was Bengal.
    There is quite a degree of scholarly writing that would support the British position during the famine as being at its very best...
    Malicious indifference.
    What's your own opinion based on?


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    #48
    Stacksofwacks
    Registered Users Posts: 1,544 ✭✭✭Stacksofwacks


    banie01 wrote: »
    Perhaps if you could qualify your position on what does constitute a genocide?
    The Irish famine is an object lesson in ensuring the deaths of the most maligned portion of Irish society in the eyes of the British establishment at the time, in a manner that needed very little input or expenditure in men or material.

    A masterclass in efficient genocide, as was Bengal.
    There is quite a degree of scholarly writing that would support the British position during the famine as being at its very best...
    Malicious indifference.
    What's your own opinion based on?

    Its a while since I did history in school but I never got the impression that it was entirely the Brits fault, yes they should shoulder a good portion of it for how they reacted/didn't react but it was mainly down to circumstances, bad luck etc. A genocide I would define as something preplanned and systematic, now you could be right and maybe the Brits did plan it all out or even saw what was happening and took advantage. But again, just my opinion


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    #49
    RobbingBandit
    Registered Users Posts: 18,099 ✭✭✭✭RobbingBandit


    East or West Germans


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    #50
    Thelonious Monk
    Registered Users Posts: 13,928 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk


    There would be planned towns and villages that are connected with public transport, trees, and my absolute favourite - no one off housing - drool.


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    #51
    The Tetrarch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,092 ✭✭✭The Tetrarch


    How did this thread become a thread about the Brits? :confused:


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    #52
    badabing106
    Registered Users Posts: 1,433 ✭✭✭badabing106


    Thelonious Monk wrote: »
    There would be planned towns and villages that are connected with public transport, trees, and my absolute favourite - no one off housing - drool.

    Yes. Houses would only be more expensive in tiny parts of Dublin rather than 3 times more expensive because of the negligent planning and infrastructure processes elsewhere


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    #53
    LirW
    Registered Users Posts: 4,825 ✭✭✭LirW


    Good apartment living.
    I sure miss my old apartment.


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    #54
    TheValeyard
    Registered Users Posts: 12,266 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Well, if the Nazis had won....



    1018316866.jpg

    Fcuk Putin. Glory to Ukraine!



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    #55
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    SmartinMartin wrote: »
    You wouldn't see many travellers around.

    Genius, who would have guessed the solution would have been that simple?


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    #56
    Wibbs
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,108 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    corner of hells wrote: »
    I'd like to be a Tiger tank commander or maybe a Stuka pilot.

    Herself could be in trouble though , the old Jewish heritage wouldn't do her any good.
    Funny enough my dad knew an ex Stuka pilot just after the war and he ended up marrying a Jewish lass who had survived the period in a town outside Hamburg. She had been taken in by a German family. IIRC she was explained away as one of their "rellies from the country". Dunno how they worked the ID cards etc, but they must have done. They moved to Canada in the late 40's.
    Ward J. Littell wrote: »
    Without going into the ethical and moral issues of the Nazi regime, the perception of its efficiency and ability to have "the trains run on time" was just that. A perception.

    In reality, the regime was rife with croneyism and corruption. It had to rely on slave labour to function.
    Very much so. Backhanders were common and "friends of the party" got the lion's share of the sweet deals. Plus one reason for the reliance on slave labour is unlike the Allies they were very resistant to adding women to the war effort workforce, instead wanting them to be good little hausfraus to breed more nazis for the reich.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



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    #57
    nuac
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭nuac


    Mod
    The OP refers to the 1950s. The Nazis were off the pitch since April 1945 so leave them out of this. OK?


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    #58
    corner of hells
    Registered Users Posts: 8,363 ✭✭✭corner of hells


    banie01 wrote: »
    ILoveYourVibes is your Mrs? ;)

    Its Frau Vibes .


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    #59
    nuac
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,769 Mod ✭✭✭✭nuac


    Yes, the Germans have a great and well deserved reputation for economic development.
    However some projects have not turned out so well. E.g. the "new" Berlin Airport is a saga of bad planning and corruption.


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    #60
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    nuac wrote: »
    Mod
    The OP refers to the 1950s. The Nazis were off the pitch since April 1945 so leave them out of this. OK?

    You would have to ignoring the Odessa organisation and all the new "immigants" into Argentina.


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    #61
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    nuac wrote: »
    Mod
    The OP refers to the 1950s. The Nazis were off the pitch since April 1945 so leave them out of this. OK?

    I think you may have arrived to this thread after the sneaky title edit, which originally referred to the Nazis and not the Germans.


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