The Strike is over. What happens now?

Fedlot · 22-10-2019 04:55PM

“Believe it or not we never considered the outcome of the dairy calves’ – Teagasc”

This statement was made by Teagasc’s Dr. Pat Dillon – the Head of the Animal and Grassland Research and Innovation Programme – during the IFA’s dairy discussion on managing dairy calves which took place today, October 22, in The Hotel Kilmore, Co. Cavan.

At least he has said it and I’ll respect him for that as personally I think this is a monumental statement and honesty is a rare commodity. But holy Jesus , that admission alone tells you that agriculture in Ireland needs a complete investigation and remodeling and not by those currently entrusted with looking after it. What the hell were all the high level committees from the “industry led experts” on foodwise and pathways for growth for? Total incompetence at best if not downright dirty practices and politics to lead farmers to this end result.

_Brian · 22-10-2019 06:02PM

Base price wrote: »

Brian - the German farmers must have been reading your comment yesterday
https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/german-farmers-take-to-roads-in-extensive-tractor-protests/

Will increase the momentum for similar here.

Castlekeeper · 22-10-2019 06:31PM

Fedlot wrote: »

“Believe it or not we never considered the outcome of the dairy calves’ – Teagasc”

This statement was made by Teagasc’s Dr. Pat Dillon – the Head of the Animal and Grassland Research .

That's the same "man" who said the fodder crisis of 2012/13 in the west was mainly a result of poor farming practice and insufficient fertiliser use. Those boys live in a bubble.

Mac Taylor · 22-10-2019 08:14PM

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/mcdonagh-to-beef-farmers-protest-gets-you-so-far-you-need-a-plan-an-end-goal/

I’m sorry but what a load of twaddle. Maybe I’m being very simple in my outlook, but it’s a supply and demand issue. We as farmers are supplying too much, cut back numbers and as a result cut back inputs, mind the payments and quit chasing efficiency for efficiency sake, I hear the experts speaking of spreading your fixed costs by having more stock, that’s alright if you have a profitable base to start with but if your losing money adding more stock into the mix is just throwing good money after bad, I’m farming part time and will be cutting back and will try to use my brain rather than brawn going forward.

SuperTortoise · 22-10-2019 08:33PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/mcdonagh-to-beef-farmers-protest-gets-you-so-far-you-need-a-plan-an-end-goal/

I’m sorry but what a load of twaddle. Maybe I’m being very simple in my outlook, but it’s a supply and demand issue. We as farmers are supplying too much, cut back numbers and as a result cut back inputs, mind the payments and quit chasing efficiency for efficiency sake, I hear the experts speaking of spreading your fixed costs by having more stock, that’s alright if you have a profitable base to start with but if your losing money adding more stock into the mix is just throwing good money after bad, I’m farming part time and will be cutting back and will try to use my brain rather than brawn going forward.

I would'nt disagree with what you have said and i intend to follow the same route, however with current beef price and current retail price there is more than enough to give the farmer his/her fair share, corporate greed has brought us to this point.

Mac Taylor · 22-10-2019 08:47PM

SuperTortoise wrote: »

I would'nt disagree with what you have said and i intend to follow the same route, however with current beef price and current retail price there is more than enough to give the farmer his/her fair share, corporate greed has brought us to this point.

I agree, retail beef increased in 2018 by 5.4% in 2018 albeit Ireland which is a tiny market and I could not find similar for the uk. At the moment we have no method of seeing accurately who gets what from beef. If we had a govt who gave a crap, a competition authority who knew what they were doing and an open book look at the supply chain, but if is one of the biggest words in the English language so unfortunately I don’t see any of the above happening. Albert Einstein put it best: insanity.....keep repeating the same experiment and expecting a different outcome.

ruwithme · 22-10-2019 09:19PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/mcdonagh-to-beef-farmers-protest-gets-you-so-far-you-need-a-plan-an-end-goal/

I’m sorry but what a load of twaddle. Maybe I’m being very simple in my outlook, but it’s a supply and demand issue. We as farmers are supplying too much, cut back numbers and as a result cut back inputs, mind the payments and quit chasing efficiency for efficiency sake, I hear the experts speaking of spreading your fixed costs by having more stock, that’s alright if you have a profitable base to start with but if your losing money adding more stock into the mix is just throwing good money after bad, I’m farming part time and will be cutting back and will try to use my brain rather than brawn going forward.

Well said mac. A few home truths for at least some of us.

Water John · 22-10-2019 09:56PM

TMK the UK retail beef price rose 10% in the UK in 2018.

yosemitesam1 · 22-10-2019 10:09PM

Water John wrote: »

TMK the UK retail beef price rose 10% in the UK in 2018.

Volume was down 10 or 12% this year, so what is average price actually showing?

Bass Reeves · 22-10-2019 11:59PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/mcdonagh-to-beef-farmers-protest-gets-you-so-far-you-need-a-plan-an-end-goal/

I’m sorry but what a load of twaddle. Maybe I’m being very simple in my outlook, but it’s a supply and demand issue. We as farmers are supplying too much, cut back numbers and as a result cut back inputs, mind the payments and quit chasing efficiency for efficiency sake, I hear the experts speaking of spreading your fixed costs by having more stock, that’s alright if you have a profitable base to start with but if your losing money adding more stock into the mix is just throwing good money after bad, I’m farming part time and will be cutting back and will try to use my brain rather than brawn going forward.

It not a load of twaddle its a clear message of what we need done. He is saying that farmer have to unify again. Already we see one of the IFA canditate's speaking about two beef sections in IFA. The reality is that a lot of people need to realize that a certain section of farmers cannot be used as cannon fodder by the so called commercial farmers.

_Brian · 23-10-2019 06:26AM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/mcdonagh-to-beef-farmers-protest-gets-you-so-far-you-need-a-plan-an-end-goal/

I’m sorry but what a load of twaddle. Maybe I’m being very simple in my outlook, but it’s a supply and demand issue. We as farmers are supplying too much, cut back numbers and as a result cut back inputs, mind the payments and quit chasing efficiency for efficiency sake, I hear the experts speaking of spreading your fixed costs by having more stock, that’s alright if you have a profitable base to start with but if your losing money adding more stock into the mix is just throwing good money after bad, I’m farming part time and will be cutting back and will try to use my brain rather than brawn going forward.

Dead right Mac

Farm produce is a commodity product.
Overproduce any commodity and it’s price crashes.

The teagasc mantra of increased numbers and improved efficiency is a load of rubbish. If the base price can’t cover the costs of production increasing numbers is foolish.

Muckit · 23-10-2019 07:38AM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/mcdonagh-to-beef-farmers-protest-gets-you-so-far-you-need-a-plan-an-end-goal/

I’m sorry but what a load of twaddle. Maybe I’m being very simple in my outlook, but it’s a supply and demand issue. We as farmers are supplying too much, cut back numbers and as a result cut back inputs, mind the payments and quit chasing efficiency for efficiency sake, I hear the experts speaking of spreading your fixed costs by having more stock, that’s alright if you have a profitable base to start with but if your losing money adding more stock into the mix is just throwing good money after bad, I’m farming part time and will be cutting back and will try to use my brain rather than brawn going forward.

Look l don't know is your first sentence directed at Mcdonagh? I would agree with everything you said but l would have great time for P McDonagh as a businessman. A self made man, he didn't get it easy but he didn't get it by trampling on people either. Look it was handy for him to step in and talk. He owns that hotel. But twas good of him to give of his time. I'm sure he didn't crease them either for the room rental.

2020 and possibly 2021 will be rocky. I'm with you. Have cut back to nothing. Stock that went out so far hasn't been replaced. I've only half the shed full. In fact I think this will be my last year wintering.

The beef feedlots aren't our buying. Says it all. They aren't taking the gamble especially when for they know that for everyone of you and me, there's 2 or 3 others that are willing to do the work and more for effectively nothing. It's very sad that a natural and passionate ability to produce great beef is being exploited by the big boys to line their own pockets.

Mac Taylor · 23-10-2019 07:36PM

Bass Reeves wrote: »

It not a load of twaddle its a clear message of what we need done. He is saying that farmer have to unify again. Already we see one of the IFA canditate's speaking about two beef sections in IFA. The reality is that a lot of people need to realize that a certain section of farmers cannot be used as cannon fodder by the so called commercial farmers.

Hi Bass, I get where you are coming from and am not afraid of a fight IF I thing I have a chance of winning, but the odds are stacked against us, we’re not wanted, the money shot is in dairying and beef farmers should bin the suckler cow and rear the dairy male offspring....it’s for the greater good. I don’t like it and will not be part taking but.......for a lot of lads what other choice will they have.

MIKEKC · 23-10-2019 08:04PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

Hi Bass, I get where you are coming from and am not afraid of a fight IF I thing I have a chance of winning, but the odds are stacked against us, we’re not wanted, the money shot is in dairying and beef farmers should bin the suckler cow and rear the dairy male offspring....it’s for the greater good. I don’t like it and will not be part taking but.......for a lot of lads what other choice will they have.

None or get out

Mac Taylor · 23-10-2019 08:05PM

Muckit wrote: »

Look l don't know is your first sentence directed at Mcdonagh? I would agree with everything you said but l would have great time for P McDonagh as a businessman. A self made man, he didn't get it easy but he didn't get it by trampling on people either. Look it was handy for him to step in and talk. He owns that hotel. But twas good of him to give of his time. I'm sure he didn't crease them either for the room rental.

2020 and possibly 2021 will be rocky. I'm with you. Have cut back to nothing. Stock that went out so far hasn't been replaced. I've only half the shed full. In fact I think this will be my last year wintering.

The beef feedlots aren't our buying. Says it all. They aren't taking the gamble especially when for they know that for everyone of you and me, there's 2 or 3 others that are willing to do the work and more for effectively nothing. It's very sad that a natural and passionate ability to produce great beef is being exploited by the big boys to line their own pockets.

Hi Muckit, I’m with you re Pat McDonagh, I wasn’t shooting the messenger just the message, tbh I’m getting fairly sick of all this shyte. Up to recently I enjoyed farming, very different to the day job, I was quite happy to take the good with the bad but I’m getting to stage now where it becoming a chore, don’t get me wrong it’s not the stuff inside the gate rather outside, climate change which farmers are responsible for, anti farming vegan brigade, piss poor prices, the list goes on. From my perspective though I’ll still keep tipping away just less.:D

Hard Knocks · 23-10-2019 08:11PM

Mac Taylor wrote: »

Hi Bass, I get where you are coming from and am not afraid of a fight IF I thing I have a chance of winning, but the odds are stacked against us, we’re not wanted, the money shot is in dairying and beef farmers should bin the suckler cow and rear the dairy male offspring....it’s for the greater good. I don’t like it and will not be part taking but.......for a lot of lads what other choice will they have.

Before you jump into buying the dairy calves do you sums
Rearing dairy calves isn’t easy or cheap, if they’re too dear on day 1 you’d of been better with the suckler cow

gerryirl · 23-10-2019 09:18PM

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Before you jump into buying the dairy calves do you sums
Rearing dairy calves isn’t easy or cheap, if they’re too dear on day 1 you’d of been better with the suckler cow

have to agree with you there.. look at the latest figures from a farm walk down in Kilkenny I think from a fella at it (i Think its on agriland I seen it).. makes very glum reading. A few around here at it and I went to an open day a couple years back. They were basing there figures on base price of €3.90 that time. We are a long way from that now.. One thing you will have if you go the dairy route is plenty of stock.. The stocking rate Teagasc and the rest a pushing are fairly high

Base price · 28-10-2019 08:13PM

_Brian wrote: »

Will increase the momentum for similar here.

Seems you were correct - https://www.farmersjournal.ie/farmers-plan-to-hit-dublin-with-protest-504123

Reggie. · 28-10-2019 10:06PM

Base price wrote: »

Seems you were correct - https://www.farmersjournal.ie/farmers-plan-to-hit-dublin-with-protest-504123

Must get the polish out

wrangler · 29-10-2019 07:41AM

Base price wrote: »

Seems you were correct - https://www.farmersjournal.ie/farmers-plan-to-hit-dublin-with-protest-504123

Hard to see what they'll achieve, beef has become another product that's cheaper to produce elsewhere.
How does anyone compete with the Polish producing at under €3/kg

Base price · 29-10-2019 09:06AM

wrangler wrote: »

Hard to see what they'll achieve, beef has become another product that's cheaper to produce elsewhere.
How does anyone compete with the Polish producing at under €3/kg

It looks like it's partially about the injunctions on the two farmers. It appears that C&D Foods have not lifted them.

Mooooo · 29-10-2019 09:37AM

The tractor protests in Holland were primarily against what was going on in parliament over there. Hence part of the reason they were well received along with the organisation being excellent. I don't think it would be similar here tbh

wrangler · 29-10-2019 10:28AM

Base price wrote: »

It looks like it's partially about the injunctions on the two farmers. It appears that C&D Foods have not lifted them.

Those two farmers did break the law and C and D don't buy cattle.
It's not the governments problem

wrangler · 29-10-2019 10:31AM

Mooooo wrote: »

The tractor protests in Holland were primarily against what was going on in parliament over there. Hence part of the reason they were well received along with the organisation being excellent. I don't think it would be similar here tbh

They'll get no support from the public if they block up Dublin, IFA was very controlled all those years ago otherwise they wouldn't have been let into the city.
I know there was hundreds of tractors turned back in Kinnegad

Who2 · 29-10-2019 11:27AM

wrangler wrote: »

They'll get no support from the public if they block up Dublin, IFA was very controlled all those years ago otherwise they wouldn't have been let into the city.
I know there was hundreds of tractors turned back in Kinnegad

The difference is it’s not the Ifa. Before I go on I don’t believe the protest will achieve anything. But these protests are more vigilante guerrilla type efforts, and I’d say they are going to be far more common. There’s a few still riled up that are looking for a fight at any cost. Something needs to happen but there isn’t any suitable solutions that I can see.

Bass Reeves · 29-10-2019 12:06PM

Who2 wrote: »

The difference is it’s not the Ifa. Before I go on I don’t believe the protest will achieve anything. But these protests are more vigilante guerrilla type efforts, and I’d say they are going to be far more common. There’s a few still riled up that are looking for a fight at any cost. Something needs to happen but there isn’t any suitable solutions that I can see.

There has to be a rapid change in mindset by the powers that be. Calf and store man confidence is shattered, he is exiting the business at pace. I think next spring there will be a huge confidence issue especially if beef prices remain 20-30c/kg below 4 euro for a lot of the winter.

Contrary to popular opinion IMO most lads were making a small profit up until 2 years ago. Lads that were only making a small profit are losing money now. There costs are continuing to rise. Bin was empty and I had to but a few bags of nut's in local co-op over 8/bag or 325/ ton. That is 70/ ton more than bulk onto bin of a better quality ration.
Low prices will solve low prices but a lot of lads that think there business is future proof are in does shock. If they want to stay on beef they will have to rear the calves themselves

wrangler · 29-10-2019 12:25PM

Who2 wrote: »

The difference is it’s not the Ifa. Before I go on I don’t believe the protest will achieve anything. But these protests are more vigilante guerrilla type efforts, and I’d say they are going to be far more common. There’s a few still riled up that are looking for a fight at any cost. Something needs to happen but there isn’t any suitable solutions that I can see.

It's hard to see the support for it, what percentage of farmers will support a vigilante effort. A lot of farmers might let their tractors go on it but not if there's going to be civil disobedience....... also a lot of guys will have to take a day off work

patsy_mccabe · 29-10-2019 02:28PM

I was talking to a guy yesterday, who said that Larry's feedlots were not buying at the moment. I guess why buy stores and feed them, when you can buy them cheaper finished. He also said that Rathdowney were no longer killing cows, only in-spec cattle.

Muckit · 29-10-2019 04:13PM

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I was talking to a guy yesterday that said the Larry's feedlots were not buying at the moment. I guess why feed stores, feed them when you can but them cheaper finished. He also said that Rathdowney were no longer killing cows, onlhy in-spec cattle.

Yes l've been saying all this. Very few buyers about. And why would they when they can saddle the bog ponies?

Tis has been 5years in the making and twill take another 5 to right itself. Time to batten down the hatches.

wrangler · 29-10-2019 04:56PM

Muckit wrote: »

Yes l've been saying all this. Very few buyers about. And why would they when they can saddle the bog ponies?

Tis has been 5years in the making and twill take another 5 to right itself. Time to batten down the hatches.

Processors will now make farmers pay for the protests, I see on the Indo that instead of penalising heavy cattle they are now just not buying them

A quote from one of my posts ''they are our customers'' we should remember that

The Strike is over. What happens now?

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