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Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,253 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    So according to that article in the Times -

    Boy A is denying sexually assaulting Ana.

    Boy B is still denying any part in her murder.

    Hope they get a very long sentence.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,820 ✭✭✭smelly sock


    So according to that article in the Times -

    Boy A is denying sexually assaulting Ana.

    Boy B is still denying any part in her murder.

    Hope they get a very long sentence.


    Boy A looking for a more lenient sentence obviously. The horse has well and truly bolted there you would hope.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,226 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Boy A looking for a more lenient sentence obviously. The horse has well and truly bolted there you would hope.

    Sadly this is Ireland where the justice system seems to believe any old shyte.
    They will look for any excuse to ease the pain for the perpetrators.

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy



    Hope they get a very long sentence.

    I keep seeing posts asking for a very long sentence but are there not only two options?
    The maximum sentence usually handed down to a minor and released at 18 years of age. (have I got this wrong?)
    Or a life sentence which is an undetermined amount of time(at least 7 years but longer is more likely) and depends on future reviews of the parole board. A life sentence would mean they would be monitored to some extent for the rest of their lives.

    I understand the outrage but not the lack of awareness of the law that the same posters have had explained over and over.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,989 ✭✭✭DellyBelly


    Will they be named when they get sentenced?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,129 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    DellyBelly wrote: »
    Will they be named when they get sentenced?

    No


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    tuxy wrote: »
    I keep seeing posts asking for a very long sentence but are there not only two options?
    The maximum sentence usually handed down to a minor and released at 18 years of age. (have I got this wrong?)
    Or a life sentence which is an undetermined amount of time(at least 7 years but longer is more likely) and depends of future time. A life sentence would mean they would be monitored to some extent for the rest of their lives.

    I understand the outrage but not the lack of awareness of the law that the same posters have had explained over and over.

    Maybe I should have said “ as long as possible”.
    Does that satisfy you?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    DellyBelly wrote: »
    Will they be named when they get sentenced?

    I don't see why they would since it would mean new identities on release and could only cause possible harm to the family of the guilty. One member of the boys family has already been attacked.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Maybe I should have said “ as long as possible”.
    Does that satisfy you?

    How long is as long as possible since we can't predict what may happen in 7 - 10 years from now?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,038 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    tuxy wrote: »
    One member of the boys family has already been attacked.

    over the weekend

    big brave lads beating up an innocent kid (which he is)

    feel very sorry for him


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    tuxy wrote: »
    How long is as long as possible since we can't predict what may happen in 7 - 10 years from now?

    Surely that will be down to the Judge.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Surely that will be down to the Judge.

    If he does not give a life sentence it will be.

    If he does give a life sentence he can give advice to the parole board to take on board for the future but ultimately it would be down to them. 7 yeas would be the minimum under these circumstances but 10 - 12 would be more likely. In theory they could decide to never release them. So it's out of the judges hands once he passes a life sentence but this is the outcome I am hoping for as it will be the longest sentence, we will not have any idea how long it will be until it comes up for review in 7 - 10 years.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,129 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    tuxy wrote: »
    If he does not give a life sentence it will be.

    If he does give a life sentence he can give advice to the parole board to take on board for the future but ultimately it would be down to them. 7 yeas would be the minimum under these circumstances but 10 - 12 would be more likely. In theory they could decide to never release them. So it's out of the judges hands once he passes a life sentence but this is the outcome I am hoping for as it will be the longest sentence, we will not have any idea how long it will be until it comes up for review in 7 - 10 years.

    Think it’s the minister for justice of the day who has the final say on lifers being released.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    That Victim Impact Statement is so harrowing.
    God love Ana’s parents and give them some peace.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,820 ✭✭✭smelly sock


    That Victim Impact Statement is so harrowing.
    God love Ana’s parents and give them some peace.

    Heartbreaking.

    An eye for an eye comes to mind here......


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    salmocab wrote: »
    Think it’s the minister for justice of the day who has the final say on lifers being released.

    Yes I'm far from an expert on the matter so would be interested in any correction to what I stated.
    You're right it will be the decision of the future minister for justice based on the report from the parole board.

    For now all we can hope for is that a life sentence will be handed down for both boys.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    According to the Garda inspector neither of the boys would tell how and when they planned the whole thing. How they decided on who would call for Ana and where she was to be taken. How the tape, masks etc got to the house.
    A lot of this pre-planning they kept to themselves.

    Evil is too small a word to describe those two.

    He agreed there were disputes between the two boys' accounts:

    about whose idea it was to meet Ana in the first place
    who decided Boy B was to call for her
    who decided where they were to meet up
    who brought what to the house, especially in relation to the length of tape found around her body
    how her clothing was removed
    who assaulted her and with what
    who smashed her phone when it started to ring
    who produced the tape and put it on her neck
    whether there had been any previous discussion about Boy A wanting to kill Ana and how they came up with similar accounts as part of the cover up afterwards.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,320 ✭✭✭Ace Attorney


    Little ****es should be jailed for life, even now not coming clean. I hope the judge does the right thing


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,902 ✭✭✭✭Kristopherus


    Little ****es should be jailed for life, even now not coming clean. I hope the judge does the right thing

    There are guidelines laid down for sentencing juveniles.
    https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2019/1029/1086204-sentencing-legislation/


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,129 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Davidahig wrote: »
    Will they be sentenced today and if not why not?

    Will they be named and if not why not?

    No there is too much to do
    No they are minors


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    salmocab wrote: »
    No there is too much to do
    No they are minors

    Do you know at what point Darren Goodwin was named?


  • Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The pain of living without her was unbearable she said.

    It was no longer a life, not even an existence, but a misery they must endure for the rest of their lives. Every family occasion was entrenched with pain.

    Those two evils don’t deserve to exist either. Life should mean life locked up. That’s the sentence The Kriegel’s have been given so those scum should get no less.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,322 ✭✭✭✭markodaly


    There are guidelines laid down for sentencing juveniles.
    https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2019/1029/1086204-sentencing-legislation/

    Looking at that, these guys will be out well before they turn 30.

    And people wonder why they have no faith in the Irish justice system.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,625 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    He was released after only 13 years, free at 28. :( And still no remorse.
    How come Darren Goodwin was named and these two aren't?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Davidahig wrote: »
    Too much to do? They have the whole day!

    This is like Brexit, postpone,mpostpone postpone.

    It's an unprecedented complex case.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    How come Darren Goodwin was named and these two aren't?

    Was he named before he turned 18?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,309 ✭✭✭Immortal Starlight


    Can't believe the news said boy b is considered to be a low risk of offending again. I think both of them are like dogs that have tasted the blood of a sheep. There's no way they won't kill again.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,625 ✭✭✭Patrick2010


    Yep,


    Boy (16) sentenced to life in prison for Laois murder
    Fri, Oct 15, 2004, 01:00



    A 16-year-old Co Laois boy who murdered a 14-year-old boy was sentenced to life in prison in the Central Criminal Court this morning.

    Darren Goodwin, of Graigue, Mountmellick, Co Laois, was found guilty last July at the Central Criminal court of murdering Daragh Conroy, who was hammered to death for his mobile phone.

    Goodwin had pleaded not guilty to the murder at Briar Lane, Mountmellick, on November 11th, 2003.

    Passing sentence this morning, Mr Justice Barry White called Mr Goodwin a "danger to society." He refused leave to appeal, ruling that the matter should be reviewed on the tenth anniversary of the trial, in July 2014.

    Goodwin, dressed in a blue tracksuit, sat silently and without expression throughout the sentencing. The stoic demeanor was in contrast to his body language before the proceedings began, when he was fidgeting and clearly nervous.

    "You killed an innocent 14-year-old boy in a premeditated, vicious, brutal and callous manner," Justice White told Goodwin.

    "You deprived Daragh Conroy of life at a time when, in the normal course of events, he would have had his entire life before him. You have devastated the life of his mother, who will grieve to her dying day for her only child. You have brought shame and disgrace upon your family. [Your mother] will be branded for the rest of her life as a parent of a murderer. And you have ruined your own life."

    Justice White said by pleading not guilty to the charges, Goodwin gave the court the opportunity to observe his attitude and demeanor.

    "Your attitude was one of total indifference to what was going on... You showed nothing but scorn for this trial in particular and society in general," he said.

    "It has been urged upon me that you are remorseful," said Justice White, but had that been the case, he added, "that remorse would have manifested before the trial.... I find it hard to believe that any expression of remorse from you is real or genuine."

    Goodwin's face did not change when Justice White passed the sentence of imprisonment for life. His mother cried briefly.

    Justice White brought attention to questions of motive during the sentencing, saying he was worried about evidence that had emerged during the trial - that the killing of Daragh may have been a "trial run" for the killing of a garda - would not be seen if the case went to the Court of Criminal Appeals.

    He said evidence for the possible motive was obtained by the "attitude... and views expressed by the client and other juveniles, including [Goodwin's] friends and friends of the deceased."

    He said the motive may have been theft, a trial run for the eventual murder of a member of An Garda Siochana or a combination of both. The defence argued that the matter was excluded from evidence and was not tested.

    Justice White also said Goodwin was "certainly a danger to his father."

    A psychologist who met with Goodwin reported that, when asked why Daragh Conroy was chosen, the accused said he "was in the wrong place in the wrong time. Had he not been there, [Goodwin] said he would have killed his father instead."

    Asked if he would trade the life of Daragh Conroy for the death of his father, Goodwin said he would.

    After the sentencing Justice White, speaking to Goodwin's mother Ms Olive Goodwin, said: "I am not a man with a heart of stone. I too have young children and I know exactly how you feel. I would like to express my sympathy to you."

    Daragh's body was found on waste ground in Smithsfield, Mountmellick, shortly before midnight on November 11th, 2003. He had suffered "six separate blows to his head", five of which were "inflicted in rapid succession . . . with considerable force" while he was lying on the ground, the State Pathologist, Dr Marie Cassidy, told the court during the eight-day trial.

    The jury of five men and seven women found the youth guilty by a majority of 11-1 last July.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,980 ✭✭✭✭tuxy


    Yep,


    Boy (16) sentenced to life in prison for Laois murder
    Fri, Oct 15, 2004, 01:00



    A 16-year-old Co Laois boy who murdered a 14-year-old boy was sentenced to life in prison in the Central Criminal Court this morning.

    Darren Goodwin, of Graigue, Mountmellick, Co Laois, was found guilty last July at the Central Criminal court of murdering Daragh Conroy, who was hammered to death for his mobile phone.

    Goodwin had pleaded not guilty to the murder at Briar Lane, Mountmellick, on November 11th, 2003.

    Then it would seem it's at the judges discretion.


This discussion has been closed.
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