Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

iamwhoiam · 25-06-2019 06:22PM

LiamoSail wrote: »

Two kids of similar age were sentenced to 80 years each for the murder of one of their grand mothers recently. I always think the US justice system is far too unforgiving, while ours appears to go too much the opposite way.

I certainly hope the judge strongly considers the lack of remorse, cooperation and the need to protect the public from these evil bastards in his sentencing.

Absolutley the lack of remorse and lack of any empathy or shame should be considered here .
I am of the opinion that both boys should be named and photo printed in rhe media at age 18 . The public should be protected from boys like this and young girls deserve to know who they are . Protection cannot given for them over the protection of our daughters or sisters or grandchildren

mrjoneill · 25-06-2019 06:28PM

briany wrote: »

I was just thinking that if this had happened in the States, a lot more would probably be made out of the 'satanic pledge' found in Boy B's room, plus the preference for heavy metal and horror movies. Here, it's almost an aside, because the boys would still have to have known that what they were doing was so heinously wrong, but over there, it would segue into some moral majority hand wringing.

If that had happened in the US there killers would be doing a min of 40-50yrs. And there is no escaping it. They would be getting out to a place for crapped out convicts to end their days. Kids do gun violence in the US and get big sentences but this is different this girl Ana was brutally bludgeoned to death over a period of time. And not only that we have one who partook in it by leading her to it, but also tried to cover up for the guy who did the savagery and this is portrayed as normal, "innocent" according to his father.

tuxy · 25-06-2019 06:30PM

As said before I wish making a family endure such a long trial after suffering so much already had consequence.
As it stands it was probably their solicitors that recommended the not guilty plea because there was nothing to lose by doing so.

tuxy · 25-06-2019 06:31PM

mrjoneill wrote: »

If that had happened in the US there killers would be doing a min of 40-50yrs. And there is no escaping it. They would be getting out to a place for crapped out convicts to end their days. Kids do gun violence in the US and get big sentences but this is different this girl Ana was brutally bludgeoned to death over a period of time. And not only that we have one who partook in it by leading her to it, but also tried to cover up for the guy who did the savagery and this is portrayed as normal, "innocent" according to his father.

But if this was the US we would have much higher murder rates so it's not all positives.

mrjoneill · 25-06-2019 06:43PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

No he was not obliged to lock her up but it would not be a good idea to let a teenage girl go out with a teenage boy whom is not know to you. Ask yourself this, would Geraldine have let Ana go out with boy B that day?

I don't agree with that. Ana did nothing wrong, she was naive and very. Don't think any other girl of same peer group would be led along 3km through the fields to a derelict house close to the next village to meet another boy. And that is believing there was innocence to it. So we are to ask ourselves now that there justification in having open season on naive people. Girls & boys escape out windows all the time to meet up with others while their are believe to be studying or asleep. Its part of growing up. I would think Geraldine thought at most this boy was trying to make a fool out of Ana and did not want her upset.

mrjoneill · 25-06-2019 06:44PM

tuxy wrote: »

But if this was the US we would have much higher murder rates so it's not all positives.

Helped by the availability of guns

mrjoneill · 25-06-2019 06:54PM

tuxy wrote: »

As said before I wish making a family endure such a long trial after suffering so much already had consequence.
As it stands it was probably their solicitors that recommended the not guilty plea because there was nothing to lose by doing so.

Don't agree, legals will point out the obvious its up for the client to take it on board. There was no escaping Boy A guilt, the prosecution counsel did not even have to go there summing up it was so tight. But his client believed in his own innocence despite it. They prob got through to them in the end when post trial they wanted a manslaughter verdict put to the jury, which would never be accepted to the prosecution for such a gruesome crime. As for Boy B, he was sure of his own innocence. He accepted he did some wrong but it was on the misinformation scale, a quick slap on the wrist and he was free to go back to normality, back to his cartoons.

Hannibal_Smith · 25-06-2019 07:05PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I assume anyone criticizing the parenting skills of boy B's father for supposedly not caring what was going on when the garda was in his house the night Ana disappeared, will be equally as critical of Patric Kriegel. After all, he let Ana go off with a 13 year old boy whom he did not know & he did not know where they were going. Geraldine on the other hand, knew instantly that she should not have been with that boy. If Geraldine were at home at the time boy B called, Ana would be alive now. Why was Geraldine so much more in tune with Ana's life than Patric?

Christ!

tuxy · 25-06-2019 07:11PM

mrjoneill wrote: »

Don't agree, legals will point out the obvious its up for the client to take it on board. There was no escaping Boy A guilt, the prosecution counsel did not even have to go there summing up it was so tight. But his client believed in his own innocence despite it.

I find it difficult to believe Boy A felt he was innocent. If there was significant penalties for entering an innocent plea when the accused is very clearly guilty then his solicitor would most likely have given different advice.

gozunda · 25-06-2019 07:11PM

Road-Hog wrote: »

And corks most infamous of citizens Mr. graham Dwyer. Came for a totally respectable family by accounts and turned into an absolute abomination of a human........imagine if he had had access to the vile porn etc that boy A had....?

I'm not sure are you advocating free unrestricted access to porn for children or you are just taking the mickey there tbh...

That idea has already been dragged through the bog at least once before. From your previous post detailing the above - my reply

... we really dont know what Dwyer had access to or from where and in this case we are dealing with a child / teenager with evident links to online sadistic and violent pornography and sexual assault and murder.

Whatever the case - I doubt anyone would want their child exposed to that type of content - and take the risk.

LiamoSail · 25-06-2019 07:18PM

tuxy wrote: »

By his own conscience or by people out to harm him?

I'm not advocating any sort of vigilante behaviour or violence, but he should feel pressure regarding his family's deceit

gozunda · 25-06-2019 07:47PM

tuxy wrote: »

As said before I wish making a family endure such a long trial after suffering so much already had consequence.

As it stands it was probably their solicitors that recommended the not guilty plea because there was nothing to lose by doing so.

Not always true. In the case of the murder of a young child Vincent Blackwell by an older boy in Dublin in 1971 - a plea of manslaughter meant that there was no opportunity for Vincent’s family to find out in court what happened to Vincent and why. Something that haunts the family to this day.

https://www.rte.ie/radio1/doconone/2017/0127/848151-wheres-your-mamma-gone/

As to your second point - the two perpetrators lose the opportunity to admit what they did and offer a sincere apology to the Kreigel family. Though to expect that from those two little scotes would be step to far imo

Road-Hog · 25-06-2019 08:39PM

gozunda wrote: »

I'm not sure are you advocating free unrestricted access to porn for children or you are just taking the mickey there tbh...

That idea has already been dragged through the bog at least once before. From your previous post detailing the above - my reply

Free unrestricted access to porn for children ......definitely the way to go alright.....

I can’t understand how you could come up with that from previous posts?

Is it just down to Boy A being unlucky with the genes he inherited......... was there way that he could have been prevented from evolving into the monster he became and what he ended up doing to the poor girl.....was there any style of parenting that could have ‘saved him’.......?

FFred · 25-06-2019 08:55PM

FFred wrote: »

<SNIP>

Play the ball, not the man

dudara

.

gozunda · 25-06-2019 09:30PM

Road-Hog wrote: »

Free unrestricted access to porn for children ......definitely the way to go alright.....I can’t understand how you could come up with that from previous posts?

From the sarcasm that somehow watching extreme porn is completely benign even for kids

Road-Hog wrote:

And corks most infamous of citizens Mr. graham Dwyer. Came for a totally respectable family by accounts and turned into an absolute abomination of a human........imagine if he had had access to the vile porn etc that boy A had....?

And this in a thread detailing how a 13th year old having in his possession large amounts of extreme porn and apparently acting out some of those fantasies ...

Road-Hog wrote:

Does watching excessive amounts of violent porn not de-sensitize your attitude towards it........is it possible to become addicted to porn including violent porn and leave what you see on the screen and never be tempted to act out with a female what you see in the porno....?

Road-Hog wrote:

Is it just down to Boy A being unlucky with the genes he inherited......... was there way that he could have been prevented from evolving into the monster he became and what he ended up doing to the poor girl.....was there any style of parenting that could have ‘saved him’.......?

The porn and unfettered internet access certainly didnt help.

TCDStudent1 · 25-06-2019 10:01PM

tuxy wrote: »

May 14th 2021 was doomsday possibly in a satanic calendar the boy had created the only reference to that date and satanic calendar online links to this case. It's not mentioned anywhere else.

Strange, the Irish Times article states that the guard put the date into google and was directed to a satanic site mentioning the May 14th date.

tuxy · 25-06-2019 10:06PM

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Strange, the Irish Times article states that the guard put the date into google and was directed to a satanic site mentioning the May 14th date.

Ah yes I found it now the site is www.satansrapture.com a very crude retro style site created in 2002 or maybe even earlier. Odd coincident I'd say.

Monumental · 25-06-2019 10:48PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I assume anyone criticizing the parenting skills of boy B's father for supposedly not caring what was going on when the garda was in his house the night Ana disappeared, will be equally as critical of Patric Kriegel. After all, he let Ana go off with a 13 year old boy whom he did not know & he did not know where they were going. Geraldine on the other hand, knew instantly that she should not have been with that boy. If Geraldine were at home at the time boy B called, Ana would be alive now. Why was Geraldine so much more in tune with Ana's life than Patric?

OMG cannot believe this has just been posted ,shame on the poster ! Ana's parents share no blame in this horredous crime .

mrjoneill · 25-06-2019 11:37PM

tuxy wrote: »

I find it difficult to believe Boy A felt he was innocent. If there was significant penalties for entering an innocent plea when the accused is very clearly guilty then his solicitor would most likely have given different advice.

We don't do plea bargaining in the RoI but what happens is the trial judge at sentencing takes it into account when factoring for sentencing. Even for Boy A there would be some redeeming factor for his abominable crime if he pleaded guilty and apologized but he didn't. While convicted of murder under the Childrens Act, the trial judge can determine the sentencing. I would also see it as a factor when their sentence review take place if such is determined or the Parole Board Review, that these accept they did the crime. Boy A has absolutely no case whatsoever he did the actual killing over a protracted period and for Boy B its my belief and the jury that he was an accomplice to it being a smart ass.

GooglePlus · 25-06-2019 11:42PM

Monumental wrote: »

OMG cannot believe this has just been posted ,shame on the poster ! Ana's parents share no blame in this horredous crime .

Agree. When I was 13, I was getting up to a lot worse than hanging around with the opposite sex of the same age. How the hell are young kids suppose to mature if they don't.

The poor girl just fell into the hands of the wrong type, if it wasn't her it would have been someone else.

holyhead · 25-06-2019 11:59PM

Any idea that her parents are culpable for what happened to Ana is simply bonkers. She was the victim of two teenage sadists. I cannot imagine what would possess two boys to inflict such sickening and deadly brutality on this poor girl. How do evil people like these two boys come about? Is it genetic, is it deprivation, is it lifestyle or a combination of factors.

Road-Hog · 26-06-2019 06:42AM

holyhead wrote: »

Any idea that her parents are culpable for what happened to Ana is simply bonkers. She was the victim of two teenage sadists. I cannot imagine what would possess two boys to inflict such sickening and deadly brutality on this poor girl. How do evil people like these two boys come about? Is it genetic, is it deprivation, is it lifestyle or a combination of factors.

Genetically unfortunate coupled with poor or indifferent parenting and added to by unrestricted access to the internet giving access to all sorts of violent porn sites which allows people who have sick/vile interests to link and hook up with like minded type monsters and thereby comforting themselves into believing that they are not odd/sick/perverted or warped’ and further fueling their obsessions and twisted desires.

....... · 26-06-2019 08:22AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I assume anyone criticizing the parenting skills of boy B's father for supposedly not caring what was going on when the garda was in his house the night Ana disappeared, will be equally as critical of Patric Kriegel. After all, he let Ana go off with a 13 year old boy whom he did not know & he did not know where they were going. Geraldine on the other hand, knew instantly that she should not have been with that boy. If Geraldine were at home at the time boy B called, Ana would be alive now. Why was Geraldine so much more in tune with Ana's life than Patric?

You make a lot of ignorant, disgusting posts on boards.ie but this is a new low for you.

If you could rein in your attention seeking desire to "shock-jock" for a minute and consider that you are talking about two real people who have lost their child to brutal murderers. Two real people who may see this thread and your disgusting false assumptions about them.

Have a bit of respect.

Kidchameleon · 26-06-2019 08:27AM

splinter65 wrote: »

As Ana’s brother was able to identify that boy b was another pupil at the school who he could name, yes, with conditions as to a return time I think she probably would.

Geraldine instantly knew Ana should not have been out with B. She was worried as soon as she heard. This is in all of the reports. I dont think she would have let Ana out with B.

dudara · 26-06-2019 08:35AM

A reminder to all posters that efforts at doxxing or identifying other users is not permitted per Boards Terms of Use

dudara

Road-Hog · 26-06-2019 08:52AM

....... wrote: »

You make a lot of ignorant, disgusting posts on boards.ie but this is a new low for you.

If you could rein in your attention seeking desire to "shock-jock" for a minute and consider that you are talking about two real people who have lost their child to brutal murderers. Two real people who may see this thread and your disgusting false assumptions about them.

Have a bit of respect.

How could her dad Patric or indeed any parent be expected to know the potential danger that she was in by letting her wander off with boy B......he may have thought it showed progress in development of her social skills.....who knows.........I’m sure he has been torchering himself about it since......it’s not like we have boy A and B type murders happening on a regular basis...?

iamwhoiam · 26-06-2019 09:53AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Geraldine instantly knew Ana should not have been out with B. She was worried as soon as she heard. This is in all of the reports. I dont think she would have let Ana out with B.

This line of posting is speculative and wrong .If you don't see that then you need to be reminded . You do not get to speculate about other peoples decisions or thoughts .Anas family do not deserve to be speculated about or indeed be even spoken about in such a way . Shame on you

IvoryTower · 26-06-2019 10:15AM

I think we also shouldn't be speculating about boy b's father as well tbh

splinter65 · 26-06-2019 10:36AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Geraldine instantly knew Ana should not have been out with B. She was worried as soon as she heard. This is in all of the reports. I dont think she would have let Ana out with B.

If only the judge and jury had known that Ana’s father was actually to blame for Ana being dead then we’d have been spared the cost of these two boys trial, and boy bs father wouldn’t have had all the upset and inconvenience of being told, erroneously according to you, that he’s raised a wicked malevolent child.
Any more thoughts on the online petition I suggested?
Are the victims of the tinder rapist also to blame for going out for a good night, incidentally?

Suckit · 26-06-2019 10:56AM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Geraldine instantly knew Ana should not have been out with B. She was worried as soon as she heard. This is in all of the reports. I dont think she would have let Ana out with B.

So you have come to the conclusion, because the two parents would have had a different view on what to do next when that boy called - that the father is to blame for her death?
And you claim that you are not being obtuse?

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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