Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 05:13PM

Calltocall wrote: »

That response is very big of you, I wonder if you lost someone in circumstances like Ana to two animals would you say the same thing, no, you wouldn’t, .

If I found myself in that position I would hope I would act rationally. Some posters here have openly admitted they would have no problem becoming murderers in that situation. That is not me... like I have said, all three familys in this tragic case have been destroyed

Calltocall wrote: »

boys b father should be ashamed of himself, instead of being a parent and making his son confess his crime he entertained his sons bull**** charade trying to throw the guards off until his lies eventually entrapped him and he couldn’t weasel out, then the father lashes out at the guards for doing their job for catching his murderer son, a great father indeed.

He is a decent parent IMHO, supporting his child under any circumstances. That is the job a good parent, unconditional love. As I have said, he is probably regretful of his outburst but because of the mob mentality he will never be able to publicly express that regret.

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 05:15PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I see what you are doing on this thread and I for one will not bite

Thats fine I dont want to start a war. Look, there are three familys destroyed this week. Someone needs to speak up for the two forgotten ones here. There are posts on this thread saying A & B's familys should be punished, that is just not acceptable

KathleenGrant · 23-06-2019 05:23PM

I have experience of KidChameleon in anther thread. He is either a troll, totally lacking in empathy or worse (I won't say what or I could be banned) Don't even bother engaging with him/her.

tayto lover · 23-06-2019 05:25PM

It’s disgusting how anyone can troll in a thread like this.

Road-Hog · 23-06-2019 05:33PM

Did I read that one of the defense barristers put forward a scenario to the jury that the sexual interaction between boy A and Ana may have been consensual......,? Such a warped and clutching st straws argument....how could they bring themselves go on record of saying such a thing in front of a jury and the court given the extent of gruesome injuries that the poor girl received.......I just can’t understand how some pompous wigged huffing and puffing ‘me lurd’ arrogant barrister would have the neck to come out with something like this.

Road-Hog · 23-06-2019 05:35PM

tayto lover wrote: »

It’s disgusting how anyone can troll in a thread like this.

‘Chameleon’ being part of his/her pseudo- name is a dead give away of troll activities......!!

mrjoneill · 23-06-2019 05:48PM

Road-Hog wrote: »

Did I read that one of the defense barristers put forward a scenario to the jury that the sexual interaction between boy A and Ana may have been consensual......,? Such a warped and clutching st straws argument....how could they bring themselves go on record of saying such a thing in front of a jury and the court given the extent of gruesome injuries that the poor girl received.......I just can’t understand how some pompous wigged huffing and puffing ‘me lurd’ arrogant barrister would have the neck to come out with something like this.

I don't recall that but Boy B in the video interviews state Ana raised her hands for Boy A to strip her. Gardai quickly put that to bed telling him her clothes were violently ripped off her.

Hannibal_Smith · 23-06-2019 05:52PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Thats fine I dont want to start a war. Look, there are three familys destroyed this week. Someone needs to speak up for the two forgotten ones here. There are posts on this thread saying A & B's familys should be punished, that is just not acceptable

No. There is one family destroyed. The family of Boy A and Boy B still have their sons. They can still talk to them, see them and comfort them. Ana's family can do none of that.

What Boy A and B brought on their families may have caused their families suffering and anguish, but its nothing compared to what the Kreigels are suffering through.

Your daughter attacked, beaten, killed and left in a horrible abandoned house, like she was a piece of meat. I can't think of a worse thing to happen to a family.

mrjoneill · 23-06-2019 05:53PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Thats fine I dont want to start a war. Look, there are three familys destroyed this week. Someone needs to speak up for the two forgotten ones here. There are posts on this thread saying A & B's familys should be punished, that is just not acceptable

The victim is Ana and her family. Ana was innocently led to her death by 2 who put themselves in that position. As for their respective families they obv gave no consideration of that when they did the crime.

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 05:56PM

Hannibal_Smith wrote: »

No. There is one family destroyed. The family of Boy A and Boy B still have their sons. They can still talk to them, see them and comfort them. Ana's family can do none of that.

What Boy A and B brought on their families may have caused their families suffering and anguish, but its nothing compared to what the Kreigels are suffering through.

Your daughter attacked, beaten, killed and left in a horrible abandoned house, like she was a piece of meat. I can't think of a worse thing to happen to a family.

Totally agree with you there, the Kreigels situation is far far worse. Where we would disagree though is I would consider having my son/brother/grandson locked up for life as well as the stigma of his actions to be a symptom of a destroyed family.

8-10 · 23-06-2019 05:58PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I can fully understand and forgive B's dad's outburst in the courtroom. It must have been a gruelling process for him aswell.

He said:

“Innocent kid in f***ing prison,” “Are you proud of your victory?”

When you say you fully understand his outburst, do you think he was saying the kid was innocent because of the stress of the gruelling process and he's well aware that his son is guilty?

Or do you think that he genuinely believes his son didn't do it?

dudara · 23-06-2019 05:59PM

tayto lover wrote: »

It’s disgusting how anyone can troll in a thread like this.

Road-Hog wrote: »

‘Chameleon’ being part of his/her pseudo- name is a dead give away of troll activities......!!

Knock off the accusations of trolling in thread. Use the Report Post function to bring it to mod attention. And bear in mind that contrary opinion to your own may not automatically equal trolling.

dudara

mrjoneill · 23-06-2019 06:00PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

If I found myself in that position I would hope I would act rationally. Some posters here have openly admitted they would have no problem becoming murderers in that situation. That is not me... like I have said, all three familys in this tragic case have been destroyed

He is a decent parent IMHO, supporting his child under any circumstances. That is the job a good parent, unconditional love. As I have said, he is probably regretful of his outburst but because of the mob mentality he will never be able to publicly express that regret.

I don't agree, that is in the support of wrongdoing. Good parents stand on right no matter the circumstances. Giving support to their offspring does not include support for criminality.

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 06:01PM

Road-Hog wrote: »

Did I read that one of the defense barristers put forward a scenario to the jury that the sexual interaction between boy A and Ana may have been consensual......,? Such a warped and clutching st straws argument....how could they bring themselves go on record of saying such a thing in front of a jury and the court given the extent of gruesome injuries that the poor girl received.......I just can’t understand how some pompous wigged huffing and puffing ‘me lurd’ arrogant barrister would have the neck to come out with something like this.

I dont remember reading that but I would not be surprised if it is true. It is the job of any barrister to do everything to get their client off the hook. It is an essential element of any functioning legal system - the right to a defense. Calling them a "pompous wigged huffing and puffing ‘me lurd’ arrogant barrister" is not fair however. Look, I'm sure they know their client was guilty, but it is their duty to anything and everything to help their client. Its a tough gig, hence the heft pay packet. I personally would not have the neck to do it but I respect those who do. They are there to make sure justice is served fairly - a pretty honorable duty IMHO.

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 06:05PM

8-10 wrote: »

He said:

“Innocent kid in f***ing prison,” “Are you proud of your victory?”

When you say you fully understand his outburst, do you think he was saying the kid was innocent because of the stress of the gruelling process and he's well aware that his son is guilty?

Or do you think that he genuinely believes his son didn't do it?

Honestly I don't know what was going through the poor mans head in that situation. I don't think any of us will ever find ourselves in such a horrible situation thankfully. The dad could genuinely think his son is innocent of murder but guilty of a lesser crime. So saying he is an "innocent child" is possibly not an inaccurate statement from his perspective.

Hannibal_Smith · 23-06-2019 06:07PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Totally agree with you there, the Kreigels situation is far far worse. Where we would disagree though is I would consider having my son/brother/grandson locked up for life as well as the stigma of his actions to be a symptom of a destroyed family.

If they admitted what they did and had some sort of remorse about it, maybe I might agree. But they have done neither.

Hannibal_Smith · 23-06-2019 06:09PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Honestly I don't know what was going through the poor mans head in that situation. I don't think any of us will ever find ourselves in such a horrible situation thankfully. The dad could genuinely think his son is innocent of murder but guilty of a lesser crime. So saying he is an "innocent child" is possibly not an inaccurate statement from his perspective.

I don't remember hearing the Kreigels standing up and shouting at anyone in the court?

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 06:14PM

Hannibal_Smith wrote: »

If they admitted what they did and had some sort of remorse about it, maybe I might agree. But they have done neither.

The thing is, with all of the justice mob waiting with baited breath for any info on them, the family simply cannot publicly state anything. If people calmed down, accept that justice has and will be done by the state, perhaps the family's of A and B would be free to show their sympathies. Members of B's family have reportedly been attacked already.

Hannibal_Smith wrote: »

I don't remember hearing the Kreigels standing up and shouting at anyone in the court?

The Kreigels handled themselves with great dignity. I really admire them.

gozunda · 23-06-2019 06:20PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Totally agree with you there, the Kreigels situation is far far worse. Where we would disagree though is I would consider having my son/brother/grandson locked up for life as well as the stigma of his actions to be a symptom of a destroyed family.

Its not a competition.

The parties who committed this crime had a choice (boy A and boy B)which the victim didn't.

That choice carrys the penalty of incarceration. That is the penalty for the murder of an innocent girl. The family of those convicted need to acknowledge that and not pretend they are the ones offended against.

Hannibal_Smith · 23-06-2019 06:23PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

The thing is, with all of the justice mob waiting with baited breath for any info on them, the family simply cannot publicly state anything

.

The father stood up and roared at the court

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 06:26PM

gozunda wrote: »

The family of those convicted need to acknowledge that and not pretend they are the ones offended against.

What avenue(s) do you think is available to them (if any) should they wish to acknowledge it?

Kidchameleon · 23-06-2019 06:28PM

Hannibal_Smith wrote: »

The father stood up and roared at the court

As far as I know, the court does not give a platform to family's of the accused to make statements. Yes, it is well publicized that B's father lost control of himself, he is human after all.

pablo128 · 23-06-2019 06:30PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

What avenue(s) do you think is available to them (if any) should they wish to acknowledge it?

They could go around and knock on the Kriegels door and offer their apologies. They could ask the local priest to apologise on their behalf. They could make a public statement through their solicitor while still remaining unnamed.

Plenty of options. But in my opinion they should have apologised as soon as their killer sons were convicted.

jobbridge4life · 23-06-2019 06:30PM

Can an admin/mod over this thread please PM me? I have been ignored now for several days straight.

mikemac2 · 23-06-2019 06:31PM

Road-Hog wrote: »

I just can’t understand how some pompous wigged huffing and puffing ‘me lurd’ arrogant barrister would have the neck to come out with something like this.

Nobody ever says my lord, that’s the Brits. Wigs are not common these days and were not used by anyone even the judge in this case

Arrogance, well you don’t become a barrister lacking confidence for sure

You had a point but kinda ruined it by judging the entire profession. Coming up with theories and fighting is what they get paid to do

Hannibal_Smith · 23-06-2019 06:32PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

As far as I know, the court does not give a platform to family's of the accused to make statements. Yes, it is well publicized that B's father lost control of himself, he is human after all.

The court allows a platform for the accused to tell the truth. Neither boy did.

You say the family cannot publicly say anything. The father could speak up when he wanted. When it was his son affected.

Sardonicat · 23-06-2019 06:34PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

As far as I know, the court does not give a platform to family's of the accused to make statements. Yes, it is well publicized that B's father lost control of himself, he is human after all.

No more human than the parents of Ana. Despite their grief and despite listening to the horrific evidence and despite sitting through video of one of their daughter's killers referring to her as a weirdo who wore slutty clothes they managed to control themselves.

There is no reason the parents of the boys could not manage to do the same. It was a very telling outburst.

gozunda · 23-06-2019 06:36PM

Kidchameleon wrote: »

As far as I know, the court does not give a platform to family's of the accused to make statements. Yes, it is well publicized that B's father lost control of himself, he is human after all.

There is being human and having some sense of common decency and decorum in a court. The father of boy B refused to accept the ruling of the court and that alone is within his remit.

However he went out of his way to abuse the Gardai and others. Imo he should have been charged with contempt of court. Instead the judge left this gratuitous outburst unsanctioned.

If the boys father has a grievance with regard to his 'innocent boy' then an appeal is open to him. Not the screaming of unfounded abuse and bile in a court of law.

To do what he did in front of the Kreigels was inexcusable.

KathleenGrant · 23-06-2019 06:42PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

No more human than the parents of Ana. Despite their grief and despite listening to the horrific evidence and despite sitting through video of one of their daughter's killers referring to her as a weirdo who wore slutty clothes they managed to control themselves.

There is no reason the parents of the boys could not manage to do the same. It was a very telling outburst.

Agree. If a child of mine spoke of another person in that manner. talking about *slutty clothes* and showing her figure or calling them a "freak"and "weirdo" I would be gutted. I would never, ever refer to them as innocent if they spoke of another person as disposable or lacking of worth. And I would most likely be by their side in a court (because my child would need support) but I could never defend them.

Road-Hog · 23-06-2019 06:47PM

mrjoneill wrote: »

I don't recall that but Boy B in the video interviews state Ana raised her hands for Boy A to strip her. Gardai quickly put that to bed telling him her clothes were violently ripped off her.

Quote below from Irish times lengthy summary of the trial.......

The barrister also alluded to the idea that Boy A and Ana engaged in consensual sexual activity. Glenwood House was probably used by young people for “romantic trysts”, given the presence of condom wrappers on the ground, he said. Pathology evidence showed injuries to Ana’s genitals, but it couldn’t be established if these occurred through nonconsensual activity.

Counsel added that it “can’t be ruled out” that a neck swab taken from Ana showing male DNA did not result from “casual intimacy”

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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