Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

MrFresh · 19-06-2019 11:13AM

Dontfadeaway wrote: »

This is why I said he didn't help himself and wasn't very smart when he described her.

Boy B basically convicted himself. The Gardaí interviewing him did a fantastic job.

nehemiah · 19-06-2019 11:14AM

Feisar wrote: »

Nothing at all about being hard, I want them removed from society, if we had the tech to freeze them forever like in Minority Report that'd be grand. Unfortunately we don't, solitary till they die seems cruel, bullet is really the best option for everyone. A poster above goes on about rehabilitation to ensure they don't re-offend. If only there was a way to ensure this...

There's no way to ensure rehabilitation, in the same way that there is no way to ensure that every murder conviction is 100% correct, which is why the death penalty was removed in the first place.

FWIW, the recidivism rate in Ireland is at it's lowest amongst prisoners convicted of homicide. Can't find exactly the number of convicted murderers that kill again after being released but I would imagine it's very low. I'm sure it has happened (and I'm sure my ignorance will be highlighted pretty quickly) but it's much lower than the average recidivism rate.

TheAsYLuMkeY · 19-06-2019 11:14AM

I dont go along with the want to execute these two murderers, although my first instinct was to think to take them out and shoot them.

For crimes like this, i think life should mean life.

They should spend the rest of their time imprisoned and should never have the opportunity to experience a 'normal life', they have taken someone else's life intentionally and in the most cruel and horiffic way.

Life imprisonment.

theguzman · 19-06-2019 11:16AM

Grayson wrote: »

We would be hanging innocent people at some point. As someone said already the birmingham 6 and guildford 4 would have been killed. Every year there are people on death row in the Us who are exonerated because new evidence is found or old evidence is reassessed because of new technology.

Trump called for the death penalty in the Central park jogging case. In that case all 5 guys were exonerated when another guy came forward and confessed and they linked him to the crime through DNA. If the death penalty had've been used then that would be 5 innocent boys who would have been killed.

The tiny amount of innocents who would die is a small price to pay to kill these people and the amount of lives the death penalty would save is far in excess of any innocent who may die. With modern methods it is highly unlikely that such mistakes would be made. Line them up and hang them and no thirty years on death row, hanging should be done within 1 week of sentencing.

RiCriostoir · 19-06-2019 11:16AM

Dontfadeaway wrote: »

This is why I said he didn't help himself and wasn't very smart when he described her.

I know, but to hear this a from 13 year old boy is scary...

gimli2112 · 19-06-2019 11:17AM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you would also be executing more innocent people.

probably not it just takes longer to execute innocent people at the moment

super_furry · 19-06-2019 11:17AM

theguzman wrote: »

The tiny amount of innocents who would die is a small price to pay to kill these people and the amount of lives the death penalty would save is far in excess of any innocent who may die.

Bull****. One wrongly executed innocent person is too high a price to pay.

blackwhite · 19-06-2019 11:18AM

joe40 wrote: »

I'm in no way defending boy B, but I was always under the impression you had to actually commit the murder to be found guilty.

Is there any evidence that boy B was in any contact with Ana during her murder? Did he take part in the actual act?

I know he lured her there and witnessed the act and so definitely guilty of a crime.

Obviously the judge and legal teams know a lot more about the law than me but this aspect has confused me.

Again not defending anyone just confused about trial.

Involvement in the planning or execution of the crime is the same under the law as the person who actually committed the act.

Google Freddie Thompson and his conviction for the murder of David Douglas

nehemiah · 19-06-2019 11:18AM

theguzman wrote: »

The tiny amount of innocents who would die is a small price to pay to kill these people and the amount of lives the death penalty would save is far in excess of any innocent who may die. With modern methods it is highly unlikely that such mistakes would be made. Line them up and hang them and no thirty years on death row, hanging should be done within 1 week of sentencing.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/04/us/record-number-of-false-convictions-overturned-in-2015.html

A record 149 people in the United States were found in 2015 to have been falsely convicted of a crime, and of those, nearly four in 10 were exonerated of murder, according to a report released on Wednesday.

The review by the National Registry of Exonerations said the inmates had spent more than 14 years behind bars on average, with some serving more than three decades.

Small price to pay

GreeBo · 19-06-2019 11:18AM

super_furry wrote: »

Bull****. One wrongly executed innocent person is too high a price to pay.

What about the innocent people murdered by released murderers?

Allinall · 19-06-2019 11:18AM

theguzman wrote: »

The tiny amount of innocents who would die is a small price to pay to kill these people and the amount of lives the death penalty would save is far in excess of any innocent who may die. With modern methods it is highly unlikely that such mistakes would be made. Line them up and hang them and no thirty years on death row, hanging should be done within 1 week of sentencing.

It is truly worrying that I might be sharing the same society as this idiot.

weldoninhio · 19-06-2019 11:18AM

super_furry wrote: »

So you'd have been happy with the Birmingham Six and the Guildford Four being executed?

They weren't guilty of anything. The British knew they were not guilty of anything, but omitted evidence. Do you think A & B were framed?? To what end??

alroley · 19-06-2019 11:19AM

theguzman wrote: »

The tiny amount of innocents who would die is a small price to pay to kill these people and the amount of lives the death penalty would save is far in excess of any innocent who may die. .

WTF???

optogirl · 19-06-2019 11:19AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

just to be clear

your point about how people should be allowed to express themselves on message boards depends upon equating the premeditated sexual assault and brutal murder of a 14 year old girl with the phrase something you "dont agree with/like"

just to be clear, like

No, as you know very well I was not equating the two. I was suggesting that a culture of aggression may have contributed to these boys skewed view on life.

super_furry · 19-06-2019 11:19AM

GreeBo wrote: »

What about the innocent people murdered by released murderers?

Who said anything about releasing them?

Fan of Netflix · 19-06-2019 11:19AM

I know they're being named and photos shared etc. Not sure I agree with that personally, it's illegal, it won't bring Ana back. Very possible the two convicted have innocent brothers and sisters also. They would have done nothing wrong but their life is going to be hell. I could even see cousins of these people being caught up in this. The mob mentality of hunting their families could have unintended consequences. Already incorrect pictures of other boys are being shared.

super_furry · 19-06-2019 11:20AM

weldoninhio wrote: »

They weren't guilty of anything. The British knew they were not guilty of anything, but omitted evidence.

They were found guilty of terrorism and murder. At the sentencing of the Birmingham Six, the judge bemoaned that the death penalty wasn't an option to him and if it was, they'd have been executed.

ohnonotgmail · 19-06-2019 11:21AM

gimli2112 wrote: »

probably not it just takes longer to execute innocent people at the moment

and the ones found innocent after multiple appeals? what about them? they're just collateral damage?

Woke Hogan · 19-06-2019 11:21AM

The people frothing at the mouth and rubbing their legs at the idea of executing or torturing these two boys need to realise that they're part of the problem regarding violence in society.

Grayson · 19-06-2019 11:21AM

theguzman wrote: »

The tiny amount of innocents who would die is a small price to pay to kill these people and the amount of lives the death penalty would save is far in excess of any innocent who may die. With modern methods it is highly unlikely that such mistakes would be made. Line them up and hang them and no thirty years on death row, hanging should be done within 1 week of sentencing.

Mistakes are made. Even with modern methods. And you've basically said you're ok with someone innocent being killed. That's messed up.

ohnonotgmail · 19-06-2019 11:22AM

weldoninhio wrote: »

They weren't guilty of anything. The British knew they were not guilty of anything, but omitted evidence. Do you think A & B were framed?? To what end??

If capital punishment existed in the UK at the time they would have been executed.

19-06-2019 11:22AM

optogirl wrote: »

No, as you know very well I was not equating the two. I was suggesting that a culture of aggression may have contributed to these boys skewed view on life.

i know only what you posted

the gaps you left open for rhetorical effect are better filled in imo

theguzman · 19-06-2019 11:22AM

nehemiah wrote: »

There's no way to ensure rehabilitation, in the same way that there is no way to ensure that every murder conviction is 100% correct, which is why the death penalty was removed in the first place.

FWIW, the recidivism rate in Ireland is at it's lowest amongst prisoners convicted of homicide. Can't find exactly the number of convicted murderers that kill again after being released but I would imagine it's very low. I'm sure it has happened (and I'm sure my ignorance will be highlighted pretty quickly) but it's much lower than the average recidivism rate.

super_furry wrote: »

Bull****. One wrongly executed innocent person is too high a price to pay.

The move away from the Death Penalty worldwide was driven by Left Wing politicians since their murdering supporters kept getting executed for their crimes. Franco, Mussolini, Pinochet etc. all executed thousands of communists for their attempts to overthrow civil society. The Left would rather society become Somalia rather than bring back the Death Penalty because they know Conservatives will gladly use it against them.

The UK will bring back the death penalty with a hard brexit looming and free of Brussels law you can see hanging being restored there in the next ten years.

Dontfadeaway · 19-06-2019 11:22AM

RiCriostoir wrote: »

Dontfadeaway wrote: »

This is why I said he didn't help himself and wasn't very smart when he described her.

I know, but to hear this a from 13 year old boy is scary...

Yeah it's very disturbing

Bigbagofcans · 19-06-2019 11:23AM

RiCriostoir wrote: »

I know, but to hear this a from 13 year old boy is scary...

Not surprising unfortunately. Most 11 year olds have watched inappropriate material on the net and have seen countless videos where women are degraded and described as s**ts.

Young innocent minds being corrupted and thinking this is how we treat women.

weldoninhio · 19-06-2019 11:24AM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you would also be executing more innocent people.

How often do we have a crime like this one in Ireland?? There is literally zero chance it wasn't these two scumbags. Unless you think they have been framed??

super_furry · 19-06-2019 11:24AM

theguzman wrote: »

The move away from the Death Penalty worldwide was driven by Left Wing politicians since their murdering supporters kept getting executed for their crimes. Franco, Mussolini, Pinochet etc. all executed thousands of communists for their attempts to overthrow civil society. The Left would rather society become Somalia rather than bring back the Death Penalty because they know Conservatives will gladly use it against them.

Ahh right, I see now, you're a bit touched.

Good to know.

rgace · 19-06-2019 11:24AM

Somedaythefire wrote: »

Do you not see the irony in this?

Like imprisoning somebody for the crime of false imprisonment or fining somebody for stealing money?

yourdeadwright · 19-06-2019 11:24AM

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Capital punishment doesn't work because you have years and years of appeals in the US. You have people sitting on Death Row for 20 years.

If you limited it to one appeal and that was it, it would have a greater impact.

If you didn't have the appeals do you know In the last 10 years how many innocent people would have executed ? I don't know how many got off on appeal.

They reckon 4% of death row inmates are innocent that's means one in 25 that are killed are innocent,

In the states from 2008 - 2018 374 people where executed ,
That is 15 innocent people who where executed not to mention the ones who got off because of appeal

Feisar · 19-06-2019 11:25AM

Woke Hogan wrote: »

The people frothing at the mouth and rubbing their legs at the idea of executing or torturing these two boys need to realise that they're part of the problem regarding violence in society.

The hugs and kisses brigade need to realize that they're part of the problem regarding violence in society.

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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