Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

The Constitutional Right to a Home

Options
135

Comments

  • Options
    #62
    Wabbit Ears
    Registered Users Posts: 3,042 ✭✭✭Wabbit Ears


    worst idea EVER


  • Options
    #63
    TuringBot47
    Registered Users Posts: 991 ✭✭✭TuringBot47


    I think Leslie Nielsen said it best...

    "so many go to bed hungry in this nation.
    Yet, cat food's full of tuna.
    I can't help thinking each time I go to the zoo
    and see those porpoises crammed into tiny tanks,
    what a waste that is.

    Butcher half of them now.
    Hundreds of pounds of dolphin meat that could be fed to cats,
    freeing up that tuna for our nation's hungry.

    So many are... cold, shivering in the night.
    I say take those cats and skin them.
    Use their fur to keep hundreds warm. "


  • Options
    #64
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Finland did a pretty good job

    https://www.theguardian.com/housing-network/2017/mar/22/finland-solved-homelessness-eu-crisis-housing-first
    How long does Finland pay social welfare for?


  • Options
    #65
    downtheroad
    Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭downtheroad


    TuringBot47 wrote: »
    The ones who don't work, or are only taxed at the lower rate of 20% are expecting all these things.

    While the people PAYING 50% tax don't get the benefits and have to fund their own house, health insurance, pension (including working until 68) etc..

    Get out your most recent payslip and divide the net pay by your gross pay. I guarantee it won't be 50%


  • Options
    #66
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    the_syco wrote: »
    How long does Finland pay social welfare for?
    the basic unemployment dole is €175 per week but you get much more if you have worked 26 weeks in the preceding 2 years (there by rewarding those who work more than those that dont - what a novel idea) but the payments reduce after the first 100 days.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #67
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,024 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    an education a roof over your head and some sort of basic healthcare

    after that its up to you


  • Options
    #68
    Infini
    Registered Users Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    The right to shelter is fine, we all know if theres a right to a house not only will it be abused but hard working people are the ones who get taxed to pay for those who are either too incompetent, too stupid or too lazy to get their act together or have destroyed themselves with drink and drugs to the point they'll never be able to function normally.

    Ive no problem with giving help where it is needed but it needs to be clear that it works both ways, you need to pull your own weight too people are getting tired of certain types who refuse to do anything to better themselves and expect others to give them a free ride in life.


  • Options
    #69
    dundalkfc10
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,719 ✭✭✭dundalkfc10


    Myself and my Girlfriend pay 25% of our weekley income on Rent, thats not including Bills, Motor Expenses, Insurance, Shopping, Childcare

    We would be far better off if she stops working or we say i have moved out.

    Think its time we do it, whats the point anymore having €50 a week between us when we could have far more disposable income without doing the right thing.


  • Options
    #70
    kowloon
    Registered Users Posts: 13,287 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    lazygal wrote: »
    Have we not learned by now to stop shoving stuff into our constitution.

    The three-fifths compromise for travellers might lead to trouble down the road.


  • Options
    #71
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Cabaal wrote: »
    People in Finland pay wayyyy more tax then Ireland.
    People in Ireland want solutions solved but are not prepared to pay for it, as such we can't copy Finland.

    Our tax burden on national average wage is approx 27%, by comparison Finland its 42%.

    so your strategy is "tax the poor" ... can't see that flying in socialist Ireland.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #72
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 2,078 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The Tetrarch wrote: »
    I see a Sinn Fein election poster with "Fighting for You".
    I thought they had stopped fighting.

    Give out free houses sounds good.
    Free houses and free cars sounds better.
    Free houses, free cars, free money even better.

    You mean like all asylum seekers get on landing in Ireland?


  • Options
    #73
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    The sinn fein pipe dream where a tenant can rent a home and then refuse to pay any rents and cannot ever be evicted because the tenant has a constitutional right to that home ,
    Like the 50/60 million owed in unpaid rents in social housing that they refuse to deal with because they don't want to make people homeless.
    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




  • Options
    #74
    Dick phelan
    Registered Users Posts: 2,958 ✭✭✭Dick phelan


    Why do people expect the government to take care of them? Like honestly be an adult and take care of yourself. We already have free education and healthcare which i would support but giving everyone a free house as well, piss off with that nonsense. As mentioned previously what we need is everyone to get the idea of owning a house out of their head. Buying nice apartments is the way forward. People thinking their entitled to a 4 bed with back garden give over.


  • Options
    #75
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,281 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    There is currently no specific law on the books that gives people a right to a home in Ireland.

    In 2014 The Constitutional Convention voted to have the right to housing...“expressly stated” in the Constitution.

    In 2017 the dail rejected a bill which sought to make housing a constitutional right.

    What say you, After Hours?

    What are the pros and cons? What difference would it make? What would be the attendant responsibility on the citizen on acquiring this new right? Would a right to a home be a right to a home in a preferred location?

    Would it force the government to build a rake of social housing? Would it force the government to increase taxes? Would it make any practical difference to our housing crisis or would it just be a platitude?

    A right to housing is already covered in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights but this came after our Constitution so i'm not sure how that works.

    It's one of the most moronic proposals ever


  • Options
    #76
    seasidedub
    Registered Users Posts: 234 ✭✭seasidedub


    I studied, lived and worked in Finland (in healthcare)and speak Finnish so I reckon im allowed weigh in here.

    Take home pay low-ish as taxes high, (nurses take home less than 2k basic) costs are high too although property tax was lower and car insurance nowhere near as bad as here. So are Irish people prepared to pay more tax? The Shinner lefties and P.B.P idiots refused water tax - a basic tenet of socialist systems.

    Childcare superb and cheap so working families benefit- but do Irish people want to pay for other people's kids? We're not "communal" types- we all want semis with walls and fences. Health is usually through work, if you are truly "public", long waits in the health centre. Or phone for an appointment which is in a week by which time you'll be better or dead....

    Housing first - these people, many with serious problems, didn't get 3 bed semis. In most cases it's a room of under 20m2 with a tiny kitchenette and mini shower/toilet. In a building where they are supervised. Trust me, no normal person would want to stay there - drink, drugs, awful issues. Police all the time. The way its made out doesn't reflect reality.


  • Options
    #77
    Wheeliebin30
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,593 ✭✭✭Wheeliebin30


    seasidedub wrote: »
    I studied, lived and worked in Finland (in healthcare)and speak Finnish so I reckon im allowed weigh in here.

    Take home pay low-ish as taxes high, (nurses take home less than 2k basic) costs are high too although property tax was lower and car insurance nowhere near as bad as here. So are Irish people prepared to pay more tax? The Shinner lefties and P.B.P idiots refused water tax - a basic tenet of socialist systems.

    Childcare superb and cheap so working families benefit- but do Irish people want to pay for other people's kids? We're not "communal" types- we all want semis with walls and fences. Health is usually through work, if you are truly "public", long waits in the health centre. Or phone for an appointment which is in a week by which time you'll be better or dead....

    Housing first - these people, many with serious problems, didn't get 3 bed semis. In most cases it's a room of under 20m2 with a tiny kitchenette and mini shower/toilet. In a building where they are supervised. Trust me, no normal person would want to stay there - drink, drugs, awful issues. Police all the time. The way its made out doesn't reflect reality.

    Excellent post.

    Nowhere in the world will you receive a shiny new house for doing absolutely nothing only Ireland.

    Yet we constantly here it’s a country for da rich rabble rabble.

    Such an immature nation when it comes to personal responsibility.

    Always someone else’s fault.


  • Options
    #78
    seasidedub
    Registered Users Posts: 234 ✭✭seasidedub


    AlanG wrote: »
    This is largely down to the instance up until recently of renting furnished apartments. In Germany most apartments don't even come with kitchen units yet alone furniture. You rent first and then you have to pay several thousand buy and plumb kitchen units. That is why many IKEA units are designed to be standalone rather than fitted kitchens.

    Exactly. And they "demontage" the kitchen and take it with them when they move. Try getting Irish people to get their heads around that!

    If you have to buy your own washing machine - you'd have to take care of it as your landlord would not be replacing it.......


  • Options
    #79
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    seasidedub wrote: »
    I studied, lived and worked in Finland (in healthcare)and speak Finnish so I reckon im allowed weigh in here.

    Take home pay low-ish as taxes high, (nurses take home less than 2k basic) costs are high too although property tax was lower and car insurance nowhere near as bad as here. So are Irish people prepared to pay more tax? The Shinner lefties and P.B.P idiots refused water tax - a basic tenet of socialist systems.

    Childcare superb and cheap so working families benefit- but do Irish people want to pay for other people's kids? We're not "communal" types- we all want semis with walls and fences. Health is usually through work, if you are truly "public", long waits in the health centre. Or phone for an appointment which is in a week by which time you'll be better or dead....

    Housing first - these people, many with serious problems, didn't get 3 bed semis. In most cases it's a room of under 20m2 with a tiny kitchenette and mini shower/toilet. In a building where they are supervised. Trust me, no normal person would want to stay there - drink, drugs, awful issues. Police all the time. The way its made out doesn't reflect reality.
    really informative thanks for that. good to get a more realistic take on the nordic utopia we constantly hear about.

    re the irish left and water charges - you couldnt make it up could you.


  • Options
    #80
    Taylor365
    Registered Users Posts: 2,994 ✭✭✭Taylor365


    Deleted User wrote: »
    so your strategy is "tax the poor" ... can't see that flying in socialist Ireland.
    No no no... not TAX the poor, KILL the poor.




    It's time we pumped gas into Lidl.


  • Options
    #81
    Cryptopagan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 419 ✭✭Cryptopagan


    seasidedub wrote: »
    The Shinner lefties and P.B.P idiots refused water tax - a basic tenet of socialist systems.

    How are water charges “a basic tenet of socialist systems”? Of course leftist parties were going to opposed a regressive water charges regime; that was inevitable.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #82
    Dohnjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 17,783 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    valoren wrote: »
    Of course there will be costs but private citizens who by whatever machination find themselves without shelter can be catered for. I think there are 514 registered homeless people in Cork City. I'm sure it won't cost billions to shelter them.

    Add a zero to that number if you start offering housing (depending on quality of course)


  • Options
    #83
    seasidedub
    Registered Users Posts: 234 ✭✭seasidedub


    Cryptopagan wrote: »
    How are water charges “a basic tenet of socialist systems”? Of course leftist parties were going to opposed a regressive water charges regime; that was inevitable.

    Every single country in Europe which has the things we aspire to : decent healthcare, state day care, cheap student accommodation etc, all the tenets of left/centre left politics have water charges. I've lived in 3 EU countries and always paid for water. I'm trying to point out the idiocy of the left in Ireland- they want to give people this and that, but balk at charging for it. You can't have it both ways.


  • Options
    #84
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,907 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    seasidedub wrote: »
    Every single country in Europe which has the things we aspire to : decent healthcare, state day care, cheap student accommodation etc, all the tenets of left/centre left politics have water charges. I've lived in 3 EU countries and always paid for water. I'm trying to point out the idiocy of the left in Ireland- they want to give people this and that, but balk at charging for it. You can't have it both ways.
    They live with a delusion that a rich elite will pay for it.
    Simple policy to have because they know that there aren’t enough people mad enough to vote for them


  • Options
    #85
    65535
    Registered Users Posts: 789 ✭✭✭65535


    Oddly enough it is easily forgotten that we do actually pay a sizeable amount for water already.


  • Options
    #86
    suicide_circus
    Registered Users Posts: 19,802 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    seasidedub wrote: »
    Every single country in Europe which has the things we aspire to : decent healthcare, state day care, cheap student accommodation etc, all the tenets of left/centre left politics have water charges. I've lived in 3 EU countries and always paid for water. I'm trying to point out the idiocy of the left in Ireland- they want to give people this and that, but balk at charging for it. You can't have it both ways.

    youre wasting your time. water charges was their vietnam and they can never betray its memory.


  • Options
    #87
    seasidedub
    Registered Users Posts: 234 ✭✭seasidedub


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    They live with a delusion that a rich elite will pay for it.
    Simple policy to have because they know that there aren’t enough people mad enough to vote for them

    I shudder to think what would happen if they ever got into power. Leftist governments can and do work well in some countries, but our confederacy of dunces would bankrupt us in a nanosecond. Coppinger wanted to nationalise Dell and praised the Russian revolution (20 plus million starved to death, and the country is still reeling from the effects of forced displacement). Some fool is on the radio demanding 15e min wage and to take as many immigrants as want to come.....


  • Options
    #88
    Ipso
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    suicide_circus wrote: »
    youre wasting your time. water charges was their vietnam and they can never betray its memory.

    You don't know man, you weren't there man!


  • Options
    #89
    El_Bee
    Registered Users Posts: 933 ✭✭✭El_Bee


    The unrestricted pursuit of housing should be by all means, but free houses for all is just socialist garbage that will only add to the already disgusting culture of entitlement in this country.


  • Options
    #90
    Beasty
    Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 75,378 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    Maybe start offering one-way tickets to Finland to anyone who wants a right to a home?


    :pac:


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #91
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Constitutional right to a home with a constitutional obligation to relocate to wherever that home be ?


Advertisement