Patrick Quirke -Guilty

Minnie Snuggles · 03-05-2019 05:37PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

The fact that he was bangin another woman gave her every reason not to back him......strange behavior on her part.

Given how he treated his mother not signing her house over to her, basically keeping her dependant on him and the way he treated ML stalking her, reporting her to Tusla and all the other things he did to her. One would wonder what he could have put his wife through.

hairyprincess · 03-05-2019 05:40PM

I know of a man who was in court, for depraved act, shall we say. And his wife stood by him. The family were told by his legal team that it would look better to show a united front. His children, who were adults, also attended each day.

Kirby · 03-05-2019 05:41PM

Muahahaha wrote: »

I think his fear was that a new farmer taking over the lease might well start up the milking parlour again. If that happened then he would be using the run off tank and would have discovered the body.

Okay but surely the possibility of it being found is still better than the certainty of "finding" it yourself? It just seems like a terrible plan. If he was afraid of it being found, why not (a) Try to move the body or destroy the tank completely or (b) just fly to a foreign country and hide.

Both seem better options tbh.

KikiLaRue · 03-05-2019 05:42PM

Kirby wrote: »

Okay but surely the possibility of it being found is still better than the certainty of "finding" it yourself? It just seems like a terrible plan. If he was afraid of it being found, why not (a) Try to move the body or destroy the tank completely or (b) just fly to a foreign country and hide.

Both seem better options tbh.

Perhaps the guilt was getting to him?

BENDYBINN · 03-05-2019 05:44PM

KikiLaRue wrote: »

I'm amazed by the number of people who:

- think they know the facts of the case better than the jurors who spent 10 weeks listening and 20 hours deliberating, based on a few articles in the Indo?

- think they understand what circumstantial evidence is better than the jurors who had it explained to them in detail by a trial judge.

This was a well planned murder, and that's why there is no physical evidence.

- The Google searches could - taken alone - be an unfortunate coincidence
- His obsession with Bobby's girlfriend, his ex-lover, could be an unfortunate coincidence
- The face that he was one of a handful of people who knew about that tank could be an unfortunate coincidence
- That he 'found' the body just as his lease was up could be an unfortunate coincidence
- That he was late to milk the cows that day could be an unfortunate coincidence

That's just off the top of my head, no doubt there's loads more. You could explain away any of them taken alone. But at a certain point, you say 'that's too many coincidences'. And there you have reasonable doubt.

Not enough there to convict anyone of murder I’m afraid........if Mary Lowry did it and asked him for help to get rid of the body then all of the above would still be true

freshpopcorn · 03-05-2019 05:45PM

I don't know what quirke had doing for him apart from his money but maybe he was a charmer if you knew him.
He achieved a lot and threw it all away.

hairyprincess · 03-05-2019 05:46PM

Kirby wrote: »

Okay but surely the possibility of it being found is still better than the certainty of "finding" it yourself? It just seems like a terrible plan. If he was afraid of it being found, why not (a) Try to move the body or destroy the tank completely or (b) just fly to a foreign country and hide.

Both seem better options tbh.

Because of his ego. He didn’t for a moment believe he’d be a suspect.

Edgware · 03-05-2019 05:46PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

Not enough there to convict anyone of murder I’m afraid........if Mary Lowry did it and asked him for help to get rid of the body then all of the above would still be true

The jury who listened to all the witnesses thought different so your opinion doesn't really matter

BENDYBINN · 03-05-2019 06:04PM

Edgware wrote: »

The jury who listened to all the witnesses thought different so your opinion doesn't really matter

So did the jury on the Birmingham six the guilford four and Nicky Kelly to name but a few............Free pateen Quirke campaign starts here now!

Necro · 03-05-2019 06:19PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

Not enough there to convict anyone of murder I’m afraid........if Mary Lowry did it and asked him for help to get rid of the body then all of the above would still be true

And yet.... they somehow did :eek:

It's almost like they had more knowledge of the case than some random internet person.

Imagine that.

KikiLaRue · 03-05-2019 06:22PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

Not enough there to convict anyone of murder I’m afraid........if Mary Lowry did it and asked him for help to get rid of the body then all of the above would still be true

You're right, but I didn't sum up the entire trial in a few bullet points, did I?

If the case was this flimsy it would have been thrown out, or found not guilty. After 10 weeks listening and 20 hours deliberating, only 2 of the 12 jurors remained unconvinced.

They had access to Garda statements, pathologists, witness statements etc that you only got a brief summary of in the papers.

The attempt to somehow pin it on Mary Lowry when no one including Quirke himself has suggested there is any evidence she did it/ enticed him to do it is very distasteful.

'Pateen' got caught. He'll have to serve his time.

Edgware · 03-05-2019 06:26PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

So did the jury on the Birmingham six the guilford four and Nicky Kelly to name but a few............Free pateen Quirke campaign starts here now!

Campaign sponsored by Ann Summers

BENDYBINN · 03-05-2019 06:29PM

KikiLaRue wrote: »

You're right, but I didn't sum up the entire trial in a few bullet points, did I?

If the case was this flimsy it would have been thrown out, or found not guilty. After 10 weeks listening and 20 hours deliberating, only 2 of the 12 jurors remained unconvinced.

They had access to Garda statements, pathologists, witness statements etc that you only got a brief summary of in the papers.

The attempt to somehow pin it on Mary Lowry when no one including Quirke himself has suggested there is any evidence she did it/ enticed him to do it is very distasteful.

'Pateen' got caught. He'll have to serve his time.

Not trying to pin it on anybody...just sayin there are other possibilities
As for the jury havin access to all the evidence.....as mentioned already other juries in the past have got it horribly wrong
Free Pateen now

its_steve116 · 03-05-2019 06:31PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

Not trying to pin it on anybody...just sayin there are other possibilities
As for the jury havin access to all the evidence.....as mentioned already other juries in the past have got it horribly wrong
Free Pateen now

He ended a life, he got what he deserves.

KikiLaRue · 03-05-2019 06:36PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

Not trying to pin it on anybody...just sayin there are other possibilities
As for the jury havin access to all the evidence.....as mentioned already other juries in the past have got it horribly wrong
Free Pateen now

What makes you think he didn't do it?

He had an intense obsession with Lowry that was well documented - stealing her knickers (caught on camera), making a false accusation to Tulsa, the letter to the Sunday Indo. Very clear he wasn't stable. Mary Lowry by all accounts loved Bobby and was happy with him.

There are no other possibilities that have the same amount of evidence. He had a strong motive, the means and the opportunity. He left a damning trail of circumstantial evidence behind him that was convincing enough to persuade 10 of 12 jurors of his guilt.

brooke 2 · 03-05-2019 06:40PM

Calypso Realm wrote: »

Not if altered some aspects of his appearance (wore a hat etc) and took a more roundabout route through back-roads back to the farm. Chances of him being thus recognized are far, far higher if he was seen by others in his OWN car, a vehicle the locals would be familiar with! All that's required then is a few positive sightings at various points which would put him at the scene(s) and could prove his location/ whereabouts at a given time.

What struck me last night on Prime Time was the difference in appearance between the Patrick Quirke who was seen strutting into court and the Patrick Quirke who was filmed walking into the local garda station when he was originally arrested. The guy heading into court looked like a typical farmer you'd see at the mart, wearing his heavy coat and his inevitable c(y)ap, while the guy who was originally arrested was rather smartly dressed and appeared completely different without the cap.

By all accounts, Quirke was a bit of a financial wizard and is one of the top dairy farmers in the country. He presented a paper at one stage to a farmer's group re leveraging his assets. He told them that he and his wife, Imelda, had leveraged a lot of their assets and had bought stocks, shares and many properties, including some in Eastern Europe.

Sounds familiar! I'm guessing this may have been before the crash!! The timing of his beginning the affair with Mary Lowry was early 2008......some time after that he was asking her for €20,000 to pay off a debt. :rolleyes: Guess he was looking forward to 'leveraging' some of Mary Lowry's assets!! Poor Bobby Ryan was not to know how desperate he seemed to want to do so.

brooke 2 · 03-05-2019 06:44PM

RhubarbCrumble wrote: »

Imelda Quirke is the person who most deserves sympathy here.
In the space of a few years, she lost her son and her brother, discovered her husband was having an affair with her sister in law, and now, regardless of how she feels about him, she has pretty much lost her husband since he's now in prison.

Personally I don't know how that lady keeps going and she deserves a hell of a lot of credit.

She was also the person who had to ring the gardaí - admittedly, a friend. Quirke did not have the guts to do it himself.

BENDYBINN · 03-05-2019 06:47PM

KikiLaRue wrote: »

What makes you think he didn't do it?

He had an intense obsession with Lowry that was well documented - stealing her knickers (caught on camera), making a false accusation to Tulsa, the letter to the Sunday Indo. Very clear he wasn't stable. Mary Lowry by all accounts loved Bobby and was happy with him.

There are no other possibilities that have the same amount of evidence. He had a strong motive, the means and the opportunity. He left a damning trail of circumstantial evidence behind him that was convincing enough to persuade 10 of 12 jurors of his guilt.

He may well have done it.......the fact that it not proven beyond doubt bothers me .

brooke 2 · 03-05-2019 06:48PM

Vicarious Function wrote: »

Agree it's a possible scenario, Stacksofwacks. Personally, I don't think she would have the mental capability of living with that for two years. No offence meant to Mary L! I think it would be a very rare person, apart from P. Quirke, who would have the mental capability of living with that for two years.

Thought I read somewhere that she had been ringing him for three months afterwards.....she'd have hardly done so if she knew he was dead.

humberklog · 03-05-2019 06:56PM

Just saw a post saying Quirke's wife was Mary Lowry's sister in law? Is that right?

brooke 2 · 03-05-2019 06:58PM

monkeybutter wrote: »

he had a hold over her, but she still terminated the lease?

wah?

you are terminating the lease Mary? the bodys on the land, that would be the time to tell her for sure

the crazy thing is she was renting the farm out for 1600 a year, i mean wtf

My understanding was that she was paid €12,500 but Quirke had to pay her only €1,500 out of his own pocket as the remaining €11,000 was a subsidy he received from the government.

Spanish Eyes · 03-05-2019 07:00PM

humberklog wrote: »

Just saw a post saying Quirke's wife was Mary Lowry's sister in law? Is that right?

Mrs. Quirke was the sister of Mary Lowry's late husband.

Odelay · 03-05-2019 07:01PM

humberklog wrote: »

Just saw a post saying Quirke's wife was Mary Lowry's sister in law? Is that right?

Yep, his wife’s brother was Mary’s husband and pats best friend.... their kids are cousins.

KikiLaRue · 03-05-2019 07:03PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

He may well have done it.......the fact that it not proven beyond doubt bothers me .

You must have misunderstood the verdict.

He was found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

BENDYBINN · 03-05-2019 07:07PM

KikiLaRue wrote: »

You must have misunderstood the verdict.

He was found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

So it must be true then!

brooke 2 · 03-05-2019 07:12PM

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/patrick-quirke-evidence-4615606-May2019/

The bolded part is damning for me. The fact Bobby Ryan was naked I found to be bizarre. Quirke clearly knew he was before he "discovered" the body.

This did it for me too....that, and all the internet searches re body decomposition.

KikiLaRue · 03-05-2019 07:17PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

So it must be true then!

There is a very, very small possibility that it's a miscarriage of justice, but I don't see any evidence of that.

Tell me, how well do you know 'Pateen'?

Vicarious Function · 03-05-2019 07:28PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

So it must be true then!

Obviously, you have some doubt, BENDYBINN. As problably many others have too. But the fact is, you are not a member of the jury. You were not in court every day to hear and see the evidence. You were not in the jury room deliberating for three days. According to the verdict it is true beyond a reasonable doubt that P. Quirke is guilty of Murder. As a result he is now in Mountjoy Jail. That's the way the law works - like it or not!

03-05-2019 07:33PM

KikiLaRue wrote: »

There is a very, very small possibility that it's a miscarriage of justice, but I don't see any evidence of that.

A wrongful conviction is totally different in law to a miscarriage of justice.

I think a lot of people feel as though this conviction, based on the burden of proof and the standard of evidence that should have been required, was wrong. Indeed, you might even credibly say it's frightening to think how such flimsy evidence could lead to a life-sentence.

It's quite premature for anyone to refer it as a miscarriage of justice, though; there hasn't even been an appeal yet.

McCrack · 03-05-2019 07:39PM

BENDYBINN wrote: »

He may well have done it.......the fact that it not proven beyond doubt bothers me .

*did do it

He has had a trial in due course of law and a jury has found him guilty after hearing the evidence for 13 weeks

Patrick Quirke -Guilty

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