Donald Trump is the President Mark IV (Read Mod Warning in OP)

mcmoustache wrote: »

Mueller is charging people for lying to congress? A lot of people should be getting worried now.

This has the potential of turn in to a massive house of cards scenario way bigger than Watergate.

I wonder will it? In ten years time will we be watching films about the collapse of a government after collusion with a foreign power.

I fear that 'America' will decide that it cannot take the embarrassment of the full goings on being exposed globally and it's infrastructure, political, judicial, intelligence and diplomatic will collectively try to bring it to a head with some token judgements and claims that everything has been accounted for while it has been swept under the carpet.

mcmoustache wrote: »

Mueller is charging people for lying to congress? A lot of people should be getting worried now.

Whitaker is the worst ever AG. Can't even halt a witch hunt. Sad!

mcmoustache wrote: »

We can laugh but Whitaker is an amateur who is only in the job because of loyalty to Trump. The DOJ is full of careerists and professionals. Not to mention, Mueller and his team knew well that Trump would pull such a move although they probably expected him to find someone more effective. An amateur like Whitaker is no match for an organisation full of professionals.

If things unravel like it's beginning to look they might, then watch the likes of Whitaker abandon ship at the speed of light. He might be out of his depth but he's not a fool.

...must quell feeling of optimism...

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Usually by now a newly registered member would come on this thread and tell is all about Trump's glorious achievements and how well he's doing, apropos of nothing...

I think that a lot of them have given up the ghost. The evidence is starting to get overwhelming.

It's funny when you think about the events of the past few years. Every new piece of evidence has been consistent with the theory that Trump was in bed with the Russians and has done what he can to obstruct justice since then. Even the Steele dossier is shaping up to have been quite accurate at this point.

On the other hand, the various narratives put forward by Trump fans have kept falling apart. One fan has conceded that there probably was collusion between Russians and members of the campaign but that Trump wouldn't have known about it so that's progress, I guess.

One thing that this has confirmed to me is that the so called "Fake News" media has been orders of magnitude more accurate than their mainstream right-wing counterparts. What I have learned from WaPo, NYT, BI, The Atlantic and other excellent publications has turned to agree well with reality. Had I been getting my news from FOX, Breitbart, Daily Caller etc, my information would be so unreliable that I'd probably be consistently making a tit of myself on line.

But then again, it should have been obvious that publications who compete on their accuracy and reputations and who have editorial standards in place to minimise mistakes would be more accurate than publications that exist only to confuse and instil fear in their audience.

Tell me how wrote: »

Agree, but even talking all that in to account.

If Trump was to run for President right now, I still think he could come close to winning.
The Democrats have been very weak in unearthing viable alternatives.

In the last week, I've read that Hillary is considering another attempt and also that John Kerry (74 years old) is also mulling over running in 2020 by which time he will obviously be 76.

Beto O'Rourke....;) he's yer man, watch this space heard it here first

Tell me how wrote: »

Agree, but even talking all that in to account.

If Trump was to run for President right now, I still think he could come close to winning.
The Democrats have been very weak in unearthing viable alternatives.

In the last week, I've read that Hillary is considering another attempt and also that John Kerry (74 years old) is also mulling over running in 2020 by which time he will obviously be 76.

I would respectfully, and utterly, disagree with you.

BTW - does the timeline show that Trump was still trying to make a deal with Russia after he was briefed on their attempts to interfere with the election?

everlast75 wrote: »

I would respectfully, and utterly, disagree with you.

I'd be happy for you to convince me I'm wrong.

He can rely on 40% of the vote straight out the gate. So too can the Democrat on the other side of course.

But, I wouldn't put it past them to manipulate things to influence the population. Things such as threat of terrorism, international conflict, immigration can get heavy news coverage at the whisper of a threat. Look at him sending the army to protect the country against the caravan before the mid-terms.
He has two very strong media drivers who will support him in Fox and the NRA (even though they aren't a media outlet).

I hope I am wrong but I was wrong in thinking there was no way he'd win in 2016 and as I said above, I don't think the democrats are setting a sufficient example of an alternative yet.

Trump spoke to press before getting on Air Force One for a trip to Argentina. Some interesting snippets:

Pres Trump calls Michael Cohen “a weak person” at the WH

Per WH pooler today @georgecondon, Trump just claimed he "passed" on the Trump Moscow deal.

President Donald Trump told reporters outside the White House that “Cohen is being a weak person and trying to get a reduced sentence so he’s lying about a project everyone knew about.”

Trump repeatedly says Cohen is lying, but then adds: "Even if he was right, it doesn’t matter because I was allowed to do whatever I wanted during the campaign."

Trump also expresses his sympathy for former campaign chair Paul Manafort while speaking to reporters. “It’s very sad what’s happening to Paul Manafort, he’s being treated very badly,” says Trump. He refused to rule out a pardon for Manafort yesterday.

Trump also said the only reason he hired Michael Cohen and kept him on payroll is because “a long time ago, he did me a favor.”

Source:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2018/nov/29/us-politics-michael-cohen-live-updates

So Cohen is lying, but everyone knew about the deal, Trump passed on the deal and he was allowed to do whatever during the campaign anyway. Trump also only gave Cohen significant and important roles in his campaign and as his personal lawyer because he once did Trump a favour. And Manafort is a good guy and doesn't deserve to be treated like a guilty person after having been found guilty and plead guilty.

Pelvis wrote: »

Best suggestion I've heard is a Biden/Beto ticket. They'd kill it. Biden has his age against him but he's in better shape than most 30 year olds!!

You wont get two white guys on the Dem ticket.

I'd go with Biden/Harris.

Biden V Trump would be box office. Really hope Biden runs as right now he is the only Democrat I could see having a really solid chance against Trump in 2020, especially in the debates.

everlast75 wrote: »

Nobody coming over to the dark side with me, thinking Trump won't be around politically in 2020?

I don't think he'd get the nomination.

everlast75 wrote: »

Nobody coming over to the dark side with me, thinking Trump won't be around politically in 2020?

I had a conversation with someone when he was being inaugurated who wanted to bet that he'd be gone by the end of 2017.

We see a very different narrative around and from a more objective position than many do in the states I reckon.

Penn wrote: »

I think staying as President for as long as possible is probably Trump's best chance of staying out of harm's way, as regardless of what Mueller finds or how strong the evidence is, Trump's lawyers will challenge whether a sitting President can be indicted, which will tie it up in the courts and likely all the way up to Supreme Court, and if the SCOTUS goes his way, staying as President will keep him from legal trouble, which could also help him try install people in departments which could lessen or eliminate any punishments he or his family face when he leaves office.

That is pretty much what I think his motivations are.
Losing the house will make it difficult for him over the next 2 years because they will try to show how they want to do something about it but I think holding on to the senate will be key for him in surviving at least until the end of this term.

everlast75 wrote: »

Nobody coming over to the dark side with me, thinking Trump won't be around politically in 2020?

I have a feeling he wont be around in any capacity.