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Biochar and natural farming

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    #182
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,658 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Say my name wrote: »
    Over in the motors forum they're a bit worked up over potential plans of mixing biodiesel with diesel to the rate of 10%.
    Seemingly a lot of diesel cars could be kaput if so.

    Over in the children and toddlers forum they're delighted with potential plans to increase our birthrate to bring us in line with the UK.

    Christ - when will this stupidity end!!?? They might as well mix the diesel with Orangutan blood!!


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    #183
    alps
    Registered Users Posts: 4,942 ✭✭✭alps


    How many litres of diesel are burned to make one litre of biodiesel?


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    #184
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,171 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Good article by Thomas Hubert in last week's IFJ on methane. Shows this area needs further research and a wider understanding of its role and mitigation. Belching cows may be shouldering too much of the fair burden, need more facts. This doesn't mean we don't move to minimise.


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    #185
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    Water John wrote: »
    Good article by Thomas Hubert in last week's IFJ on methane. Shows this area needs further research and a wider understanding of its role and mitigation. Belching cows may be shouldering too much of the fair burden, need more facts. This doesn't mean we don't move to minimise.
    Unfortunately Water John. The Irish eejits in government and from that people's assembly have influenced policy thinking and media reporting in this country in that farming is 'the big bad wolf' in this whole carbon debacle.
    It lets themselves off the hook of course to continue their motorway driving, latte drinking, two foreign holidays a year lifestyle.
    There's no other industry in Ireland that captures carbon but sure the mushrooms don't want or need to know that.


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    #186
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,658 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Say my name wrote: »
    Unfortunately Water John. The Irish eejits in government and from that people's assembly have influenced policy thinking and media reporting in this country in that farming is 'the big bad wolf' in this whole carbon debacle.
    It lets themselves off the hook of course to continue their motorway driving, latte drinking, two foreign holidays a year lifestyle.
    There's no other industry in Ireland that captures carbon but sure the mushrooms don't want or need to know that.

    We've wasted alot of time and money on this - thats assuming you think climate change is all about us and not quiet natural. In any case simple things like bog restoration, passive homes etc. make alot more sense economically/environmentally than attacking livestock farming or making our energy bills some of the highest in the EU!!


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    #187
    keryl
    Registered Users Posts: 286 ✭✭keryl


    Made some last year. It's supposed to go a long way per acre. If your turning trimmed hedges into biochar it's going back into the land.


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    #188
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    keryl wrote: »
    Made some last year. It's supposed to go a long way per acre. If your turning trimmed hedges into biochar it's going back into the land.

    Did you mix it with manure first before applying?
    Otherwise it'll work as a sponge and soak up your nitrogen and phosphorus in the soil away from your plants and you'll be cursing the b word. So I'm told...


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    #189
    keryl
    Registered Users Posts: 286 ✭✭keryl


    No only in small beds but yes it needs to be charged before applying. Really if your going to burn branches etc why not burn it and make it upgradable if you have the time and resources.


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    #190
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,709 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    Documentary on TG4 now about soil health.

    'When I was a boy we were serfs, slave minded. Anyone who came along and lifted us out of that belittling, I looked on them as Gods.' - Dan Breen



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    #191
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,709 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    ....

    'When I was a boy we were serfs, slave minded. Anyone who came along and lifted us out of that belittling, I looked on them as Gods.' - Dan Breen



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    #192
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    A Designers of Paradise podcast interview with Kathleen Draper, the U.S. director at Ithaka institute for carbon intelligence on the many uses of and developments in the world today of Biochar.

    https://rasa.ag/kathleen-draper-biocharmed/


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    #193
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,171 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Here is another researcher doing great work in looking at pollinators and alternatives to pesticides whilst increasing yield and profit.
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/nov/23/scientist-unveils-blueprint-to-save-bees-and-enrich-farmers


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    #194
    Suckler
    Registered Users Posts: 2,230 ✭✭✭Suckler


    Just spotted this in the Journal -

    https://www.farmersjournal.ie/soil-will-it-run-out-419612

    Edit - a small bit I pulled from it -

    Soil degradation

    Brennan explained how soil is being degraded faster than it is being replaced. Brennan also stressed how soil is not renewable source, at least not in a human lifetime.

    In the US, soil is degrading 10 times faster than it can be replaced while in China degradation is running 40% ahead of replenishment. Around 25bn tonnes of top soil is being lost every year and cannot be replaced easily.


    Globally, 33% of soil is estimated to be degraded to some degree, with only around 60 years' worth of topsoil left according to a recent UN FAR report.

    Fiona explained that by international standards, Irish soils are performing relatively well, but that we shouldn’t become complacent.


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    #195
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,709 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    Suckler wrote: »
    ......
    Fiona explained that by international standards, Irish soils are performing relatively well, but that we shouldn’t become complacent.

    Due to all the grazing land, no doubt. Just don't tell that to the vegan/global warming brigade.

    'When I was a boy we were serfs, slave minded. Anyone who came along and lifted us out of that belittling, I looked on them as Gods.' - Dan Breen



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    #196
    timfromtang
    Registered Users Posts: 560 ✭✭✭timfromtang


    Water John wrote: »
    Minister Bruton announcing plans to reduce CO2 tomorrow. Maybe its a unfair stat but 13t CO2/person Ireland, 8t CO2/person UK.
    Hope it has some positive ideas not just tax.




    When it comes to reducing carbon footprint, two cherries i suggest are,



    1. "storing more carbon in our soils "


    biochar, (preferentially produced using an energy recovery system to replace a portion of fossil fuel use)


    Forest management practice (continuous cover management stores a significantly larger carbon fraction in biomass and soil over time, clearfell management can lead to soil erosion and large releases of carbon from biomass and soil at clearfell)


    Grazing land mangement (......I have limited knowledge here and will allow others to contrbute if they wish........)


    etc


    2. "capturing more sunlight and increasing biomass volume"


    Biomass stores carbon, is made from carbon, etc... a field of grass can capture and use only a fraction of the sunlight that a forest can. The height of the canopy allows light to be harvested at different intensities all the way to the forest floor, when it comes to collecting sunlight for photosynthesis forest are super efficient.

    a field of grass is habitat for a wide variety of organisms in and on the soil, however a forest can support a much greater variety and volume of living organisms.


    just my opinions of course


    tim

    www.youtube.com/c/timfromtang

    Fuinseog abú



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    #197
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    This Twitter post has gotten a fair few interesting replies.

    Kieran Sullivan (@kieran_sullivan) Tweeted:
    If someone was so inclined to concentrate on improving the soil of their farm, where might that someone start? Is there anything resembling a set of guidelines or a 5-year “roadmap” available? https://twitter.com/kieran_sullivan/status/1065339010300686336?s=17


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    #198
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,658 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    Suckler wrote: »
    Just spotted this in the Journal -

    https://www.farmersjournal.ie/soil-will-it-run-out-419612

    Edit - a small bit I pulled from it -

    Soil degradation

    Brennan explained how soil is being degraded faster than it is being replaced. Brennan also stressed how soil is not renewable source, at least not in a human lifetime.

    In the US, soil is degrading 10 times faster than it can be replaced while in China degradation is running 40% ahead of replenishment. Around 25bn tonnes of top soil is being lost every year and cannot be replaced easily.


    Globally, 33% of soil is estimated to be degraded to some degree, with only around 60 years' worth of topsoil left according to a recent UN FAR report.

    Fiona explained that by international standards, Irish soils are performing relatively well, but that we shouldn’t become complacent.

    Its one the planets many natural resources like marine fisheries etc. that is taken totally for granted by too many with increasingly disastrous results:(


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    #199
    Eamonn8448
    Registered Users Posts: 135 ✭✭Eamonn8448


    timfromtang wrote: »
    When it comes to reducing carbon footprint, two cherries i suggest are,



    1. "storing more carbon in our soils "


    biochar, (preferentially produced using an energy recovery system to replace a portion of fossil fuel use)


    Forest management practice (continuous cover management stores a significantly larger carbon fraction in biomass and soil over time, clearfell management can lead to soil erosion and large releases of carbon from biomass and soil at clearfell)


    Grazing land mangement (......I have limited knowledge here and will allow others to contrbute if they wish........)


    etc


    2. "capturing more sunlight and increasing biomass volume"


    Biomass stores carbon, is made from carbon, etc... a field of grass can capture and use only a fraction of the sunlight that a forest can. The height of the canopy allows light to be harvested at different intensities all the way to the forest floor, when it comes to collecting sunlight for photosynthesis forest are super efficient.

    a field of grass is habitat for a wide variety of organisms in and on the soil, however a forest can support a much greater variety and volume of living organisms.


    just my opinions of course


    tim

    why not store it above our soils too Tim, look up hemp concrete and its ability and benefits to lock down carbon.
    i got no agenda here i dont burn charcoal or biochar , to me biochar is just carbon and ok i have a chemical background its always going to be element number 6 to me , next time i burn my toast ill post a pic of biochar/carbon lol:cool:


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    #200
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,709 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    If you look at a typical Irish landscape with all its hedge rows and cattle grazing in the fields, could we really be doing any more to trap carbon, apart from maybe planting the whole lot.

    'When I was a boy we were serfs, slave minded. Anyone who came along and lifted us out of that belittling, I looked on them as Gods.' - Dan Breen



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    #201
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    Kathleen T. Draper (@Biocharro) Tweeted:
    @CenusaBioenergy @BiocharMy New biochar & UN SDGs infographic for COP24! https://t.co/A05da8n7Au https://twitter.com/Biocharro/status/1066354701254443008?s=17


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    #202
    timfromtang
    Registered Users Posts: 560 ✭✭✭timfromtang


    Eamonn8448 wrote: »
    why not store it above our soils too Tim, look up hemp concrete and its ability and benefits to lock down carbon.
    i got no agenda here i dont burn charcoal or biochar , to me biochar is just carbon and ok i have a chemical background its always going to be element number 6 to me , next time i burn my toast ill post a pic of biochar/carbon lol:cool:




    lets do that as well?
    tim
    imho its an urgent problem

    www.youtube.com/c/timfromtang

    Fuinseog abú



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    #203
    timfromtang
    Registered Users Posts: 560 ✭✭✭timfromtang


    patsy_mccabe wrote: »
    If you look at a typical Irish landscape with all its hedge rows and cattle grazing in the fields, could we really be doing any more to trap carbon, apart from maybe planting the whole lot.




    Hi Patsy,


    I agree we already have a thriving healthy ecosystem on most of our lovely green island, and are already storing significant quantities of carbon in soil and biomass.


    Much of the rest of this big blue ball we all share is significantly more degraded. but missing our paris targets sucks a bit would you not agree?

    Most folk agree that unless we steeply reduce emissions now we condemn ourselves to extinction on an uninhabitable planet. Some Guy mcPherson et al would say its already too late.......



    The opportunity to sequester a portion of this carbon in a more robust form in soils exists with biochar, which I am led to believe will persist in soils for potentially a thousand or more years.
    Much of our biomass which is either composted (returns most of the CO2 to the atmosphere during the process) or burnt (ditto) could be converted to biochar (with a release of heat energy that can be harvested) and if subsequently added (correctly "charged/conditioned") to soils could sequester significant quantities of carbon whilst simultaneously improving nutrient storage capacity, soil microorganism populations, resilience and productivity.


    As a man who lives on the land i cannot force folk to stop makin merry wid the fossil fuels an fecking up the climate, i can't influence policy anywhere,,, but i can store more carbon in my soil, benefit from resilience productivity, waste heat etc, enjoy myself playing with fire etc etc...


    tim

    www.youtube.com/c/timfromtang

    Fuinseog abú



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    #204
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    Trials of tilling wood chips into soil for veg production.

    https://youtu.be/eFlgaPVTWwA


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    #205
    Birdnuts
    Registered Users Posts: 9,658 ✭✭✭Birdnuts


    patsy_mccabe wrote: »
    If you look at a typical Irish landscape with all its hedge rows and cattle grazing in the fields, could we really be doing any more to trap carbon, apart from maybe planting the whole lot.

    Restoring BNM bogs would make a huge dent plus assist with other issues like flooding etc.


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    #206
    yosemitesam1
    Registered Users Posts: 2,948 ✭✭✭yosemitesam1


    patsy_mccabe wrote: »
    If you look at a typical Irish landscape with all its hedge rows and cattle grazing in the fields, could we really be doing any more to trap carbon, apart from maybe planting the whole lot.

    Think of the amount of ditches and scrub that would have been there 50 years ago and large losses from soils that we can't see. Probably the potential for an extra 100t+ co2 storage per ha across the majority of intensive grass


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    #207
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    patsy_mccabe wrote: »
    If you look at a typical Irish landscape with all its hedge rows and cattle grazing in the fields, could we really be doing any more to trap carbon, apart from maybe planting the whole lot.

    I think yourself and myself need to get a read of Gabe Brown's new book. It seemingly is getting great reviews and advice on doing this.
    It's a change anyway from the simple "cows bad for the environment" brigade.

    That book I linked to lately on here (boards) about reducing carbon emissions had a few eminent vegans putting their final say on it before it was published. That's why reducing meat consumption was in the top ten but they had to include all the other cow based soil carbon reducers to bring some credence to the book. Unfortunately politicians only look to the top ten and sheeple somehow believe them.

    Link to interview with Gabe since the launch of the book.
    https://youtu.be/T1udreLpEw0


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    #208
    patsy_mccabe
    Registered Users Posts: 10,709 ✭✭✭✭patsy_mccabe


    I've watched some of Gabe Brown's lecture series already. :cool:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUmIdq0D6-A&t=2453s

    I really think there is something in it. What first opned my eyes to it all was years ago when at the ploughing championship in Stradbally. I was walking though the car parks /fields and I couldn't believe the condition of the soil. I couln't see any topsoil. It all looked like subsoil to me.....and this was supposed to me some of the best land in the country. Years of growing conventional crops (without animal manure) had depleted it all.

    'When I was a boy we were serfs, slave minded. Anyone who came along and lifted us out of that belittling, I looked on them as Gods.' - Dan Breen



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    #209
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    patsy_mccabe wrote: »
    I've watched some of Gabe Brown's lecture series already. :cool:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUmIdq0D6-A&t=2453s

    I really think there is something in it. What first opned my eyes to it all was years ago when at the ploughing championship in Stradbally. I was walking though the car parks /fields and I couldn't believe the condition of the soil. I couln't see any topsoil. It all looked like subsoil to me.....and this was supposed to me some of the best land in the country. Years of growing conventional crops (without animal manure) had depleted it all.
    You've kind of hit how I became interested in it. Well as a way to reduce costs and dependence on others too.

    I live in Wexford as many posters know and I've seen first hand the damage that setstocking sheep/drystock and tillage can do to land. All you end up with as you say is subsoil with a hell of a dependency on bought in fertilizers. Stop the fertilizer and nothing grows.
    But then most of the farmers in these areas don't know any different and "shur it's the soil is the problem" not the space between the two ears driving the latest 191 tractor bought with the sfp.

    But there are farmers in my area that have seen the light and I gladly say that Walter Furlong a prominent tillage farmer and his farm management team have been very proactive in their use of cover crops to bring their tillage land and rented tillage land back to life. They saw the writing on the wall years ago when their land was turning into concrete by their own actions.

    The biggest influence on soil and profitability is the space between those two ears.


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    #210
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    https://www.thesun.ie/news/3432325/fertility-irish-fields-fallen-farming/

    Teagasc are gradually getting there.

    Expect to see carbon and soil profiles mentioned in the next few years instead of buy more n and p and k.
    The mention of dung and slurry is stepping in the right direction. So at least biology is gradually being understood.
    Penetromotors will be used.


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    #211
    Say my name
    Registered Users Posts: 11,204 ✭✭✭✭Say my name


    The avalanche keeps coming.

    http://gisborneherald.co.nz/localnews/3668245-135/success-for-his-nitrogen-product?fbclid=IwAR29e41j16ndH06aXqPF7JDTKiBvMcG6ebadIkUoStsQdeESoqFk2Njg-Qs


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