Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

The_Kew_Tour · 31-10-2018 08:01PM

listermint wrote: »

Hysteria.

I suggest you look it up because I haven't said a tap that's hysterical.

Pointing out your obvious rage doesn't make something a hysterical statement.

Saying travellers are responsible for rural suicide.

Lol well.. as I said I suggest you look up hysteria perhaps hyperbole too.

It's you're the one raging. I'm alright with telling the truth

Spanish Eyes · 31-10-2018 08:02PM

blinding wrote: »

They need more of the Casey Vote /Message in Elections .

Rural law and Order Candidates is the only way this message is going to hit home .

It is not only rural areas that have crime, but I get your point that rural areas possibly experience more crime than urban areas. Quite vulnerable I would imagine, given the easy way to access fast motorways out. But that can apply to anyone with criminal intent. But many know it is Travellers but are not allowed to say it.

A Law and Order party. OK, I hope they have more success than FG the Law and Order party.

Enda Kenny lobbed in the ethnicity recognition, and fecked off to the sunset. I bet he is laughing his socks off now, as Travellers will love him for this. Clever of him and revenge is a dish best served cold.

tayto lover · 31-10-2018 08:03PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

If it is Martin Ward of Tuam well he comes across a wee bit more conciliatory than the Pavee Point "Racism is the root cause of everything " brigade.

I will give him the benefit of the doubt. He sounds OK and let's give him a voice and see what he has to say.

This is a recent article from IT. Shock horror, they allowed him to speak things, never spoken by Traveller rep groups up to now. But still, those who have concerns on the Settled side never seem to be able to speak. Anyway let's see..

"Mr Ward also believes that, regardless of the phrasing of Mr Casey’s remarks, the controversy has “brought to light concerns that people have around Travellers – and the belief that they are the bane of all things”.

“I think some of it was a protest vote and some maybe voted for him because they feel that Travellers are getting everything and others are voting because they feel he is saying the right thing. I do think it is very important that Travellers’ groups don’t get carried away. We need to look at it and examine it and address it in a positive way.”

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/tuam-it-s-important-traveller-groups-don-t-get-carried-away-1.3678861

It would be great if the IT movement took his advice on board and actually examined the situation. At least he's not another Collins who can only throw out the old "racist" rubbish. Pavee Point are doing nothing for Travellers.

RandomName2 · 31-10-2018 08:05PM

listermint wrote: »

I'd like you to explain to me in detail where I've defended travellers at all. Details please.

This is becoming really meta, and examples are all over the internet.

So the setup is that someone online believes that being a victim gives greater authority (that in itself is a head-scratcher) so they doll themselves up as such. They get really angry.. or pretend to.. and belittle their opponents.

Next they'll say that their opponents are feigning victim-hood, and have imaginary enemies, and are in fact, belittling them (or a specific group of people; or both).

Then they'll pick out a public persona

listermint wrote: »

You and anyone that voted for Mr chancer

.. that they can make the focus of hate, usually saying that they are shady, 'crooked' to quote Trump, or a charlatan. They'll say that everyone who disagrees with them is a supporter of this Emmanuel Goldstein figure, and then go onto say how anybody who supports that figure is a fool.

Has this line of debate started to have its day? I hope so. It's pretty tiresome, and I've seen it from many different people from all across the political spectrum in the last couple of years.

Oh yeah, listermint, your attempt at the baiting and faux outrage is alright, but doesn't have enough pathos. I think it would have been better if you'd kept it snappier, but repeating the same tactic over multiple pages made the formula a bit obvious in your case. Also the idea of someone lol'ing and being angry at the same time doesn't quite work.

listermint wrote: »

Ok let's continue to vilifiy people for the entire countries ills . We are all wrong in calling you out on your obviously superior knowledge

And this is too arch.

Spanish Eyes · 31-10-2018 08:10PM

tayto lover wrote: »

It would be great if the IT movement took his advice on board and actually examined the situation. At least he's not another Collins who can only throw out the old "racist" rubbish. Pavee Point are doing nothing for Travellers.

Casey did have a go at Pavee Point too, and quite rightly too IMO. They have had millions thrown their way for this and that, but I for one do not see any improvement in Traveller education, health, early marriage and misogyny etc. But I hope I am wrong.

Sadly, all bets are now off in this house for Martin Collins saying the R word within X seconds. Sigh. :P

Be interesting to see what Martin Ward has to say. I may not be able to watch live, so might rely on input from here if anyone is watching.

wexie · 31-10-2018 08:12PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Casey did have a go at Pavee Point too, and quite rightly too IMO. They have had millions thrown their way for this and that, but I for one do not see any improvement in Traveller education, health, early marriage and misogyny etc. But I hope I am wrong.

Ah, but see, Pavee point aren't there to try to improve anything, they're just defending the status quo, not to change or improve it in any way.

maxwell smart · 31-10-2018 08:30PM

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

Apparently its a different Martin, Martin Ward but I would say your bet is still safe with this chap.

Not sure how they can claim to understand voters concerns by censoring their views. That Niamh one might take the Casey side though maybe. The show has terrible guests otherwise it could be interesting .

Niamh Horan usually takes whatever the unpopular view on things is, not sure if she believes in any of them but I hope she does the same on the show.
Ciara 'Hmmmm Hmmmmm Hmmmmm, I'm not disagreeing with you' Kelly is a complete twat with a love for everything PC.
Martin Ward I haven't heard him before so look forward to that.
And lastly, Brendan O'Connor has no problem playing devils advocate.

Might be a good watch.......Or complete rubbish

Franz Von Peppercorn · 31-10-2018 08:35PM

hill16bhoy wrote: »

I see you're still trying to rationalise and justify racism by choosing to airbrush Peter Casey's racism from history.

To listen to you, one would think racism doesn't even count as "far right" now.

You’re presuming the conclusion about travellers being a race there. With more legitimacy we could call Irish speakers a race. Or much of the Dublin southside. (Old English).

Is there any reason why travelling sites are situated in the poorest places in Ireland. Particularly in Dublin, the halting sites are situated on the west and past the M50.

Which is the reason why much of the traveller gang violence against pensioners is rural (the access to the motorways), and it’s that violence that is curdling relationships.

Surely it’s not fair on deprived parts of Dublin or the country (Tipp town has an unemployment rate of 34%) to add to the deprivation by adding halting sites - nor fair on the travellers.

Some, if not most, of traveller deprivation is due to the environment and since few of the richest parts of Dublin have halting sites but have nevertheless the best resources, schools, libraries, facilities and (by their own admission) the best and least racist people it is surely incumbent on us to place all halting sites in the leafy suburbs. Resistance to this would clearly be racist.

maxwell smart · 31-10-2018 08:37PM

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

You’re presuming the conclusion about travellers being a race there. With more legitimacy we could call Irish speakers a race. Or much of the Dublin southside. (Old English).

Is there any reason why travelling sites are situated in the poorest places in Ireland. Particularly in Dublin, the halting sites are situated on the west and past the M50.

Which is the reason why much of the traveller gang violence against pensioners is rural (the access to the motorways), and it’s that violence that is curdling relationships.

Surely it’s not fair on deprived parts of Dublin or the country (Tipp town has an unemployment rate of 34%) to add to the deprivation by adding halting sites - nor fair on the travellers. Some, if not most, of the deprivation is due to the environment and since few of the richest parts of Dublin have halting sites but have nevertheless the best resources, schools, libraries, facilities and (by their own admission) the best and least racist people it is surely incumbent on us to place all halting sites in the least suburbs. Resistance to this would clearly be racist.

See your using logic here which is your first mistake when arguing against the lefties.

Franz Von Peppercorn · 31-10-2018 08:44PM

maxwell smart wrote: »

See your using logic here which is your first mistake when arguing against the lefties.

I’ll keep hounding him for an answer.

By the way we tend to judge people by what they do not what they say. Or we should. The Catholic Church preached sexual probity while buggering the choirboys and covering it up.

The priesthood of the leafy suburbs preaches anti racism but in its actions excludes halting sites from its own suburbs either by political action or by such a control over the mindshare that the idea is not even contemplated.

The leafy suburbs are racist.

(Here’s where the major halting sites in dublin are).

Tara Lawns, Belcamp Lane, Coolock, Dublin 17
North West Area:
St Margaret’s Park, St Margaret’s Road, Ballymun, Dublin 11
St Joseph’s Park, Dunsink Lane, Finglas, Dublin 11
South Central Area
St Oliver’s Park, Cloverhill Road, Clondalkin, Dublin 22

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:08PM

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

Criminal thugs who act with impunity and batter elderly people to a pulp do offend me
Its a bit worse than words, although it may not get a hashtag on twitter from your ilk

Name calling.

It's the classic go to of someone who can't articulate their points.

It's only exposing ignorance. So keep it firing.

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:15PM

RandomName2 wrote: »

This is becoming really meta, and examples are all over the internet.

So the setup is that someone online believes that being a victim gives greater authority (that in itself is a head-scratcher) so they doll themselves up as such. They get really angry.. or pretend to.. and belittle their opponents.

Next they'll say that their opponents are feigning victim-hood, and have imaginary enemies, and are in fact, belittling them (or a specific group of people; or both).

Then they'll pick out a public persona

.. that they can make the focus of hate, usually saying that they are shady, 'crooked' to quote Trump, or a charlatan. They'll say that everyone who disagrees with them is a supporter of this Emmanuel Goldstein figure, and then go onto say how anybody who supports that figure is a fool.

Has this line of debate started to have its day? I hope so. It's pretty tiresome, and I've seen it from many different people from all across the political spectrum in the last couple of years.

Oh yeah, listermint, your attempt at the baiting and faux outrage is alright, but doesn't have enough pathos. I think it would have been better if you'd kept it snappier, but repeating the same tactic over multiple pages made the formula a bit obvious in your case. Also the idea of someone lol'ing and being angry at the same time doesn't quite work.

And this is too arch.

Ah grand so feigning the victim is it ?

When you have to resort to name Calling in a debate,
Sorry horse it's not playing the victim it's pointing out name calling. You know, the stuff kids do in playgrounds when they cant the get words out

We're adults here so a bit of cop on is warranted.

Secondly you are outraged, your thanks brigade are outraged you've spent pages upon pages being more outraged than the last page.

This is great stuff because in your efforts to point out how liberals are constantly outraged your showing how your are a mirror of the people you hate.

Yes your right this is amusing.im not angry I'm laughing at it.

And then getting angry at journalists who's job it is to stir up the **** with topical pieces. Outrage tastic

Arrrggghh the pc world is out to get me and my supposedly conservative views. Why am I so attacked arrrrghhhhhhh

Spanish Eyes · 31-10-2018 09:15PM

The day that D4 equivalents have to experience the very issue they say we should NEVER question, is the day I will listen.

tayto lover · 31-10-2018 09:19PM

listermint wrote: »

Ah grand so feigning the victim is it ?

When you have to resort to name Calling in a dwbat.
Sorry horse it's not playing the victim it's pointing out name calling. You stuff kids do in playgrounds when they can get words out

We're adults here so a bit of cop on is warranted.

Secondly you are outraged your thanks brigade are outraged you've spent pages upon pages being more outraged than the page before it

This is great stuff because in your efforts to point out how liberals are constantly outraged your showing how your are a mirror of the people you hate.

Yes your right this is amusing.im not angry I'm laughing at it.

And then getting angry at journalists who's job it is to stir up the **** with topical pieces. Outrage tastic

Arrrggghh the pc world is out to get me and my supposedly conservative views. Why am I so attacked arrrrghhhhhhh

What is this gobbledegook.

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:21PM

I lived up the road from 2 halting sites. I spent my college years in part time work ejecting the local traveller kids from the retail store because they used to perform a distraction theft game.

I still don't have the level of outrage that people in here have . I have full experience of travellers.

It's evident many folks have nothing but ranty time on their hands blowing issues to epic proportions. It's quite sad really.

Pretending people with the opposite view point don't have experience of travellers is amusing.

Yours , bemused

Lister

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:23PM

tayto lover wrote: »

What is this gobbledegook.

It's evidently spell correction on a phone gone wrong.

Make you angry does it ?

Enough to start a thread about it ?

Edward M · 31-10-2018 09:31PM

listermint wrote: »

I lived up the road from 2 halting sites. I spent my college years in part time work ejecting the local traveller kids from the retail store because they used to perform a distraction theft game.

I still don't have the level of outrage that people in here have . I have full experience of travellers.

It's evident many folks have nothing but ranty time on their hands blowing issues to epic proportions. It's quite sad really.

Pretending people with the opposite view point don't have experience of travellers is amusing.

Yours , bemused

Lister

Read the first few lines.
If that's not testament to the overwhelming evidence of traveller crime being really high then your head is in the sand.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/disproportionate-number-of-travellers-in-prison-population-1.3263524?mode=amp

tayto lover · 31-10-2018 09:33PM

listermint wrote: »

It's evidently spell correction on a phone gone wrong.

Make you angry does it ?

Enough to start a thread about it ?

Sorry. I forgot schools were off.

Redneck Culchie · 31-10-2018 09:34PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

The day that D4 equivalents have to experience the very issue they say we should NEVER question, is the day I will listen.

Doubt Leo the Liar and his D4 cronies in Fine Gael have any experience dealing with travellers. These people live a very sheltered existence and every year seem to become more detached from the realities of ordinary people..

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:35PM

Edward M wrote: »

Read the first few lines.
If that's not testament to the overwhelming evidence of traveller crime being really high then your head is in the sand.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/disproportionate-number-of-travellers-in-prison-population-1.3263524?mode=amp

You missed the part where I had to throw out the same family who would come up from a housing estate non traveller. The eldest brother you could spot a mile off.

Is that not evidence of criminality across the board.

Criminals be criminals.

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:36PM

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

Doubt Leo the Liar and his D4 cronies in Fine Gael have any experience dealing with travellers. These people live a very sheltered existence and every year seem to become more detached from the realities of ordinary people..

Yeah your so right.

Leo having worked several years as a junior doctors in at James Street hospital .

Loving it up there in a sheltered existence.

Have you ever been in James hospital ?

Do you even know what you are talking about ?

Quality outrage.

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:37PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Sorry. I forgot schools were off.

Traffic was far lower last two days.

Delightful

Redneck Culchie · 31-10-2018 09:38PM

Over 50% of prisoners in Castlerea prison are travellers, it's actually majority traveller!

Yet according to the CSO there is only 30k travellers in this country. How can that be defended or explained

Spanish Eyes · 31-10-2018 09:39PM

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

Doubt Leo the Liar and his D4 cronies in Fine Gael have any experience dealing with travellers. These people live a very sheltered existence and every year seem to become more detached from the realities of ordinary people..

Just like our media so.

Where do people turn when they need to voice their concerns?

NIMAN · 31-10-2018 09:40PM

So the question is :

Are there so many travellers in prison because
a) they carry out more criminal acts, proportionally, than most normal members of society
b) because the state is racist against them and looking to jail them

Your answer will depend on which angle you approach this topic from.
Many people seem to think its (b), which I would find very hard to believe.

Galwayguy35 · 31-10-2018 09:40PM

Martin Ward was elected to the co council and was also the mayor of Tuam at one point, he's level headed enough and doesn't talk complete sh1te like John Connors and Martin Collins but I'd say he will still lay into Casey on this one.

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:42PM

Redneck Culchie wrote: »

Over 50% of prisoners in Castlerea prison are travellers, it's actually majority traveller!

Yet according to the CSO there is only 30k travellers in this country. How can that be defended or explained

I'd go out on a limb and say...

Em people won't employ travellers because they're travellers regardless of education.

I'd say that's some crack to be easily identifiable when you open your mouth.

But sure let's continue to get outaged and target them rather than thinking about how to break that cycle.

I know some youth groups are having very good success in places in meath but it needs to spread

Or

Out rage . Rant rant .

Bad travelers booooo

Edward M · 31-10-2018 09:43PM

listermint wrote: »

You missed the part where I had to throw out the same family who would come up from a housing estate non traveller. The eldest brother you could spot a mile off.

Is that not evidence of criminality across the board.

Criminals be criminals.

I can't disagree with your last sentence.
Fact is though, give the figures there, by far the most criminals per head of population come from a certain "ethnic" culture.
Take the percentage of travellers at 0.6% to get one tenth and over one fifth of prisoners.
That is genuine evidence of the point being made.
But of course its my fault all this is happening, being settled like.

Redneck Culchie · 31-10-2018 09:45PM

listermint wrote: »

Yeah your so right.

Leo having worked several years as a junior doctors in at James Street hospital .

Loving it up there in a sheltered existence.

Have you ever been in James hospital ?

Do you even know what you are talking about ?

Quality outrage.

Ah stop , I forgot good aul Leo man of the people, doctor of the travellers

I wonder do the travellers love Leo as much as he loves them. After all the travellers really love gay people ?

listermint · 31-10-2018 09:46PM

Edward M wrote: »

I can't disagree with your last sentence.
Fact is though, give the figures there, by far the most criminals per head of population come from a certain "ethnic" culture.
Take the percentage of travellers at 0.6% to get one tenth and over one fifth of prisoners.
That is genuine evidence of the point being made.
But of course its my fault all this is happening, being settled like.

Who said it's your fault.?

I didn't .

Travelers are not employable. Let's not sugar coat it.

Let's not pretend that is not the case.

Is it any wonder depression and and suicide is rampant when your told you are useless to society .

Great crack . I'd love it sign me up.

Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

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