Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

Calhoun · 22-10-2018 10:58PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

It's the go to tactic these days... We've seen the same with Brexit, and the migration crisis to name but two.

Rather than counter points they disagree with through rational argument and evidence to support their position, they throw their toys out of the pram and resort to petty insults.

<insert Principal Skinner "no, it's the children who are wrong" pic here>

I am no angel either to be fair, as the forum is a little bit more casual we are all guilty of indirectly implying things to arguments we don't agree with.

I just feel the labels of bigots and racist ect generally are used to shut down discussion and have a stigma that sticks.

McMurphy · 22-10-2018 11:00PM

Calhoun wrote: »

I am no angel either to be fair, as the forum is a little bit more casual we are all guilty of indirectly implying things to arguments we don't agree with.

I just feel the labels of bigots and racist ect generally are used to shut down discussion and have a stigma that sticks.

And homophobia allegations.

_Kaiser_ · 22-10-2018 11:04PM

Calhoun wrote: »

I am no angel either to be fair, as the forum is a little bit more casual we are all guilty of indirectly implying things to arguments we don't agree with.

I just feel the labels of bigots and racist ect generally are used to shut down discussion and have a stigma that sticks.

But that is indeed the point.. When unable to debate rationally and defend your position with logical, verifiable arguments, resort to insults and name calling.

If that doesn't work (as it never does), attempt to shut down the discussion entirely by provoking others to where they look like the bad guy.

Mission accomplished... Although thankfully, it seems that the majority are tired of being told what's "acceptable" or not, and are starting to say enough is enough.

Spanish Eyes · 22-10-2018 11:05PM

MDH will win, but in fairness the big question is for SF. Liadh Ni Riada is not moving anywhere in the polls AFAIS. But she is not alone there either. It is MDH for the win anyway no matter what.

Just wondered what to think. Casey has set the cat amongst the pigeons for sure, and fair play to him for making this election interesting. Will not impact on the result, but it has for sure given us all a bit of entertainment and debate.

Can you imagine this election if he hadn't said what he did, which was quite honest and truthful anyway. At least he said it.

Would have been so bloody boring. At least now we have a bit of craic coming our way. Even if MDH wins which he will, but it might not be the plain sailing he expected either!

Yer Da sells Avon · 22-10-2018 11:08PM

Omackeral wrote: »

I have done so before many times actually. Too many think criticism equals hatred/bigotry/racism. It doesn't.

I'm sorry, I was wrong to target that post at you specifically. I found it a bit frustrating that people had literally asked for examples of Travellers who keep their surroundings tidy, and then responded negatively when some examples were provided. But no, it was unnecessarily snippy of me.

_Kaiser_ · 22-10-2018 11:11PM

I wouldn't be so sure that MDH is as certain to win as he was a month ago, or even a week ago.

It's hard to gauge the true level of support Casey is getting in recent days given every mainstream party and media outlet is actively hostile to him (it was telling for example that after his interview on Newstalk breakfast this morning, the usual comment about a flood of texts from listeners was made.. But no indication as to the content of those texts).

It would certainly seem though from word of mouth and social media that there's been a big upswing in his favour. He may turn out to be a rallying point for those who have had enough of being told how rosy things are while they are struggling, and what they should even think, by the likes of Leo and his media cheerleaders.

Edward M · 22-10-2018 11:13PM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Well then maybe I didn't add, I found Casey's truthfulness refreshing, (especially when he called the others out on their " disingenuous-ness" ref a halting site on their doorsteps.

And I firmly believe that MDH is a shyster, who is merely milking the system, only in multiples of what the aforementioned average traveller would.

Casey and LNR were the only two candidates in the race imo.

But Casey just pipped her.

So it's a yes from me for Casey. Louie?

Was that the case from the beginning or just since Casey's recent statements?
I must admit to being tempted to give him my number 1, but on reflection, I think though his stance is tempting I won't give him my no 1 anyway.
LNR is also a non runner for me.
Because of her good work with pieta house I will be torn between JF and because I know him fairly well SG.
MDH is too old and I feel he has had his day and term, I was never fond of him politically anyway, so no vote from me again.
GD is not my cup of tea, so as to practice my right to vote, not because I believe there is any exemplary candidate, I will toss between JF and SG for 1 and 2 and stop there.

_Kaiser_ · 22-10-2018 11:16PM

Edward M wrote: »

Was that the case from the beginning or just since Casey's recent statements?
I must admit to being tempted to give him my number 1, but on reflection, I think though his stance is tempting I won't give him my no 1 anyway.
LNR is also a non runner for me.
Because of her good work with pieta house I will be torn between JF and because I know him fairly well SG.
MDH is too old and I feel he has had his day and term, I was never fond of him politically anyway, so no vote from me again.
GD is not my cup of tea, so as to practice my right to vote, not because I believe there is any exemplary candidate, I will toss between JF and SG for 1 and 2 and stop there.

The other candidates (including Gallagher who was seen as the main contender until a fortnight ago) must be going mad with the events of the last 2 weeks.

They've completely fallen off the radar - even in the media - for most people as the focus rapidly becomes Casey v Higgins

Edward M · 22-10-2018 11:21PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

The other candidates (including Gallagher who was seen as the main contender until a fortnight ago) must be going mad with the events of the last 2 weeks.

They've completely fallen off the radar - even in the media - for most people as the focus rapidly becomes Casey v Higgins

I'd like to see Casey in the dail, I d love to see the interactions between him and the bleeding hearts on the hard left, he could be a great voice against both them and some pathetic half arsed govt policies and budgets.
If I had him in my constituency for that, he'd get my vote.

FrancieBrady · 22-10-2018 11:25PM

Edward M wrote: »

I'd like to see Casey in the dail, I d love to see the interactions between him and the bleeding hearts on the hard left, he could be a great voice against both them and some pathetic half arsed govt policies and budgets.
If I had him in my constituency for that, he'd get my vote.

How do you know that?
He is aligned to the SDLP (at least he keeps sharing their tweets) we know what he thinks of travellers, he has some vague welfare criticisms, and the diaspora something something.

How do you know he has anything else to offer?

Idbatterim · 22-10-2018 11:26PM

Very defeatist Spanish eyes. Give him the vote. I think it could be close! I’ll be in tears of joy if he wins. A watershed moment for this banana republic!

gmisk · 22-10-2018 11:26PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

The other candidates (including Gallagher who was seen as the main contender until a fortnight ago) must be going mad with the events of the last 2 weeks.

They've completely fallen off the radar - even in the media - for most people as the focus rapidly becomes Casey v Higgins

That might be the focus in the media, but I think most people would be very surprised if he comes second at this stage...even a swing from 2 to maybe 12% would be pretty unlikely I would think. I think maybe 6 or 7% at most.
If he does I think that says more about the quality of opposition than anything, pretty embarassing field.

Idbatterim · 22-10-2018 11:27PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

How do you know that?
He is aligned to the SDLP (at least he keeps sharing their tweets) we know what he thinks of travellers, he has some vague welfare criticisms, and the diaspora something something.

How do you know he has anything else to offer?

That single comment is more than anything I’ve ever heard Bilbo contribute !

_Kaiser_ · 22-10-2018 11:29PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

How do you know that?
He is aligned to the SDLP (at least he keeps sharing their tweets) we know what he thinks of travellers, he has some vague welfare criticisms, and the diaspora something something.

How do you know he has anything else to offer?

Your (repeated!) attempts to marginalise him notwithstanding, I dare say he offers more than a career politician who seems to have gotten a bit too fond of his unexpected retirement plan (because remember, Gallagher pretty much had him beat last time before the twitter scandal).

I'd rather listen to Casey than another 7 years of smug, hypocritical intellectualism from the incumbent

FrancieBrady · 22-10-2018 11:31PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Your (repeated!) attempts to marginalise him notwithstanding, I dare say he offers more than a career politician who seems to have gotten a bit too fond of his unexpected retirement plan (because remember, Gallagher pretty much had him beat last time before the twitter scandal).

I'd rather listen to Casey than another 7 years of smug, hypocritical intellectualism from the incumbent

That is your perogrative and something you can look forward to.

Doesn't really answer the question I asked though.

Calhoun · 22-10-2018 11:31PM

I dunno as much as Casey has gotten allot of publicity, i think that going from 1% to beating MDH is a bit to far. I hope he gets the % to cover his expenses and to make a point but i dont think so.

mattser · 22-10-2018 11:33PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I cannot believe that poster is so prolific. But hey, it's his sad life. Who am I to judge, just find it amazing that someone has so much time to post. But hey, maybe others use his log in and do it for him also on shift. :pac:

Hello

_Kaiser_ · 22-10-2018 11:34PM

Calhoun wrote: »

I dunno as much as Casey has gotten allot of publicity, i think that going from 1% to beating MDH is a bit to far. I hope he gets the % to cover his expenses and to make a point but i dont think so.

No one thought Brexit would pass or Trump would be elected either remember.

(and for the usual suspects, no I'm not comparing him to Trump.. Just pointing out that there's a noticeable shift away from establishment politics in general these days)

Idbatterim · 22-10-2018 11:35PM

This is the best entertainment I’ve had since the 2016’s euros and I’ve been to Vegas since! Peter Casey #1. I barely ever drink midweek any more. I’ll be cracking open a beer watching this “debate” tomorrow. Hopefully when the going gets tough tomorrow , bilbo doesn’t just put on the ring and dissapear and we actually have a debate. Would be cheaper than the government jet though I suppose!

gmisk · 22-10-2018 11:37PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

No one thought Brexit would pass or Trump would be elected either remember.

(and for the usual suspects, no I'm not comparing him to Trump.. Just pointing out that there's a noticeable shift away from establishment politics in general these days)

They aren't really a comparison for a start they were only 2 options in those, here there are 6.
Also the Brexit polls and presidential polls were close at points.

pumpkin4life · 22-10-2018 11:37PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

This is the best entertainment I’ve had since the 2016’s euros and I’ve been to Vegas since! Peter Casey #1. I barely ever drink midweek any more. I’ll be cracking open a beer watching this “debate” tomorrow. Hopefully bilbo doesn’t just put on the ring and dissapear!

He has to:

Not pussy out and try to "appeal" to as many people as possible.

Not apologize.

Not try and play to the P.C crowd.

Speak the truth as he sees it.

If he does that, he'll do fine.

gmisk · 22-10-2018 11:39PM

pumpkin4life wrote: »

He has to:

Not pussy out and try to "appeal" to as many people as possible.

Not apologize.

Not try and play to the P.C crowd.

Speak the truth as he sees it.

If he does that, he'll do fine.

What percentage of the vote would you classify as fine for him?
I honestly don't see him getting much above 6 or 7%

_Kaiser_ · 22-10-2018 11:39PM

gmisk wrote: »

They aren't really a comparison for a start they were only 2 options in those, here there are 6.
Also the Brexit polls and presidential polls were close at points.

At this point, there are really only 2 candidates remaining

How close the final count will be remains to be seen of course, but if that Limerick newspaper poll posted earlier is anything to go by, it might not be the "sure thing" for MDH that everyone expected even a fortnight ago.

Idbatterim · 22-10-2018 11:41PM

gmisk wrote: »

What percentage of the vote would you classify as fine for him?
I honestly don't see him getting much above 6 or 7%

I havent spoken to one person who isn’t voting for him! The rest are a waste of a vote. I know I’m having a laugh at this, but the results of decades of only morons to vote for and populist spineless morons now. The cost and damage is too high...

gmisk · 22-10-2018 11:42PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

At this point, there are really only 2 candidates remaining

How close the final count will be remains to be seen of course, but if that Limerick newspaper poll posted earlier is anything to go by, it might not be the "sure thing" for MDH that everyone expected even a fortnight ago.

Who are the two you consider to be candidates?
If you are saying casey I honestly don't see it.
It would be a shock if he finished second...well to me anyway. Id think Sean Gallagher might scrape it.
Do you have a link to Limerick poll? Thanks

c.p.w.g.w · 22-10-2018 11:43PM

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

At this point, there are really only 2 candidates remaining

How close the final count will be remains to be seen of course, but if that Limerick newspaper poll posted earlier is anything to go by, it might not be the "sure thing" for MDH that everyone expected even a fortnight ago.

Limerick are more likely to be behind Casey.

I work in retail, and their are 5 people who when I see them coming. My job is to try and reduce how much stock I'm going to loose. But I will certainly lose stock and there is nothing I can do about it. No amount of security can watch groups who split up.

They all live out on Childers Road, and there are many other retailers who suffer when they get visited by these folks

pumpkin4life · 22-10-2018 11:44PM

gmisk wrote: »

What percentage of the vote would you classify as fine for him?
I honestly don't see him getting much above 6 or 7%

Don't know.

Presidential elections are harder to read because traditionally, people are way more flexible to changing their minds and the variance is higher. Read up on this yourselves. Mary Robinson was far from a shoe in prior to election for example.

People forget that Gallagher was about 10-15% ahead of Mickey D, prior to the frontline envelope incident.

It's weird because all these online polls (the liberal.ie, boards.ie, the limerick reader, politicalirish.com) have him winning the thing out right, and more than a few people I know said they're definitely voting for him.

I think he's going to lose, but he's going to do well.

And it's a good lesson if nothing else. Speak the truth and good shìt happens to you.

gmisk · 22-10-2018 11:45PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

I havent spoken to one person who isn’t voting for him! The rest are a waste of a vote. I know I’m having a laugh at this, but the results of decades of only morons to vote for and populist spineless morons now. The cost and damage is too high...

As a counterpoint.... I havent talked to anyone who is voting for him.
I think Michael D will get 55% plus, and he would likely be the most transfer friendly I would think.

FrancieBrady · 22-10-2018 11:45PM

pumpkin4life wrote: »

He has to:

Not pussy out and try to "appeal" to as many people as possible.

Not apologize.

Not try and play to the P.C crowd.

Speak the truth as he sees it.

If he does that, he'll do fine.

If Casey rises dramatically in the polls, he will become a focus. What I see happening is that he'll be forced to double down on his remarks and then we will see his skill as a debater.
And that is where it will get interesting because if he has explain himself more he has to start giving examples of what he means about all travellers being basically people who camp on other peoples land. All travellers with more rights than you or me.
Because the above are false, he faces the prospect of some heavy blows being landed and he is liable to say anything.

Or we will get the pathetic sounding retraction that wasn't a retraction before he had to take the weekend off. If he tries that, again he will take some heavy hits and again he will be liable to say anything. And a hero will show his feet of clay less than a week after achieving that status.

Big night for Peter.

gmisk · 22-10-2018 11:48PM

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

Limerick are more likely to be behind Casey.

I work in retail, and their are 5 people who when I see them coming. My job is to try and reduce how much stock I'm going to loose. But I will certainly lose stock and there is nothing I can do about it. No amount of security can watch groups who split up.

They all live out on Childers Road, and there are many other retailers who suffer when they get visited by these folks

So you have a problem with shoplifters I am sorry to hear that...but what has that got to do with the presidential election? Are you hinting that these are all travellers? ... And Casey winning is going to stop it happening?

Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

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