Better Call Saul Spoilers

Will I Am Not · 15-08-2018 08:10PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I personally think that he is brilliant as a conflicted soul, caught up in ever deepening circles. The scenes with his father are brilliant in that respect, neither willing to back down or even express themselves fully. He does fear very well too. His realisation of the mess he was in in the last episode was very well done.

Same. He’s not playing a straight out, emotionless psychopath. First time I ever encountered that actor, he actually was playing that role in a video game and he did it very well too. Probably still my favourite video game villain.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcXNFa0vREc

Unearthly · 15-08-2018 09:32PM

Lydia needs to shut up and give Mike his ID badge

Hector Savage · 16-08-2018 08:55AM

Say Your Number wrote: »

Given that Nacho's father is an honest hard working man, and is trying to get him to leave that life behind.

Breaking Bad
After Fring's 'You're mine now' at the end of the last episode the poor lad is f*cked

BB spoiler ?
What happened like that in BB?

gormdubhgorm · 16-08-2018 09:45AM

Hector Savage wrote: »

BB spoiler ?
What happened like that in BB?

I think he means that people who did not see breaking bad would not know which characters would survive and which would not.
I assume there is a growing band of them at this stage?
Would be interesting to get thier take on watching BCS first and BB second.

16-08-2018 09:58AM

Has anyone here not seen BB?

The Black Oil · 16-08-2018 11:42AM

Great to see Kim take the gloves off.

Remind me to make photocopier noises and reference Jaws 3D in my next job interview.

Mr. Incognito · 16-08-2018 12:35PM

I really loved that episode.

1. Kim really really loves Jimmy. That scene on the couch with her watching him was done beautifully. They way she has his back against Howard and his brother. Its a deep selfless love.

2. Jimmy loves Kim. He is up early, hitting the road for jobs.

3. This episode was a turning point for me. He had a chance to do an honest job. He was admiring the figures. He was knowledgable and pushed hard for the job. His rant to them was his internal moral compass going off turning on them, calling them smucks. It took me a while to figure it out. He is dehumanising them so he can rip them off. Its their fault for being "mugs" that he can rob from.

4. He is now on the phone to Mike to rob them. It will be interesting to see what Mike does. He no longer needs the money. Will Jimmy try and do the job and bungle it or give the figurene to Kim as a gift and then she discovers its stolen?

optogirl · 16-08-2018 12:47PM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

I really loved that episode.

1. Kim really really loves Jimmy. That scene on the couch with her watching him was done beautifully. They way she has his back against Howard and his brother. Its a deep selfless love.

While I like the fact that they are together, there is always some niggle in my head wondering what is really in it for her? He just doesn't seem like someone she would fall for. I don't doubt her motives at all - she is a thoroughly good person by all accounts but they just seem like a very odd couple. Not to say odd couples don't exist but there is something just off about the chemistry between them.

Tony EH · 16-08-2018 01:23PM

I'm not sure anyone really loves anyone in 'Better Call Saul'. Everyone has an angle. Maybe Kim does love Jimmy, but I'm not seeing it back in any terms that I recognise. And Jimmy is a grifter. He's a real scumbag. He may have a bit of charm and the gab in spades. But, he's a dirtbag.

In fact, there's not one person on the show that I would describe as a happy person. Everyone's life is pretty miserable and seemingly without much mirth.

The only one who I can see that's involved in anything approaching a loving relationship is Mike, his daughter-in-law and her kid, who Mike dotes on. But, even Mike spends most of his on screen time in pug faced misery.

Everyone's lives on the show are kind of horrible.

Mardy Bum · 16-08-2018 03:30PM

optogirl wrote: »

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

I really loved that episode.

1. Kim really really loves Jimmy. That scene on the couch with her watching him was done beautifully. They way she has his back against Howard and his brother. Its a deep selfless love.

While I like the fact that they are together, there is always some niggle in my head wondering what is really in it for her? He just doesn't seem like someone she would fall for. I don't doubt her motives at all - she is a thoroughly good person by all accounts but they just seem like a very odd couple. Not to say odd couples don't exist but there is something just off about the chemistry between them.

There are only rare moments of intimacy between the pair which adds to the strange feeling. She feels a great sympathy for him which will soon leave her when she realises that he is morally corrupted.

Slydice · 16-08-2018 10:45PM

Damn! :eek:

ButtersSuki · 16-08-2018 11:02PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Has anyone here not seen BB?

I have a neighbour who's never seen a single episode of either BB or BCS. Today he asked me which one should he start with..........and it was an interesting question. I told him to do BB first as intended; but maybe if BCS was fully completed and not someway through its as yet undetermined no. of episodes and the series complete it might have been BCS first and do the whole thing chronologically.

ButtersSuki · 16-08-2018 11:09PM

Just on the Jimmy and Kim thing....I think part of the problem is she's too good-looking for Jimmy and when we see them as a couple, it just doesn't add up. Throw in their career progression routes etc. and I think it makes it even less likely. We're preconditioned not to see a woman like her as being in love with Jimmy. If anything you'd think she'd be more of a match with Howard - good looking, successful etc. as the slimeball is.

Dare I say if they had picked a less attractive actress it would be a much more credible relationship? She's way out of Jimmy's league and he's punching way above his weight.

Also, I don't think anyone has suggested this and if I'm being honest even I myself think it's unlikely but instead of them breaking up and her moving on with her life elsewhere how about the possibility that she dies or is killed? Jimmy's eventually going to start to get involved with some "bad hombres" (copyright Donald Trump) so it's out there for me, albeit as a long shot.

gormdubhgorm · 16-08-2018 11:39PM

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Just on the Jimmy and Kim thing....I think part of the problem is she's too good-looking for Jimmy and when we see them as a couple, it just doesn't add up. Throw in their career progression routes etc. and I think it makes it even less likely. We're preconditioned not to see a woman like her as being in love with Jimmy. If anything you'd think she'd be more of a match with Howard - good looking, successful etc. as the slimeball is.

Dare I say if they had picked a less attractive actress it would be a much more credible relationship? She's way out of Jimmy's league and he's punching way above his weight

The on screen relationship reminds me of that Sitcom King of Queens

It requires a certain suspension of disbelief.

leggo · 17-08-2018 08:15AM

Jimmy and Kim's relationship is meant to feel off, though, when you consider that the recurring theme of BB/BCS is unfulfillment (Better Call Saul is essentially Jimmy's Breaking Bad story sure). The long, lingering camera shots designed to let you think inside a character's head and empathise with them are designed to give you that sense of quiet emptiness they're all feeling.

I wouldn't read too much into the fact that Jimmy may be punching with Kim: we know their relationship came from a long, close friendship where romantic feelings developed. I would imagine that those feelings developed based off their existences being pretty lonely, Kim is an obsessed workaholic, Jimmy had turned his back on his old life and was trying to reform himself in a world that didn't want him. So it's one of these relationships that developed because they were two people who didn't have anyone else comforting each other based off connecting in a lonely world. It's both nice and inherently flawed. They're not together because they're either's perfect fit or first choice, they were all the other person had. So I think there is great love and appreciation for each other there while also being confronted by what they don't have in each other.

Kim is a catch: she's beautiful, intelligent, good craic, accomplished with a great job, independent, strong. She can undoubtedly do better than a morally questionable, mail room guy turned unemployed lawyer. She's also totally by the book (though we've seen she can flirt with the dark side), so in her even though Jimmy should be happy, it's just not fully clicking for him because he has this whole aspect to his personality he's suppressing. They're trying but we know that it's doomed because she's not in Breaking Bad.

Penn · 17-08-2018 10:02AM

Yeah ultimately, Jimmy and Kim knew each before BCS started, and their friendship was already deeply ingrained by then. I think their relationship is just the natural progression of that, and they're already so familiar with each other than scenes of wild passion between them likely wasn't on the cards. They're both getting something out of the relationship regardless of whether either is punching above their weight.

Tony EH · 17-08-2018 10:15AM

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Dare I say if they had picked a less attractive actress it would be a much more credible relationship? She's way out of Jimmy's league and he's punching way above his weight.

Mmmmm, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I spose. But, I don't think she's that good looking myself.

evolving_doors · 17-08-2018 10:22AM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

I really loved that episode.

1. Kim really really loves Jimmy. That scene on the couch with her watching him was done beautifully. They way she has his back against Howard and his brother. Its a deep selfless love.

2. Jimmy loves Kim. He is up early, hitting the road for jobs.

3. This episode was a turning point for me. He had a chance to do an honest job. He was admiring the figures. He was knowledgable and pushed hard for the job. His rant to them was his internal moral compass going off turning on them, calling them smucks. It took me a while to figure it out. He is dehumanising them so he can rip them off. Its their fault for being "mugs" that he can rob from.

4. He is now on the phone to Mike to rob them. It will be interesting to see what Mike does. He no longer needs the money. Will Jimmy try and do the job and bungle it or give the figurene to Kim as a gift and then she discovers its stolen?

4. No way it was Mike he rang to do a petty theft break in job.

gormdubhgorm · 17-08-2018 10:26AM

Tony EH wrote: »

Mmmmm, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I spose. But, I don't think she's that good looking myself.

I personally prefer:

Tony EH · 17-08-2018 10:27AM

Now yer talking.

Penn · 17-08-2018 10:29AM

evolving_doors wrote: »

4. No way it was Mike he rang to do a petty theft break in job.

The voice on the answering machine definitely sounded like Mike. Jimmy wouldn't know about most of the stuff Mike is involved with (In BB, he didn't even know Mike worked for Gus), so he might not think a small break-in job would be out of Mike's remit.

ButtersSuki · 17-08-2018 11:21AM

Tony EH wrote: »

Mmmmm, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I spose. But, I don't think she's that good looking myself.

I don’t myself either just to clarify! I will say she looks much better out of character than in, and I can certainly understand why by conventional standards she would be seen as attractive, but surely you’re not suggesting that she’s not better looking than Jimmy?! :pac:

ButtersSuki · 17-08-2018 11:23AM

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

The on screen relationship reminds me of that Sitcom King of Queens

It requires a certain suspension of disbelief.

Well I never watched that show...but I might now.

I assume homeboy in the picture also wrote and produced the show? :pac:

17-08-2018 02:37PM

ButtersSuki wrote: »

I have a neighbour who's never seen a single episode of either BB or BCS. Today he asked me which one should he start with..........and it was an interesting question. I told him to do BB first as intended; but maybe if BCS was fully completed and not someway through its as yet undetermined no. of episodes and the series complete it might have been BCS first and do the whole thing chronologically.

Tell them to start with BCS! What a rare creature they would be. They'd have no idea what a fall from grace or rise into criminality that Jimmy is destined for.

steve_r · 17-08-2018 02:48PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Tell them to start with BCS! What a rare creature they would be. They'd have no idea what a fall from grace or rise into criminality that Jimmy is destined for.

Yeah, imagine watching those Gene scenes and wondering how that had came about.

ButtersSuki · 17-08-2018 03:24PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Tell them to start with BCS! What a rare creature they would be. They'd have no idea what a fall from grace or rise into criminality that Jimmy is destined for.

Yeah if it was completely finished maybe...but not a couple of episodes into S4.

I also wonder if there was no BB, how many people would honestly have given up on BCS by Season 3 as it's very slow.

scamalert · 17-08-2018 04:47PM

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Yeah if it was completely finished maybe...but not a couple of episodes into S4.

I also wonder if there was no BB, how many people would honestly have given up on BCS by Season 3 as it's very slow.

without BB entire story would be different and show most likely wouldn't exist, not the way its developed now anyway.

Im interested thou will this be the last season, as nacho and kim will have to be out of picture, nacho being first it would make for a drooling series where there's jimmy and kim story if they continued, on that path, unless netflix some how gets green light to do full future season episode to make closure on BB, which is doubtful.

BandMember · 17-08-2018 04:58PM

I'm just going to throw this out there.....

Who says that Kim "has to be" written out before next season? What is the reasoning for this line of thinking?

Could she not remain in the picture in terms of Jimmy's/Saul's personal life but not in his business life? I mean, there was absolutely no reference or mention of Saul's personal life in Breaking Bad, so there's no reason or evidence to say that Kim wasn't in it.

She could just as easily have married Jimmy as broken up with him. While she may have her suspicions about his methods or disapproved of them (and we've seen glimpses of this so far e.g. her reluctance to open up the law office with him, his methods of dealing with the Mace Verdi case etc.), she could have just kept their business and personal lives separate because of this.

There was also plenty of characters in either show that weren't even mentioned in the other one, she could easily be one of those.

Now. Let ye wreck your heads thinking about that for the weekend!

:pac:

rubadub · 17-08-2018 05:14PM

scamalert wrote: »

Im interested thou will this be the last season, as nacho and kim will have to be out of picture, nacho being first it would make for a drooling series where there's jimmy and kim story if they continued, on that path, unless netflix some how gets green light to do full future season episode to make closure on BB, which is doubtful.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Call_Saul

The 10-episode fourth season started airing August 6, 2018; the show has been renewed for a fifth season.

No way this would have been the last season. Not sure why nacho or kim leaving would make much of an impact. You say the "will have to be", not sure where that is coming from.

They can easily go on with "Gene" after, a whole post BB thing. But also there is no law saying they cannot actually continue into the BB timeline either, it does not just have to be before or after. Saul was not in it all that much. In BB there are probably numerous little stories mentioned which could be developed. These could even be done as flashback scenes or something.

I will use spoilers now as this is info I got on sites which can reveal future info.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Better_Call_Saul_(season_4)
Cast and characters
Yet to appear
Lavell Crawford as Huell Babineaux, a professional pickpocket hired by Jimmy.[23]
Rex Linn as Kevin Wachtell, the CEO of Mesa Verde and one of Kim's clients.[24]
Cara Pifko as Paige Novak, the senior counsel of Mesa Verde and one of Kim's clients.[24]
Joe DeRosa as Dr. Caldera, a veterinarian who serves as Mike's liaison to the criminal underworld.[24]
Tony Dalton as *********Lalo***********[13]
Stefan Kapičić

___________________
http://breakingbad.wikia.com/wiki/Lalo
Breaking Bad
Season 2
When Saul Goodman is captured by Walter White and Jesse Pinkman and taken to the desert, Saul assumes that it is Lalo who has abducted him and starts begging for his life, blaming Ignacio for what happened, swearing he's always been friends with the cartel. After realizing Walter and Jesse's confusion, he realizes he had mistaken them for Lalo and sighs in relief

______________
http://breakingbad.wikia.com/wiki/Nacho_Varga
Trivia
There might be a reference to this character in Saul's initial appearance on Breaking Bad. When Saul is held at gunpoint by Walt and Jesse, Saul (mistakenly thinking that people sent by a person named Lalo are holding him at gunpoint) says "it wasn't me, it was Ignacio."
Since the name Nacho is short for Ignacio, it might be possible Saul talks about the same person. Peter Gould has hinted this is the same person.

Finally, Michael Mando is a cast regular but only wound up being in four of the 10 episodes, and really briefly in one of those. Did you initially have bigger plans for Nacho this year, or was it a case of wanting to have the actor under contract because you knew you would need him later?

Peter Gould: Both things are true. This is part and parcel with what I was talking about earlier. We thought Jimmy would become Saul way faster. We pictured that he would be doing business with Nacho much earlier in the season. What we found was Jimmy wasn’t ready. It was tough on us, because we love Michael and love what he did with Nacho. He brings such an intelligence and focus to Nacho in season 1. I really don’t think you can take your eyes off him. But having said that, we definitely have big plans for Nacho.

Well, we know his name is Ignacio, and that’s a name Saul drops in his very first appearance in this universe.

Peter Gould: You’re so right. We’ve laid down our marker that these guys are going to have more to do with each other.
_____________
So Nacho could still be alive in BB or post BB.

frozenfrozen · 17-08-2018 05:24PM

BandMember wrote: »

I'm just going to throw this out there.....

Who says that Kim "has to be" written out before next season? What is the reasoning for this line of thinking?

Could she not remain in the picture in terms of Jimmy's/Saul's personal life but not in his business life? I mean, there was absolutely no reference or mention of Saul's personal life in Breaking Bad, so there's no reason or evidence to say that Kim wasn't in it.

She could just as easily have married Jimmy as broken up with him. While she may have her suspicions about his methods or disapproved of them (and we've seen glimpses of this so far e.g. her reluctance to open up the law office with him, his methods of dealing with the Mace Verdi case etc.), she could have just kept their business and personal lives separate because of this.

There was also plenty of characters in either show that weren't even mentioned in the other one, she could easily be one of those.

Now. Let ye wreck your heads thinking about that for the weekend! :pac:

Since Gene in the flash forwards / current day stuff is watching tapes of the Saul Goodman ads, rather than looking at pictures of him and Kim. He mustn't miss her too terribly if he looks back more fondly on Saul Goodman days.

Better Call Saul ***Spoilers***

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Better Call Saul Spoilers