No Birth cert...anything I can do?

cusser · 08-07-2018 04:40PM #1

I was born in Nigeria, 1963 in a bush hospital to Irish parents. My birth cert has always looked dodgy . It is (was) handwritten, on unofficial paper with date of birth crossed out and re-entered. I lost it 20 years ago, when my rugsack went missing at Milan airport. I have no photocopies. Somehow they, also have disappeared over the years. My main form of i.d. has been passport which I have to keep renewing for fear of having to go thru' drama regarding birth-cert.
I tried ringing the Nigerian embassy, some years ago; asked if there was any hope of getting one re-issued. They said NO!...since the civil war etc...they would not have records.
Is it worth pursuing? If so, how?
So far I have gotten by without...

GerardKeating · 08-07-2018 08:02PM

cusser wrote: »

Is it worth pursuing? If so, how?
So far I have gotten by without...

Assuming one or both parents are still alive, perhaps a signed/notirised affidavit of some kind, stating the circumstances of your birth.

You must have given a copy of the birth cert to the DFA when you were first issues an irish passport, perhaps they still have a copy?

Marcusm · 08-07-2018 10:33PM

cusser wrote: »

I was born in Nigeria, 1963 in a bush hospital to Irish parents. My birth cert has always looked dodgy . It is (was) handwritten, on unofficial paper with date of birth crossed out and re-entered. I lost it 20 years ago, when my rugsack went missing at Milan airport. I have no photocopies. Somehow they, also have disappeared over the years. My main form of i.d. has been passport which I have to keep renewing for fear of having to go thru' drama regarding birth-cert.
I tried ringing the Nigerian embassy, some years ago; asked if there was any hope of getting one re-issued. They said NO!...since the civil war etc...they would not have records.
Is it worth pursuing? If so, how?
So far I have gotten by without...

Was your birth entered in the Foreign Births Register?

Under His Eye · 08-07-2018 10:38PM

There would be no need if both parents were Irish.

GerardKeating · 09-07-2018 08:02AM

Under His Eye wrote: »

There would be no need if both parents were Irish.

Don't think it actually existed in 1963, the legal distinction between kids where the irish citizen parent was born or ireland or elsewhere is more recent.

Glass fused light · 09-07-2018 08:02AM

Do you have an Irish passport or a Nigerian one?
If its an Irish one or if your parents are Irish citizens contact your local register and explain the situation and they should be able to explain what you need to do to to have your birth registered as a child of Irish citizens.

SuperS54 · 09-07-2018 08:14AM

Under His Eye wrote: »

There would be no need if both parents were Irish.

I have had to have foreign birth registrations for both my children before I could get passports for them as they were "born in a country which does not have a civil birth registration for foreign children".

The "rules" on getting passports for children born to Irish parent(s) abroad are not set in stone and different government departments seem to have their own versions, none of which are written down.

OP, as others have stated there should be a copy of your birth registration held by some institution where you have provided it in the past. I say should as for my first born I had to go through a huge rigmarole to get a passport with one of the sticking points being the foreign birth registration, when I went to renew the passport no one had even bothered to put a copy in the system. For my second I was questioned at length as to why I provided a foreign births certificate with with a passport application for a child with an Irish parent!

Mr. Incognito · 09-07-2018 09:18AM

If you have an Irish passport then they will have a record of your birth cert being submitted for the initial one.

Ring them and ask for a copy.

Lmklad · 09-07-2018 09:57AM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

If you have an Irish passport then they will have a record of your birth cert being submitted for the initial one.

Ring them and ask for a copy.

As above. Contact your local registrar.

cusser · 09-07-2018 04:46PM

GerardKeating wrote: »

Assuming one or both parents are still alive, perhaps a signed/notirised affidavit of some kind, stating the circumstances of your birth.

You must have given a copy of the birth cert to the DFA when you were first issues an irish passport, perhaps they still have a copy?

I could try. I Hope drawing attention to it doesn't open a can of worms ...

cusser · 09-07-2018 04:48PM

Glass fused light wrote: »

Do you have an Irish passport or a Nigerian one?
If its an Irish one or if your parents are Irish citizens contact your local register and explain the situation and they should be able to explain what you need to do to to have your birth registered as a child of Irish citizens.

Irish passport.
Thanks for advice...re local register.

cusser · 09-07-2018 04:50PM

Marcusm wrote: »

Was your birth entered in the Foreign Births Register?

In which country?

Marcusm · 09-07-2018 07:19PM

cusser wrote: »

In which country?

It’s maintained by the Dept of Foreign Affairs. Not sure if there was an Irish embassy in Nigeria at the time - I have family who lived there late 70s/early 80s but my aunt came home each time she was giving birth. I believe it was not unusual even for foreign born children of temporary Irish expats to use the FBR to have an Irish record of the birth. It’s more usually used by second and later born Irish citizens born overseas to preserve citizenship entitlements for their offspring.

Del2005 · 09-07-2018 07:23PM

cusser wrote: »

I was born in Nigeria, 1963 in a bush hospital to Irish parents. My birth cert has always looked dodgy . It is (was) handwritten, on unofficial paper with date of birth crossed out and re-entered. I lost it 20 years ago, when my rugsack went missing at Milan airport. I have no photocopies. Somehow they, also have disappeared over the years. My main form of i.d. has been passport which I have to keep renewing for fear of having to go thru' drama regarding birth-cert.
I tried ringing the Nigerian embassy, some years ago; asked if there was any hope of getting one re-issued. They said NO!...since the civil war etc...they would not have records.
Is it worth pursuing? If so, how?
So far I have gotten by without...

Why do you want the Birth cert? You already have a passport which is acceptable ID for anything you need to apply. I don't know where my birth cert is and haven't needed to look for it in 20+ years.

cusser · 09-07-2018 09:10PM

Del2005 wrote: »

Why do you want the Birth cert? You already have a passport which is acceptable ID for anything you need to apply. I don't know where my birth cert is and haven't needed to look for it in 20+ years.

That was one of my queries; whether or not to pursue it?
'Other people' make me think I should, at times.
That, and having returned to Ireland after many years living overseas, I am astounded at some of the bizarre red-tape scenarios people are subjected to here. Although I cannot logically think of a situation where I would need it over a passport, this is a crazy-ass country.:D

Under His Eye · 09-07-2018 09:12PM

Your Irish Passport should be your primary source of identification.

As said above I have not needed to produce a birth cert in over 20 years. Once you keep your passport current you're sorted.

longgonesilver · 09-07-2018 10:10PM

There is a saying about picking the time and place that you fight your battles.

As above, first try to retrieve a copy from passport office of whoever holds the records. Then apply for a public services card. This will give you a second official form of id.

In the past the biggest stumbling block for people without a birthcert has been proving their age when applying for the old age pension.

By getting the public services card now you can explore the issue while you have access to a larger pool of people who can verify your story and age.

yenom · 09-07-2018 10:11PM

The passport office would shred all documents after something like twenty years due to data protection. They'd likely not have a record of it.

Del2005 · 09-07-2018 10:59PM

longgonesilver wrote: »

There is a saying about picking the time and place that you fight your battles.

As above, first try to retrieve a copy from passport office of whoever holds the records. Then apply for a public services card. This will give you a second official form of id.

In the past the biggest stumbling block for people without a birthcert has been proving their age when applying for the old age pension.

By getting the public services card now you can explore the issue while you have access to a larger pool of people who can verify your story and age.

You don't need a birth cert for the PSC card if you have a passport.

Irish citizens via naturalisation or Foreign Current Irish passport or Certificate of Naturalisation or Foreign Birth Registration certificate and Irish or UK driving

https://psc.gov.ie/questions/

Del2005 · 09-07-2018 11:04PM

cusser wrote: »

That was one of my queries; whether or not to pursue it?
'Other people' make me think I should, at times.
That, and having returned to Ireland after many years living overseas, I am astounded at some of the bizarre red-tape scenarios people are subjected to here. Although I cannot logically think of a situation where I would need it over a passport, this is a crazy-ass country.:D

I don't know what "Other people" are telling you but I've not needed my birth cert since I used it for my passport, it's not as if it provides any other information that's needed for ID purposes. Yes there's a lot of red tape but most of that is foranti fraud and a birth cert is easy to use fraudulently.

Mrs OBumble · 09-07-2018 11:18PM

Are you living in Ireland now? Will you want to apply for a state pension when you are old enough? If so, then based on the current rules, you will need to supply your birth certificate.

Source: section 10 of this document - https://www.welfare.ie/en/pdf/spc1.pdf

Although your passport is adequate as a primary piece of identification for now, it won't be for certain things as you age. I'd strongly suggest you investigate your birth certificate situation now, and not leave it for just before you apply for the pension / Fair Deal / etc. This is the sort of issue that could take years to sort out.

cusser · 10-07-2018 05:09AM

Thanks for all the replies and useful information.
Much appreciated.

rock22 · 10-07-2018 12:26PM

yenom wrote: »

The passport office would shred all documents after something like twenty years due to data protection. They'd likely not have a record of it.

Are you sure of that?

fxotoole · 10-07-2018 12:30PM

Marcusm wrote: »

Was your birth entered in the Foreign Births Register?

FBR only applies where your Irish born ascendant is a grandparent or where one of your parents got FBR before your birth.

So FBR doesn’t apply in this case

fxotoole · 10-07-2018 12:31PM

Glass fused light wrote: »

Do you have an Irish passport or a Nigerian one?
If its an Irish one or if your parents are Irish citizens contact your local register and explain the situation and they should be able to explain what you need to do to to have your birth registered as a child of Irish citizens.

To my knowledge, the General Registrars Office don’t offer such a service

fxotoole · 10-07-2018 12:33PM

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

If you have an Irish passport then they will have a record of your birth cert being submitted for the initial one.

Ring them and ask for a copy.

A photocopy won’t be of much use since most Irish public services look for an original, so they can verify its genuine

longgonesilver · 10-07-2018 12:47PM

A photocopy can help verify that an original once existed.

OP bush hospital Irish, Nigeria 1963. Who delivered you? Doctor, midwife? Who signed the original birth cert?

Jane1012 · 10-07-2018 12:56PM

If you plan on getting married you will need your birth cert.
I was born abroad in another EU country (to Irish parents) and my birth cert on its own and my Irish passport weren’t even enough, I had to send my birth cert back to the original country to get a appstille stamp to prove its authenticity

SuperS54 · 10-07-2018 12:58PM

fxotoole wrote: »

FBR only applies where your Irish born ascendant is a grandparent or where one of your parents got FBR before your birth.

Not true!

cusser · 10-07-2018 06:38PM

longgonesilver wrote: »

A photocopy can help verify that an original once existed.

OP bush hospital Irish, Nigeria 1963. Who delivered you? Doctor, midwife? Who signed the original birth cert?

Don't know the answers to any of those questions. I discovered last week that my father actually wrote the birth cert, cos 'the fella' as he described him was illiterate!:(

antoinolachtnai · 10-07-2018 06:56PM

cusser wrote: »

Don't know the answers to any of those questions. I discovered last week that my father actually wrote the birth cert, cos 'the fella' as he described him was illiterate!:(

I would be inclined to get this sorted out while your father is still alive. And it is worth checking the register of foreign births. You never know.

You are not the first person to have had this problem. Have you read this? https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/eoir/legacy/2013/12/18/NGA103787.E.pdf

Also http://www.refworld.org/docid/52a82aca4.html

No Birth cert...anything I can do?

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