7+ seater for low mileage use with lowest 10 year total cost of ownership

ReadySteadyGo · 06-06-2018 03:32PM #1

We are looking for a 7+ seater with the lowest total cost of ownership over 10 years (depreciation+tax+insurance+repairs+service+fuel) for low mileage usage (likely <2k kms per year).

Can you help with some suggestions?

More details:

We do very low mileage i.e. our total annual mileage is 5-10k kms a year. And of that, our 7 seater mileage would likely, be max 2k kms a year.
Our main car is a first gen nissan leaf, which we love, and use for 95% of our driving.
Our second car is an old, small, cheap, heading for twenty years old, 1 litre runabout, (mainly used the rare time when the leaf is already being used)
We are looking to upgrade our second car to 7+ seats for the occasional time when 5 seats are not enough, or we need more load carrying space.
Don't really care about the year of the car.
We could find money to buy a newer car if the 10 year total cost was going to be cheaper

Heres Johnny · 06-06-2018 03:49PM

Buying anything new to do 2000 kms a year would be bananas. Buying anything at all would be nuts to be honest but if you are going to do it I would suggest something 5 to 10 years old already and keep it for 10 years.
You'll get the same amount back for a 15 or 20 year old people carrier as you will for a 10 year old one, which is nothing anyway.
As for car type, I like the Ford s-max a lot.

ReadySteadyGo · 06-06-2018 07:16PM

Agreed. As depreciation is such a large cost on newer models, I'm unlikely to buy new. For a newer model to work out with cheaper total cost of ownership over ten years, it would have to have much lower emissions, insurance or servicing costs.

From an economically rational point of view it might be better to just book taxi/rent 7+ seater when needed. But it's convenient to have it in the driveway.

Which (petrol) year and model smax have lowest tax? Something pre or post 2008?

EPAndlee · 06-06-2018 07:25PM

What about a 7 seater corolla verso? Not most spacious but you've toyota reliability and you'd pick one up for handy money

AMKC · 07-06-2018 09:13AM

Why not nother Leaf or maybe something like a Toyota Prius+ if you really need 7 seats. It was a 7 seater. Not sure what kind of money you need to buy onre do just an idea.

Padraig Mor · 07-06-2018 10:25AM

We also have a Leaf, and use a 2007 Mazda 5 as the 'family runabout' for schools etc. Very reliable, cheap to buy and maintain. And sliding doors too which is a godsend with kids!

ReadySteadyGo · 07-06-2018 11:00AM

Heres Johnny wrote: »

I would suggest something 5 to 10 years old already and keep it for 10 years.....I like the Ford s-max a lot.

S-Max
I like s-max, but I wouldn't mind something with even more space. When we need a big car, we need a big car ;-)

I did a quick price check on s-max prices on done deal - 2006 was oldest they had
2006-2007 seem to generally be about 2-3k
2008-2009 (when tax regime changed) has a very high range from 2k - 8k
2013 (5 years old) seems to be about 13k-19k

But only 2 of all the cars were petrol, which I'd need due to low mileage -

2007 2.5 st titanium 180k km 1923 tax p.a. - 2350 Euro - ten year cost for tax&purchase = 21.5k
2007 2.0 titanium 160k km 710 tax p.a. - 4200 Euro - ten year cost for tax&purchase = 9.5k

Obviously I'm ignoring servicing (assume to be the same?) and insurance (assume to be higher on the ST) and fuel (irrelevant given low mileage).

Did any of the petrol models have low tax after the tax changed to emissions?

EPAndlee wrote: »

What about a 7 seater corolla verso? Not most spacious but you've toyota reliability

Corolla Verso
Would prefer something bigger I think, but checked on done deal for Verso petrol
2003-2007 1-4k
2008-2009 4-7k

2008 1.6 Luna 95k km, 514 tax p.a. - 5450 euro - ten year cost for tax & purchase = 10.5k
2008 1.8 110k km, 636 tax p.a - 4000 Euro - ten year costs = 10.5k

AMKC wrote: »

Why not nother Leaf or maybe something like a Toyota Prius+ if you really need 7 seats.

Yes, we really need the 7 seats, and in fact would be happy with even a small minibus!

Second leaf?
A second Leaf is not a runner as whenever we need more than 5 seats we would have to bring two cars.

Prius+
I checked on done deal
2012 12-15k Tax 180 p.a - ten year cost (assume 13k purchase) = 15k. (I assume this would have a bit more residual value after ten years vs the other ones, so cost might be more like 14.5k.

Given the very low rate of tax, it might be worth spending the extra money for this.

I have never been in one, Have they much seat and stoage space inside compared to a s-max?

Nissan env2000
The nissan env2000 (all electric) comes in 7 seats (but only from 2015 or 2016?) and I think still too expensive. I'd also be put off, as the range is not that big, and on a 2nd car for occasional weekend holiday I'd rather not be dealing with public charging and range concerns.

Tesla
I wouldn't mind a Tesla (S?) with the two rear facing kids seats, or X? but they are way too expensive for my taste!

Will look into mazda 5 later on.

unkel · 07-06-2018 12:06PM

A regular poster in the EV forum was in exactly your situation and instead of buying a 7 seater, he just bought a cheap second hand Leaf. So they now have 2 Leafs. On the rare occasions that his family of 7 travel together, they just use the 2 Leafs

Thought I'd mention this as you might not have thought of this option

ReadySteadyGo · 07-06-2018 04:32PM

unkel wrote: »

he just bought a cheap second hand Leaf. So they now have 2 Leafs. On the rare occasions that his family of 7 travel together, they just use the 2 Leafs

This might win from an overall total cost of ownership point of view, and I am very happy with my cheap leaf, But I would really like to be able to do 7+ with one car only, I likely wouldn't bother upgrading if not 7+ seats. Also, I'd prefer if the second car was not as range limited as leaf.

mickuhaha · 07-06-2018 04:43PM

vw sharan, seat alhambra, ford galaxy all the same car up to 2009 or there about. Great reliable 7 seater. Cheep. Lots of parts out there.

Mooooo · 07-06-2018 06:54PM

Older diesels may not have the dpf and egr to block upon short journeys so if you can't find a petrol one perhaps check those on any diesels you see

Shefwedfan · 07-06-2018 08:22PM

I have eGolf, it does the majority of the mileage

We had the same issue as you but do about 5-8k km per year in other car. We had old SMAX but decided to swap

The option was Galaxy or Alhambra for the additional space. The Alhambra was hard to find with decent spec, most in crappy Paddy spec....so we got a Galaxy from Windsor, it was UK originally so very high spec.

It is great for long weekend and also for family trips to UK etc.....It is diesel and we get 8ltr/100km but as mentioned the eGolf does oer 15k km per year so it balances out....

Other option of course could be Outlander phev and depending on children age you could put in Multimac. That is what we considered due to the low MPG on the Galaxy but decided to stick with Galaxy in end

The SMAX is a lot better drive, the Galaxy is like a transit but perfect for large family needs

TRS30 · 08-06-2018 09:48AM

Two other potential options are Merc e class estate and Peugeot 5008 (old version).

ReadySteadyGo · 08-06-2018 10:07AM

When buying cheap and old and holding for a long time, it seems that that tax and repair may drive most of the total cost.

Thanks for all the suggestions. I Haven't had a chance yet to look at costs for all the other proposed models yet.

Do any of the proposed models come with a low tax engine option? (and have low expecting service/repair/parts costs?)

ted1 · 08-06-2018 10:11AM

ReadySteadyGo wrote: »

We are looking for a 7+ seater with the lowest total cost of ownership over 10 years (depreciation+tax+insurance+repairs+service+fuel) for low mileage usage (likely <2k kms per year).

Can you help with some suggestions?

More details:
We do very low mileage i.e. our total annual mileage is 5-10k kms a year. And of that, our 7 seater mileage would likely, be max 2k kms a year.

Our main car is a first gen nissan leaf, which we love, and use for 95% of our driving.

Our second car is an old, small, cheap, heading for twenty years old, 1 litre runabout, (mainly used the rare time when the leaf is already being used)

We are looking to upgrade our second car to 7+ seats for the occasional time when 5 seats are not enough, or we need more load carrying space.

Don't really care about the year of the car.

We could find money to buy a newer car if the 10 year total cost was going to be cheaper

Could you rent one when you need it?

TRS30 · 08-06-2018 10:25AM

ReadySteadyGo wrote: »

Do any of the proposed models come with a low tax engine option? (and have low expecting service/repair/parts costs?)

I believe the old version 5008 comes with a 1.6 engine that is €280 annual tax. It is a diesel though so might not best suit your needs.

Gregor Samsa · 08-06-2018 11:33AM

ReadySteadyGo wrote: »

S-Max
I like s-max, but I wouldn't mind something with even more space. When we need a big car, we need a big car ;-)

You're not going to get many 7 seaters much bigger than the S-Max. The Galaxy is a little longer and has more headroom at the 3rd row, but there's not much difference. All 7 seaters have a tiny boot once the back 2 seats are up. I have an S-Max myself, and it's bigger than any other 7 seater we looked at (Galaxy aside).

The Hyundai Trajet is pretty big too, maybe even more space than the S-Max/Galaxy (I've only ever been in one once), but they stopped making them in 2008, so they weren't something I checked out when researching my 7 seater.

If you really need something bigger, how about a Mercedes Vito/V-class/Viano? 9 seats, still have a big cargo space with all seats up (or can fold any number down for more luggage space), and you can drive it on a B licence. But, as most things that size will be, they're only diesel as far as I know.

Example: https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/mercedes-vito/18641080

ReadySteadyGo · 08-06-2018 11:42AM

ted1 wrote: »

Could you rent one when you need it?

Yes, hiring one/taxi/car club (if suitable local one exists) is a possibility. But at the moment, we never actually do it! Despite doing the logic to say we have "a budget" to spend on it. We end up taking two cars, or not doing an extra lift in the car pool situation, or finding some other alternative.

Based on prices here it looks like we could budget for 1-1.5k per year to spend on taxi/hire.

There is the hassle of having to book a rental, and you don't always have great availability on 7+ seats, and if you scratch it, you can have a big bill. And you have the hassle of pick up, parking of your other car (or two drivers going) and going home and then going to your destination, and then the dance for returning it.

I just tried to hire one now for 1 day for tmrw using novacarhire (and Dublin downtown), and the cheapest 7 seats or bigger + is 251 euro! per day - vw caravelle.

I tried enterprise direct - and at the airport they have a galaxy for 150 per day. Local to me they don't have one.

Based on those prices My budget would only cover about 7 or 8 days of 7 seater usage per year.

If we used the budget for taxi - assuming about 1 euro per km, as a typical fee, it would get us about 1500 kms. That would seem better for us then hire, as most of our trips would still be relatively small. But still, in my experience, you can end up waiting for a 7 seater taxi, as they are rarer....

Feels like if for similar annual budget we can have the convenience of one on the drive it would be worth it.

ReadySteadyGo · 08-06-2018 12:02PM

TRS30 wrote: »

I believe the old version 5008 comes with a 1.6 engine that is €280 annual tax. It is a diesel though so might not best suit your needs.

That sounds interesting! Although, for 2k kms a year, I understand, that diesel not a runner due to concerns for low mileage use.

phutyle wrote: »

You're not going to get many 7 seaters much bigger than the S-Max. The Galaxy is a little longer and has more headroom at the 3rd row, but there's not much difference. All 7 seaters have a tiny boot once the back 2 seats are up. I have an S-Max myself, and it's bigger than any other 7 seater we looked at (Galaxy aside).

The Hyundai Trajet is pretty big too, maybe even more space than the S-Max/Galaxy (I've only ever been in one once), but they stopped making them in 2008, so they weren't something I checked out when researching my 7 seater.

If you really need something bigger, how about a Mercedes Vito/V-class/Viano? 9 seats, still have a big cargo space with all seats up (or can fold any number down for more luggage space), and you can drive it on a B licence. But, as most things that size will be, they're only diesel as far as I know.

Example: https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/mercedes-vito/18641080

Will have a look at hyundai so.

Yes, one of the reason we like the s-max is it seems a bit bigger than some of the other compact 7 seaters.

I'd be happier with more than 7 seats and once I can drive on the normal license (although other half is not very keen on a larger vehicle). I'm really looking for low total cost of ownership, as we will not be doing much driving in it.

That Vito has tax of 1k p.a. and 5k to buy - so 10 year costs of 15k.

But as you say it's Diesel - so as I understand not a runner for our usage.

ReadySteadyGo · 08-06-2018 12:05PM

Mooooo wrote: »

Older diesels may not have the dpf and egr to block upon short journeys so if you can't find a petrol one perhaps check those on any diesels you see

Pardon my ignorance, but how do I check if it is has a dpf and egr? And other than that are their other concerns about doing low mileage on diesels?

I'd also have some concerns that diesel motor tax, might be increased, as regulations try to "force" them off the road.

ted1 · 08-06-2018 03:23PM

An annual excess policy is 50 Euro. No need to worry about scratches

ted1 · 08-06-2018 03:26PM

Hertz have a zafira for 104 tomorrow.

7+ seater for low mileage use with lowest 10 year total cost of ownership

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