Self drive and snow

kirving · 08-03-2018 12:30AM

I work for a company who does this stuff, although not directly in the software engineering side. We have regular presentations on new software developments and my area does interface with the software side quite often.

While I can't go into specifics because I don't know enough detail, what I can is that this stuff is absolutely nothing like weekly updates to a phone app.

When was the last time your car didn't start because the ECU software screwed up. I've never heard of it happenig to anyone. This is software that sits on a tiny chip, has to run dozens of sensors all around the vehicle in all conditions imaginable. It doesn't just work, it takes hundreds of engineers working around the world to pull it together so that your car starts in -20°C in Finland and +50°C in Nevada.

The development process for a new product takes literally years. We are already in the process of developing products that won't be released for 5 years because the validation procees takes so long. There is no option but to be right first time.

Lantus · 08-03-2018 12:30AM

bladespin wrote:

Lol, technology is there to help and improve our lives not to force us to redesign them, a 'designed' city woul be a horrible and uninspiring place.

Who forced cars to be redesigned? Or houses? Are improved cars and houses horrible and uninspiring? Why would a city built without congestion, pollution, planned open spaces, integrated systems and communities be undesirable?

It's much harder to demonstrate that modern fit for purpose cities will be better but no one would suggest we take a model t and try to fit the body panel if a veyron on it.

Modern cars need modern systems to achieve their full potential. The Vikings were not thinking about automated vehicles when they laid out most of Ireland's current day towns and cities.

08-03-2018 12:33AM

Brian OBrien wrote: »

Well, here's my reasoning. If someone is standing at the side of the road who may look like they are a scammer (certain ethnic minorities come to mind) or a young child or children playing by the roadside, a human brain will know to slow down and prepare for someone darting or jumping out.

A computer will only look at what's on front of it and brake at the last minute if something comes on front of it.

Am I misunderstanding anything here?

Im sure the car could be programmed to slow down in that circumstance too

HonalD · 08-03-2018 05:37AM

Dakota Dan wrote: »

HonalD wrote: »

Babies born today will never have to learn to drive. That's how close it is to happening.

It's a long way off yet.

I'm working in the area so there is some factual basis for my postings. But even if you said it's 20 years away, that's my point.

HonalD · 08-03-2018 05:53AM

Kevin Irving wrote: »

I work for a company who does this stuff, although not directly in the software engineering side. We have regular presentations on new software developments and my area does interface with the software side quite often.

While I can't go into specifics because I don't know enough detail, what I can is that this stuff is absolutely nothing like weekly updates to a phone app.

When was the last time your car didn't start because the ECU software screwed up. I've never heard of it happenig to anyone. This is software that sits on a tiny chip, has to run dozens of sensors all around the vehicle in all conditions imaginable. It doesn't just work, it takes hundreds of engineers working around the world to pull it together so that your car starts in -20°C in Finland and +50°C in Nevada.

The development process for a new product takes literally years. We are already in the process of developing products that won't be released for 5 years because the validation procees takes so long. There is no option but to be right first time.

From my experience, I agree.

bladespin · 08-03-2018 09:29AM

Lantus wrote:

Who forced cars to be redesigned? Or houses? Are improved cars and houses horrible and uninspiring? Why would a city built without congestion, pollution, planned open spaces, integrated systems and communities be undesirable?

Well yes, modern houses for the most part are just mass produced boxes, cars too.
However cars and even houses have evolved there has'nt been a complete redesign of either, the same for our cities, only difference is obselescence, cars and houses have a limited lifespan and then they're done a newer improved version arrives, cities just keep evolving so not really a valid comparison.

dr.fuzzenstein · 08-03-2018 01:16PM

bladespin wrote: »

Well yes, modern houses for the most part are just mass produced boxes, cars too.
However cars and even houses have evolved there has'nt been a complete redesign of either, the same for our cities, only difference is obselescence, cars and houses have a limited lifespan and then they're done a newer improved version arrives, cities just keep evolving so not really a valid comparison.

Only difference is obsolescence?
You should try living in a 1970's house and drive a 1970's car, the house with no insulation, no proper heating, a 50 liter hot water tank, wonky electrics, single pane windows, basically cold, drafty and costing a fortune to heat and the car with drum brakes, no power steering, rustholes after 5 years and breaking down every other week and in an accident about as much protection as a wet tissue.
There may not have been a complete redesign, but a car and house from 40 years ago are very different to what you get today.
People think back to old cars and old houses with rose tinted spectacles, even I do, but live with them on a day to day basis and you'll appreciate what you have now.
I'd say the one difference is that houses last a long time and can be modernised to a certain degree.
Anyways, that's today's rant, carry on everyone

bladespin · 08-03-2018 08:27PM

dr.fuzzenstein wrote:

Only difference is obsolescence? You should try living in a 1970's house and drive a 1970's car, the house with no insulation, no proper heating, a 50 liter hot water tank, wonky electrics, single pane windows, basically cold, drafty and costing a fortune to heat and the car with drum brakes, no power steering, rustholes after 5 years and breaking down every other week and in an accident about as much protection as a wet tissue. There may not have been a complete redesign, but a car and house from 40 years ago are very different to what you get today. People think back to old cars and old houses with rose tinted spectacles, even I do, but live with them on a day to day basis and you'll appreciate what you have now. I'd say the one difference is that houses last a long time and can be modernised to a certain degree. Anyways, that's today's rant, carry on everyone

I do live in a 1970s house, and have had a classic car and ride a 23year old motorbike (it still compares well with a brand new bike).
All are/were just fine and not the horrors you're making them out to be in your rant.

Think you're completely airshotting the car thing as I say they become obsolete and are replaced by newer improved items, (the house will too - that just takes longer) that said the basic design has not changed at all, it has been improved in many if not all areas but hasn't been redesigned, just evolved.

Btw cars/bikes of any era can be modernised just like the house, it's pretty basic engineering, I've done it.

RandomAccess · 08-03-2018 11:10PM

The technology is lagging far behind the claims that have been made for it and that will remain the case for many years.

They are not suitable for use outside of motorways. Idiots will still do so but I reserve the right to kill any such person with my bare hands if they harm someone I care about.

dr.fuzzenstein · 08-03-2018 11:53PM

RandomAccess wrote: »

The technology is lagging far behind the claims that have been made for it and that will remain the case for many years.

They are not suitable for use outside of motorways. Idiots will still do so but I reserve the right to kill any such person with my bare hands if they harm someone I care about.

But drunk and inattentive drivers are OK?
Righty-ho.

RandomAccess · 08-03-2018 11:55PM

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

RandomAccess wrote: »

The technology is lagging far behind the claims that have been made for it and that will remain the case for many years.

They are not suitable for use outside of motorways. Idiots will still do so but I reserve the right to kill any such person with my bare hands if they harm someone I care about.

But drunk and inattentive drivers are OK?
Righty-ho.

You misunderstood.
When it's ready then it can be used and I'm fine with that.
But idiots right now are experimenting with people's lives on beta test capabilities.

bladespin · 08-03-2018 11:57PM

dr.fuzzenstein wrote:

But drunk and inattentive drivers are OK? Righty-ho.

Don't recall reading that in there, anywhere???

eeguy · 09-03-2018 12:00AM

People are getting ahead of themselves.
None of this is released. The Tesla stuff is a toy at the moment and noting compared to what Volvo and Renault are up to.

dr.fuzzenstein · 09-03-2018 12:28AM

bladespin wrote: »

I do live in a 1970s house, and have had a classic car and ride a 23year old motorbike (it still compares well with a brand new bike).
All are/were just fine and not the horrors you're making them out to be in your rant.

Think you're completely airshotting the car thing as I say they become obsolete and are replaced by newer improved items, (the house will too - that just takes longer) that said the basic design has not changed at all, it has been improved in many if not all areas but hasn't been redesigned, just evolved.

Btw cars/bikes of any era can be modernised just like the house, it's pretty basic engineering, I've done it.

On the 70's house, yes you can bring them up to scratch. If you completely gut them and replace the plumbing, electrics, insulate the attic, the outside walls and after that it's merely a matter of flooring, plastering, painting and adding a few doors, fixtures and the odd bathroom. I live in an old house, believe me, I know.
On 70's cars, well, we both know the possibilities are endless as far as restoring and upgrading goes. And I have owned W123 Mercs, VW T3 and a 73 MKIII Cortina. Loved them all. But for the daily commute I am happy to be in my 2005 Cmax with it's 205 tires, disc brakes all round, ABS, airbags, ESP, seatbelt tensioners and crumple zones.
Do you really want to modernise a 70's car that it comes as close to a modern car as possible?
It would lose it's appeal in my eyes. I love them for what they are, but I wouldn't destroy them on the daily commute. Especially with the salt in the winter.
You argument is that a house is still 4 walls with a roof and a car is still a combustion engine in a metal shell. Basically that's correct. There has been a lot of progress over 30-40 years. And by upgrading the old item till it's the same as the new one would destroy part of it's appeal in my eyes. Houses maybe less so, but the choice is still originality vs modernising.
Which is also a question of cost.
I don't think we're totally disagreeing, do we?

dr.fuzzenstein · 09-03-2018 12:37AM

bladespin wrote: »

Don't recall reading that in there, anywhere???

The point is always the same. People wet their pants in near hysteria over self driving cars which certainly will be safer than drunk, inattentive humans looking at their phone and causing over 1 million deaths globally.
But there is always a fear of something new. People don't like change and they don't want to have to adapt to something new. It's human nature. We fear and resist change.
All the arguments about "beta" and Google Play apps are certainly not made by people who have even the faintest clue about the development process.
If anyone has such inside information that could prove negligence on behalf of the manufacturer and can support such claims with actual evidence other than "it's beta!", yes, please make the world aware.

bladespin · 09-03-2018 12:57AM

dr.fuzzenstein wrote:

I don't think we're totally disagreeing, do we?

No, we're not.
But I don't think you understood my original post re. building new cities in place of our current ones to suit new technologies, that cities have evolved, that they will remain while cars and houses are replaced, that technology's job is to suit and improve them (the cities) not do away with them.

Self drive and snow

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