Another Sinn Fein blunder?

blanch152 · 05-02-2018 04:15PM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

To say your post is slightly misinformed is an understatement. That's not the legal position at all.

Private clamping firms rely on myths such as the above to stay in business.

I think you are making things up as you go along.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-19782680

At first glance, the UK legislation might seem to support you:

"Wheel-clampers have been outlawed from clamping vehicles on private land under new legislation."

Unfortunately, as you read further down the page, you find:

"The law does not affect Northern Ireland"

So, it would appear that the PFA does not apply to Northern Ireland. There are very good reasons why you would retain the right to clamp and tow cars on private grounds in Northern Ireland, given the historical nasty IRA tactic of using car bombs.

If you are so sure that clamping on private grounds in illegal in Northern Ireland, you might point me to the relevant legislation that stopped it, as was passed in the rest of the UK.

cycle4fun · 05-02-2018 04:17PM

Yes, because Germany is a generally honest country, and their politicans - especially the party spokesperson on policing and justice - would not park on double yellow lines and then take the law in to their own hands with a set of industrial like boltcutters.

blanch152 · 05-02-2018 04:17PM

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

I can't believe people are arguing over such petty technicalities. Regardless of political party, for a high level poltician of ANY establishment to be so utterly stupid and reckless as to do something like this.

It is par for the course, we had it with the McElduff lad a couple of weeks ago, posting sectarian videos on twitter. They don't get it.

blanch152 · 05-02-2018 04:20PM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

I never said it was "illegal" to clamp, what I was disputing was where you posted this

It's not the legal position, and the contract/ fine bit is completely wrong info too.

I posted relative info that countered that already. It's they're in my earlier posts - from the AA (not a random boards poster).

None of what you posted appears to apply to Northern Ireland and you will need to provide something more specific.

Clamping on private grounds was legal in the UK up until 2012, when it was made illegal in England and Wales. Scotland under its devolved powers made it illegal in Scotland.

Until the Northern Assembly adopts a law banning clamping, the legal position, as cited by Jawgap in relation to the 1992 cases stands. The only part of the UK where private clamping is legal is currently Northern Ireland.

Chrongen · 05-02-2018 04:21PM

Are Am Eye wrote: »

I had the same problem last month when a red light was attempting to deny me free movement. The nazi cops couldn't or more like didn't want to understand.

Nice try but your driver's license is actually a contract by which you pledge to adhere to the rules of the road and observe traffic control mechanisms. So you already agreed to allow the red light to temporarily restrict your freedom of movement.

Chrongen · 05-02-2018 04:39PM

Berserker wrote: »

To be fair to Gerry, he is very open and honest about his sectarianism. No Ireland of equals in his world.

Countless reasons. The other cars might not have been parked there when the clampers arrived. Alternatively, if they were parked there when the clampers entered the car park, the drivers were smart enough to keep an eye out for the clampers and move their cars before the clampers had time to clamp them.

Doesn't have the right to damage their property though.

I would be of the opinion that once you put your property on or in my property then it too becomes my property and I am free to destroy it in any way I see fit. Likewise if you drop a leaflet in my door I am free to burn it or if your ball comes into my garden I am free to slash it with a stanley knife. Tough sh1t.

Let's just say you locked your bike to a railing or bike stand and went about your business. You came back half an hour later and some muppet locked his bike to the same stand but happened to lock his bike to yours as well. You have places to be, appointments to keep, etc. What do you do? The muppet could be gone for hours. Do you sit there and wait or do you call up a friend with a bolt cutters to free your bike?

Chrongen · 05-02-2018 04:40PM

Are Am Eye wrote: »

The legal position is that by parking there he enters into a contract whereby he agrees that his car will be clamped and remain clamped until a fine is paid. That signs are up is deemed sufficient notice to him that he is entering this contract. This has been upheld by the courts.
So dont mind your freedom of movement ****e.
Everyone knows that this area needs control and regulation but a few years ago when the issue was being reviewed the govt chose to do nothing. So it is unregulated and often abused.
I wouldn't blame anyone for cutting em off. This guy got caught, was his mistake.

And what is your source for this drivel?

McMurphy · 05-02-2018 04:42PM

blanch152 wrote: »

None of what you posted appears to apply to Northern Ireland and you will need to provide something more specific.

Clamping on private grounds was legal in the UK up until 2012, when it was made illegal in England and Wales. Scotland under its devolved powers made it illegal in Scotland.

Until the Northern Assembly adopts a law banning clamping, the legal position, as cited by Jawgap in relation to the 1992 cases stands. The only part of the UK where private clamping is legal is currently Northern Ireland.

From what I can see - the only cars that can still be clamped on private property in the North are unlicensed ones (which I would assume to mean in taxed and no mot)

Was Kelly's car unlicensed?

ohnonotgmail · 05-02-2018 04:43PM

Chrongen wrote: »

Nice try but your driver's license is actually a contract by which you pledge to adhere to the rules of the road and observe traffic control mechanisms. So you already agreed to allow the red light to temporarily restrict your freedom of movement.

Not quite. The act of driving a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place makes you subject to the rules of the road. The absence of a driving licence doesnt change that.

Are Am Eye · 05-02-2018 04:45PM

Chrongen wrote: »

And what is your source for this drivel?

I didn't post any drivel so i can't give you a source for drivel.

diomed · 05-02-2018 04:55PM

Chrongen wrote: »

I would be of the opinion that once you put your property on or in my property then it too becomes my property and I am free to destroy it in any way I see fit. Likewise if you drop a leaflet in my door I am free to burn it or if your ball comes into my garden I am free to slash it with a stanley knife. Tough sh1t.

Let's just say you locked your bike to a railing or bike stand and went about your business. You came back half an hour later and some muppet locked his bike to the same stand but happened to lock his bike to yours as well. You have places to be, appointments to keep, etc. What do you do? The muppet could be gone for hours. Do you sit there and wait or do you call up a friend with a bolt cutters to free your bike?

"I would be of the opinion that once you put your property on or in my property then it too becomes my property and I am free to destroy it in any way I see fit."

If that was true then Tesco could crush any cars that parked in a Tesco car park.
Or if you go into Easons in O'Connel Street, Dublin with a bag of shopping bought in Arnotts then Easons can take that, and your wallet and clothes.

Where did you get your legal qualification?

05-02-2018 05:05PM

He parked in an area that is marked as "private parking only" so he stole someone elses parking space.
https://www.google.ie/maps/@54.6038143,-5.9271495,3a,75y,184.32h,86.14t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDRHz3RT-yPijKy7IHpgoQg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Chrongen · 05-02-2018 05:33PM

cycle4fun wrote: »

Yes, because Germany is a generally honest country, and their politicans - especially the party spokesperson on policing and justice - would not park on double yellow lines and then take the law in to their own hands with a set of industrial like boltcutters.

How the fcuk do you know that? How do you know what any of them would do? Do you know them all personally and can vouch for their every move past, present and future?

Ever hear of Causa Wulff?

Chrongen · 05-02-2018 05:37PM

blanch152 wrote: »

I think you are making things up as you go along.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-19782680

At first glance, the UK legislation might seem to support you:

"Wheel-clampers have been outlawed from clamping vehicles on private land under new legislation."

Unfortunately, as you read further down the page, you find:

"The law does not affect Northern Ireland"

So, it would appear that the PFA does not apply to Northern Ireland. There are very good reasons why you would retain the right to clamp and tow cars on private grounds in Northern Ireland, given the historical nasty IRA tactic of using car bombs.

If you are so sure that clamping on private grounds in illegal in Northern Ireland, you might point me to the relevant legislation that stopped it, as was passed in the rest of the UK.

What??

So if a parked car is suspected of being a carbomb, you clamp it? WTF?

05-02-2018 05:40PM

Chrongen wrote: »

What??

So if a parked car is suspected of being a carbomb, you clamp it? WTF?

Maybe they're magic clamps that can contain the explosion. :rolleyes:

Are Am Eye · 05-02-2018 05:41PM

Theres nothing worse than a MOBILE car bomb.

Chrongen · 05-02-2018 05:45PM

diomed wrote: »

"I would be of the opinion that once you put your property on or in my property then it too becomes my property and I am free to destroy it in any way I see fit."

If that was true then Tesco could crush any cars that parked in a Tesco car park.
Or if you go into Easons in O'Connel Street, Dublin with a bag of shopping bought in Arnotts then Easons can take that, and your wallet and clothes.

Where did you get your legal qualification?

By the same argument, if I left my bag down in Eason's for a moment and forgot about it and a security guard removed it and put it outside in the pissing rain, I could do them for destruction of property even if they thought it was abandoned or posed a risk?

If you can provide a reasonable excuse as to why you have lawfully damaged or destroyed someone's property then that will be taken into account by the courts and the victim doesn't even have to agree with your excuse. Their complaints will generally be overruled.

A simple example would be smashing a window to save someone from a housefire. Kelly can simply contest that he needed to break the clamp lock in order to free his car and property damaged be damned.

Are Am Eye · 05-02-2018 05:57PM

Chrongen wrote: »

If you can provide a reasonable excuse as to why you have lawfully damaged or destroyed someone's property then that will be taken into account by the courts and the victim doesn't even have to agree with your excuse. Their complaints will generally be overruled.

That would be contingent upon whether the clamp had been legally attached. If it had not then you may have a case. But damaging a lawfully attached clamp is criminal damage all day long.

the sheriff is HERE · 05-02-2018 06:04PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

He parked in an area that is marked as "private parking only" so he stole someone elses parking space.
https://www.google.ie/maps/@54.6038143,-5.9271495,3a,75y,184.32h,86.14t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sDRHz3RT-yPijKy7IHpgoQg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

but, but...

the sheriff is HERE wrote: »

i checked google streetview and the only camera I can see is the gym, and the twitter video has banging music in it.

what sort of data protection laws are they in the north, seems it was posted just because he's gerry kelly.

05-02-2018 06:04PM

Some images from google streetview for all the armchair lawyers!

Are Am Eye · 05-02-2018 06:07PM

A simple way around this is to purchase four clamps and clamp your own four wheels. Leave the clampers with nothing to bite into.

davycc · 05-02-2018 06:29PM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

This story might be smaller than the one emerging in Ballymun about a Sf councillor being assaulted by the wife Of a SF TD. All over the twitter I’ve hear. Photos and everything.

I don't use Twitter myself can you provide a link please

Brendan Bendar · 05-02-2018 06:30PM

Ooooh dear, lot of flim flamming going on all day here.

Amateur lawyers coming in with their scenario

Sinn Fein shills getting their oar in

Anti establishment punters having their say.

Agin everything dudes contributing their chaff.

Looks like auld Jerry got the message.....he forked up.

In fairness, instead of adopting the usual Shinner attitude, he saw the writing on the wall( no pun intended) paid up the 'C' note, paid the fiddy exes and took the heat out of the issue.

Good decision, Gerard.

Brendan Bendar · 05-02-2018 06:32PM

davycc wrote: »

I don't use Twitter myself can you provide a link please

Phoebas · 05-02-2018 06:37PM

A much simpler solution for Gerry Kelly going forward.

the sheriff is HERE · 05-02-2018 06:37PM

Are Am Eye wrote: »

A simple way around this is to purchase four clamps and clamp your own four wheels. Leave the clampers with nothing to bite into.

or four big wheels and tires into arches and no room to clamp.

disclaimer, ride comfortable will be affected, sinn fein take no responsibility for your comfort after said modifications.

Jawgap · 05-02-2018 07:53PM

Phoebas wrote: »

A much simpler solution for Gerry Kelly going forward.

Off street parking - do you think the man is made of money!!!

The average industrial wage doesn't stretch to such luxuries.

05-02-2018 08:02PM

If he used the multistory carpark, he would benefit from the extra exercise, even more so if he parked on the top floor and used the stairs!

smurgen · 05-02-2018 08:19PM

Here's the thing.we see the cynical playing up of issues when something negative against SF happens and selective ignoring or playing down other issues in SF favour or against rival parties.as a SF supporter i must say it makes me happy because it lets me know yer worried.it also helps crystalise the undecided voter.it's like when hillary called trump supporters the deplorables.done more for trumps campaign that the russians ever could. So keep up the good work Jawgap etc.Please be more and more obviously biased also.It dives the support up even faster!

the sheriff is HERE · 05-02-2018 08:22PM

So Gerry gets clamped, asks gym can I have yer bolt cutters, they give it to him he does his business.... ..
Who posted the video to twitter?

Another Sinn Fein blunder?

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