Justice League Spoilers from post 980 onward

Turtyturd · 18-11-2017 12:04AM

Meh for me.

I think the biggest compliment I can give it is that it is the closest any comic book movie has come to being an actual comic on screen.

The idea of the

world descending into fear following Superman’s death is interesting and reminds me slightly of final crisis

but DC seem incapable of wrapping a clear coherent storyline around it. It just seems completely disjointed, kinda like the tie in issues are missing.

techdiver · 18-11-2017 12:21AM

IncognitoMan wrote: »

Yeah that whole chunk of film from where they start talking about the possibility of using a mother box to bring back Superman right up until the moment Superman appears in costume isn't great at all. I expected that the way they brought him back might be well... daft and it was.

Would love to know was that a Snyder or Whedon idea. You would think Snyder but it seems like most of Superman's stuff was re-shot because his CGI lip kept showing up :pac:

I actually quite liked the fight between superman and the league, especially the bit with the Flash running behind him and his eye following. That was cool.

dublinman1990 · 18-11-2017 12:46AM

I am a little bit pissed off because I missed out on the scene with

Deathstroke at my screening earlier

. I did see the mid credit scene with

Flash & Superman & that was fun

. A lot of people at my screening who were mostly schoolkids & their parents who saw this first credit scene. But they all missed out along with me

from watching the scene with Deathstroke. A staff member came in to clean the place when I was the last one that could have watched that final scene. I should have stayed around to watch it.

Damn it anyway!

My impression of this movie is that it was fun & enjoyable. The movie was giving off a few laughs from the audience at the screening. Flash is my most favourite character in JL as I thought he did really well with all of his jokes in the movie. The plot of the movie did seem interesting

towards the end with Steppenwolf

. My thoughts on it are there a few scenes that

did look like that they have been reshot by Whedon

. The CGI moustache with Superman didn't look to be that good in some scenes. But I thought he was really good in the scenes when he had the suit on somewhere near the end of the movie. There was a lot of CGI in the movie that could been toned down a little bit to make it a bit more bearable.

I was disappointed in not seeing the shots from the trailers in the final movie at all. WB may include these scenes on the Blu-ray if it is allowed to be put into a different version of the movie that would been by Snyder.

Overall; I didn't think it could top MOS, BvS or WW. I might put it above SS. But I will give it a rating of 3 stars out of 5 as I liked the lighter tone of it.

Another good thing from it is that I got a free Aquaman wristband when I left the Odeon Cinema in Stillorgan.

There a big list here about the scenes in JL that were shot by Snyder put in for his version of the movie apparently being released in the future. It also tells you what shot by Whedon & what was cut from the final movie. Here is the list in detail and believe me it is huge. (It is a post taken from the JL thread on Blu-ray.com)

-superman in the cell phone footage is Whedon

intro with Batman was Whedon, same with Batman in the plane talking to Alfred

World without Hope montage was Snyder. The Lois bit with the empty bed next to her is actually from a later point in the movie repurposed for this

Snyder original cut had the World without Hope montage go straight into Batman meeting with Aquaman in the village which went on longer as well. Same with their conversation after as Aquaman swims off

Deleted Snyder scene with Martha and Lois talking in the apartment.

Wonder Woman sequence in London is mostly all Snyder but trimmed down as the original had her taking out all the bad guys and additional slow-mo. Snyder loves his close up to convey information as there's a close up of the lead bad guy changing the gun from single to automatic mode after Wonder Woman stops the first bullet. Reshoots did add dialogue between Wonder Woman and lead bad guy before she stops all the bullets. This reshoot had everything finished to get it ready for the movie so I suspect this will be in extended version

this cuts into the Amazonian which is Snyder and mostly not changed. A scene they removed was an Amazon being turned into a demon during Steppenwolf initial encounter. She kills herself before the transformation finishes. This shot was finished so maybe extended version

anything with the russian family is Whedon

Cyborgs dad talking to the janitor at Star Labs was Whedon

Cyborg intro with his dad is a longer scene as well and Snyder . The scene starts with him looking at the people walking around the streets enjoying their lives as he looks on with envy.

Wonder Woman meeting up with Batman while he repairs the jet was Snyder, them discussing the nature of the motherboxes on the Lake was Whedon.

Thousand year battle is mostly the same in Snyder version, there was a back and forth between adding more focus on the Green Lantern or not. Darkseid actually showed up here as a visual stand in for Steppenwolf as one point the model wasn't quite ready yet.

Flash scene filling out the forms and visiting his dad is Snyder

Batman meeting Flash was Snyder. Whedon added 'people are slow, I'll try to keep up' bit

Aquaman saving the man out in the sea was originally the end montage footage repurposed to here and it was Snyder. I believe the bits of him dumping the guy at the bar is Snyder as well

Aquaman coming back as Steppenwolf tries and succeed in taking the motherbox is Snyder still. The only real change up is when Aquaman and Mera have a discussion which again went on longer and was a mix of both Snyder, Whedon and Wan as Aquaman was filming at the time

The discussion between Mera and Aquaman was deleted at some point and I believe someone fought hard for this to come back in the edit which I'm glad they kept in.

janitor being taken by the demon is Snyder

Woman on tv about her missing husband, Lois/Martha at the daily planet is Whedon

Cyborg calling out to meet Wonder Woman and their meeting on the streets is mostly Snyder. There may be some minor bits with Cyborg as a reshoot but unsure. Alfred line about date night may have been ADR later

Cyborg dad being kidnapped by demon to Gordon in the station to the gang meeting up on the roof and then heading to the sewers is Snyder but trimmed by a few seconds.

Wonder Woman talking about 'doing this together as a team' and Cyborg 'didn't think you were real' were cut

Flash panicking and Batman encouraging him to save one person is Whedon

Cyborg saving his dad is mostly the same so Snyder.

Wonder Woman openly taunts Steppenwolf was cut before shoving him through the wall. The fight is Snyder with added Whedon dialogue as Wonder Woman looks pissed Steppenwolf mentioned his axe having amazon blood on it.

Flash interrupts Batman as he fights the demons, this is where the dodge sequence occurred and later cut. There was an attempt to keep it in for many versions with even a reshoot element of Flash saying 'I thought we were suppose to do this together!' Flash pushing the demon through the wall was later repurposed as Cyborg doing it. Most likely will not be extended version

I believe Batman yells at Flash to ensure the Star Labs people are out with Cyborgs help as a demon starts to overpower Batman

Scene with Cyborg getting people out as Flash looks on is cut

the Flash getting people out one at a time is Whedon as is Cyborg dad explaining to him that they're after the box as Cyborg shoots a demon (repurposed from earlier)

Batman fighting the demon on the higher level is Snyder with the WW fight still the same.

Steppenwolf throws WW to the wall and then charges his axe at her which she dodges, this attack causes a chain reaction in which the building starts to crumble on the outside and there's now falling debris which leds towards a cut of the Star Labs people outside with the Flash. He see the debris falling so he uses his speed to punch the debris out of the way from the people but somehow misses the last big piece in which Cyborg shoots it out of the way. This was cut and in the original trailer:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cxi...=youtu.be&t=47

This sequence had mostly finished VFX but I doubt you will see this in extended

Batman saying 'my turn' is Snyder and is cut replaced with 'I didn't bring a sword' and 'he's tall' is Whedon.

Cyborg asking Flash to go check on the others is cut. VFX was finished as well

Flash helping WW with her sword is Snyder. Face plant joke after is Whedon

Whedon reshoot of Flash replying with 'does he mean me?' when Steppenwolf mentions the Old Gods blood is cut

WW doing her arm thing, Flash being taken by the demons, Cyborg taking over the vehicle and shooting at Steppenwolf and the flood is Snyder

Reshot element from Wan of Aquaman emerging from the water to kick Steppenwolf before turning back to try to help slow down the flooding.

'did he just bail?' is ADR in, not part of Snyder original cut.

Meeting up with Gordon and Cyborg coming back with the box is Snyder. Some scenes trimmed down

Steppenwolf speech about finding the last box is mostly the same in Snyder.

The gang going to the Batcave is Whedon, there was an extended scene with Flash and Alfred and Flash hugs Alfred some reason.

The gang talking about the nature of the boxes and bringing back Superman is Whedon. Gal was not available during this time as she was doing press tour for Wonder Woman so her double was her stand in and even did some acting and that bit with her hitting Batman. In the wide shots if you look carefully you can still see that it's not Gal.

The footage of Gal was shot on a later date with green screen and composited in

Batman talking to Alfred about Superman was Whedon

Batman overlooking the ship is Snyder. Batman talking to Wonder Woman about the plan overlooking the kryptonian ship is Whedon

the Lois shot from earlier in the opening montage movie was a part of this sequence as Alfred attempts to call her as well. Snyder

break into the kryptonian ship was a longer, Cyborgs dad fakes a code red to get everyone out of the lab so the gang can get in without any major issues. There was some more additional dialogue with Flash and Aquaman. Snyder with a small chance that this may be in the extended

preparing Superman body for the ship is Snyder.

deleted scene - Cyborg having a premonition during his countdown. During the count of 'one' he starts to see things of possibly future events such as the end of the League, knightmare world and more importantly Darkseid.

Superman resurrection and battle with the league members is mostly Snyder with bits trimmed down.

Flash mentioning 'pet semenetary' is Whedon

Flash actively tries to kick Superman during their fight which was cut

Anytime Superman is talking during this is Whedon, even 'do you bleed?'

Batman making a quip about if he's bleeding is Whedon

Steppenwolf stealing the last box is the same in all versions

Superman coming home to his farm with Lois is Snyder.

Gang discussing their plan of attack now is Whedon

Batman and Wonder Woman talking about leadership and her fixing his arm is all Whedon

Superman talking about the ring is Snyder and cut. Superman talking to Lois in the field is Whedon. Not sure if Martha showing up to meet her son is Whedon or Snyder

Steppenwolf preparing the unification is the same in all versions

Cyborg finding the location is Whedon which leads to the gang getting on the ship is Snyder

deleted scene of Superman coming back to the kryptonian ship and getting his suit back. VFX was finished so maybe extended version

Aquaman with the lasso of Truth is all Whedon, Gal again wasn't here so body double in the wide shot with Gal elements being shot later

Batman taking down the shield and the league helping each other out to reach Steppenwolf is Snyder. Close up of Wonder Woman smiling is a Whedon as well Batman making quips during this scene

Deleted scenes - showing various people around the worlds reacting to the unification process as red skies and lightening start to happen (Martha/Lois, Cyborg Dad, Gordon, Aquaman village at the beginning, london and so forth)

Trailer scene with Wonder Woman saying 'shall we?' with Aquaman and Cyborg was adjusted. 'Shall we' was cut and replaced with the new Whedon line

Cyborg and Flash stuff here is mostly now all Whedon

Batman telling Flash to get people to safety is Whedon

lots of Wonder Woman and Aquaman fighting are adjusted or reordered but still Snyder

Superman coming back is all Whedon. There was a wide shot of Superman during the 'I like truth' which was removed but the final edit of how it plays out is better in my opinion

Superman with the slow mo punch dodge is Snyder. As before anything with Superman talking is Whedon during this finale

Original previs was Wonder Woman cutting off Steppenwolf head but later changed. Steppenwolf demise was reworked a few times

Steppenwolf fear demise through the boomtube is Whedon

there was concept art showing the trinity looking through the end of the boomtube revealing Darkseid. Unsure if this element was ever filmed as the movie itself never had it in any version I saw.

The slow mo shot of all of them with Flash fist bumping Cyborg is Snyder

close up with the trinity is three different elements composited together as the actors were not available at the same time.

the end montage is Snyder (yes, even that weird run Flash does) with Whedon element being Wonder Woman stopping the robbery in London

THE END

Flash doing the race with Superman = Whedon Lex discussing forming their own league = Snyder

My main thought which was a better version:

I believe that Snyder original version was more leading towards a UC style edit like BvS as I felt there was a lot of moments for the movie to breath but with some wtf ness in characters moments (flash basically standing around and doing nothing when he could do stuff) where as I feel Whedon had a lot more character beats and dialogue between them to punch it up.

I'm not too sure if there will be an extended version but if there was I can easily see an additional 10-20 minutes.

I definitely want to see this version of the movie now.

Mother of Jaysus. :eek: It looks like when it could come out on Blu-ray; I will definitely look forward to seeing how this movie is composed by Snyder.

IncognitoMan · 18-11-2017 01:41AM

techdiver wrote: »

I actually quite liked the fight between superman and the league, especially the bit with the Flash running behind him and his eye following. That was cool.

Yes there is good bits in there still.

More the way they brought him back and then how quickly he recovered from his death by going back to his family home for what felt like no time at all.

Hopefully there's an extended cut down the line because I think there's a lot of film on the editing room floor to get it under the 2 hours.

IncognitoMan · 18-11-2017 02:00AM

Nice work dublinman1990.

Where did you find all that?

Victor · 18-11-2017 07:17AM

I never realised Bruce Wayne wore as much make-up as Wonder Woman and more than Diana Price.

I think they over do the Superman bit.

Brief_Lives · 18-11-2017 08:51AM

I liked the movie... A lot..
Aquabro is the business...

Cgi steppenwolf looked excellent and menacing..
Cgi upper lip was very distracting..

I was expecting the movie to be 2.5 hours long... It's wayyy shorter...

Loved the end credit scene... LOVED IT

Drumpot · 18-11-2017 09:32AM

FunLover18 wrote: »

No. You don't get to blame the audience's attention span for bad filmmaking. I haven't seen Justice League, so I'm not judging it but 1)if a filmaker can't tell a cohesive story within two hours, they're at fault. That is the medium within they have chosen to work, those are the parameters. The average film length has NEVER gone above 130 minutes so this isn't some new phenomenon, this is how it has always been. 1)I'm fine with extended editions like LotR where you get bonus material because the theatrical realeases still make sense as a whole. But this nonsense of extended editions fleshing out plot points is bollix. As for lack of diversity and audiences wanting the same thing, I give you Logan and Deadpool, both massive successes that faced little to no "resistance" and the former much more in line with what WB want to do but much more successful. 2)he success/failure of WB and the DCEU has nothing to do with what audiences want, audiences want to be entertained (We haven't got together behind your back and come up a list) and WB have thus far failed to do so for the most part.

Like/don't like a film fine, have a discussion about why certain elements worked/didn't work but don't pigeon hole everyone who disagrees with you into a collective and and say it's their fault the movie you like isn't doing well.

1)You chose a bad example because the Lord of the rings theatrical releases were nearly 3 hours long, which is well beyond your arbitrary 130min threshold to tell a story. Its more comparable with BVS extended addition that would of just about matched the theatrical release of LOTR and it would of been a very cohesive movie.

The very fact that most movies have a 2 hour threshold is mainly for monetary reasons (more bums on seats) and attention spans. If a director has a vision that requires more character and world building to tell their story, why should they trim it down because of some ridiculous concept that makes zero sense whereby people need it to be less then 2 hours ?

Logan was only made for a couple of unique reasons that wouldn't apply here. The success of Deadpool, the fact that the studio had already flogged the Wolverine horse for over a decade and its main actor was pleading with them for an R rated movie for years. In many regards a fourth reason would be that the studio had little to lose because they had already made a fortune from the character and the main actor was not going to be around again so there was no sequel potential.

Deadpool was an exception , so its not really a good comparison to a comic book character like superman or Batman that have particular followers. It had no expectation and was lightening in a bottle unlike any other superhero movie ever.

2) You say that Success has noting to do with what audience wants but audience wants to be entertained ? What are you saying here ? Studios only care about giving audiences what they want, they don't care if its good or bad once it reaches the widest amount of people. That's why so many movies that cost upwards of 100m will have a runtime limited to 2 hours, lowish parental rating and some double entendre moments for adults. The 2 hour threshold has nothing to do with what makes a good movie, I am not sure why people have that in their heads!

BVS wasn't a good movie because I liked it, it was just a movie I really enjoyed. I don't have a problem with people not enjoying it, I am highlighting peoples contradicting reasons given for not liking it. Its runtime wasn't bad, was less the LOTR movies. The "Martha" plot wasn't anymore flakey then lets say having to watch a hobbit for 12 hours trekking somewhere that he could of done in a few minutes with a giant bird. But the difference is that if you enjoy the journey you don't care about the minor things that don't matter. I felt after watching the movie a second and subsequent time, the Martha plot was more powerful, but others chose to just hate on the movie and that's their choice which is fine.

Justice League was a bit of fun, but lacked the tension, grit and stakes that BVS had and felt less epic IMO. I thought BVS was very different to Marvel stuff and enjoyed it for its differences. I feel WW and this were a step back into the "safezone" for DC and I understand why. But its exactly why we will see less Logan's and Deadpool, studios are SELDOM rewarded for trying major things differently.

Brief_Lives · 18-11-2017 10:00AM

Brief_Lives wrote: »

I was expecting the movie to be 2.5 hours long... It's wayyy shorter...

I just checked, the run time is supposed to be 2hrs50mins...
in the cinema I was in, the trailers started at 21.45 and we were leaving the cinema at midnight?
we probably got 2hrs...

Did we miss anything, anyone else confirm this?

techdiver · 18-11-2017 10:09AM

Brief_Lives wrote: »

I just checked, the run time is supposed to be 2hrs50mins...
in the cinema I was in, the trailers started at 21.45 and we were leaving the cinema at midnight?
we probably got 2hrs...

Did we miss anything, anyone else confirm this?

Official runtime is 2 hours. Warner Bros. CEO Kevin Tsujihara mandated a 2 hour runtime. So the final movie probably got butchered and required reshoots from Whedon to make it work. Many of the story arcs I was hoping for never materialised as a result of this.

Whilst I really enjoyed the movie as is I would like to see what the original cut.

Notorious · 18-11-2017 10:27AM

I have very mixed feelings about the Justice League. I think it was a big improvement on Batman V Superman, and I did enjoy watching it. But at the same time if I flicked onto it on tv, I wouldn’t watch it again.

Something about Cavill didn’t sit right with me, and as I was watching I couldn’t figure out why. It looked like he was CGI, and initially he was delivering some of his lines as if he was a robot. I never noticed this in previous Superman films.

I’m not convinced by Affleck as the Batman. In one scene he is cold and serious, in the next scene he’s trying to joke around. It didn’t work for me. I think he’s an improved since BvS, but he is miles off Christian Bale’s Batman.

Both Aquaman and the Flash were very good characters. As others have mentioned, a lot of the humor in the film didn’t work for me but I loved the Superman and Flash racing scenes.
As others have mentioned, the films pacing was odd; everything seemed extremely rushed. The story itself could’ve been fleshed out more. I’m a passive comic book fan, so I know nothing about the villain. Where was he from, who was he? Is he just a villain used to introduce the Justice League?

There were times when the use of a green screen was far too obvious and in this day and age there shouldn’t be issues here. I think the fighting scenes were shot very well, and the CGI on the Flash scenes was brilliant.

I will watch another entry into the series, but I’m not excited about it. I think the MCU still holds the comic to film crown.

techdiver · 18-11-2017 10:41AM

Notorious wrote: »

I’m not convinced by Affleck as the Batman. In one scene he is cold and serious, in the next scene he’s trying to joke around. It didn’t work for me. I think he’s an improved since BvS, but he is miles off Christian Bale’s Batman.

In my opinion Bale was a weak Batman. Affleck embodies the "real" Batman. But you know what they say about opinions.

Notorious wrote: »

I’m a passive comic book fan, so I know nothing about the villain. Where was he from, who was he? Is he just a villain used to introduce the Justice League?

Steppenwolf is from Apokolips and is the uncle of Darkseid who is considered the top villan for the justice league (think the DC version of Thanos, but Darkseid came first

)

HandsomeBob · 18-11-2017 12:40PM

IncognitoMan wrote: »

Yeah that whole chunk of film from where they start talking about the possibility of using a mother box to bring back Superman right up until the moment Superman appears in costume isn't great at all. I expected that the way they brought him back might be well... daft and it was.

Would love to know was that a Snyder or Whedon idea. You would think Snyder but it seems like most of Superman's stuff was re-shot because his CGI lip kept showing up :pac:

I was disappointed myself with how he was handled. Of all the things I was worried about, how they would handle Clark wasn't one of them. His introduction to the fight with Steppenwolf was sh1t if I'm being frank.

It should have been epic. What we got instead was a sh1t sidebar quip so I wouldn't be surprised if this was Whedon's work.

I know it's ridiculous but it really upset me. I've supported the DCEU for long enough so felt quite cheated by how they handled him.

Brief_Lives · 18-11-2017 01:09PM

techdiver wrote: »

Brief_Lives wrote: »

I just checked, the run time is supposed to be 2hrs50mins...
in the cinema I was in, the trailers started at 21.45 and we were leaving the cinema at midnight?
we probably got 2hrs...

Did we miss anything, anyone else confirm this?

Official runtime is 2 hours. Warner Bros. CEO Kevin Tsujihara mandated a 2 hour runtime. So the final movie probably got butchered and required reshoots from Whedon to make it work. Many of the story arcs I was hoping for never materialised as a result of this.

Whilst I really enjoyed the movie as is I would like to see what the original cut.

Wow... Have WB learned nothing...
there is so much of the story missing..

At this stage you feel affect is just gonna finish his contract..

Good film but it could have been great...

sky88 · 18-11-2017 02:06PM

A enjoyable watch i thought expected it to be terrible but theres a lot to like. Still a lot of bad stuff steppenwolf wasnt a great villian i thought.

Its very clear which scenes is joss and which is snyders at times

HandsomeBob · 18-11-2017 03:55PM

Supes return to earth in superman returns was my kind of idea of what I wanted to see here. Still one of the most exhilarating scenes ever in the genre.

dublinman1990 · 18-11-2017 10:21PM

RTÉ have a competition on The Ray Darcy Show tonight for the release of Justice League in cinemas.

Have a look here!

https://www.rte.ie/tv/competitions/2017/1114/919936-the-ray-darcy-show/

EDIT: A woman without naming names had won this prize tonight. She thrilled when she won it over the phone.

FunLover18 · 18-11-2017 10:36PM

Drumpot wrote: »

1)You chose a bad example because the Lord of the rings theatrical releases were nearly 3 hours long, which is well beyond your arbitrary 130min threshold to tell a story. Its more comparable with BVS extended addition that would of just about matched the theatrical release of LOTR and it would of been a very cohesive movie.

The very fact that most movies have a 2 hour threshold is mainly for monetary reasons (more bums on seats) and attention spans. If a director has a vision that requires more character and world building to tell their story, why should they trim it down because of some ridiculous concept that makes zero sense whereby people need it to be less then 2 hours ?

Logan was only made for a couple of unique reasons that wouldn't apply here. The success of Deadpool, the fact that the studio had already flogged the Wolverine horse for over a decade and its main actor was pleading with them for an R rated movie for years. In many regards a fourth reason would be that the studio had little to lose because they had already made a fortune from the character and the main actor was not going to be around again so there was no sequel potential.

Deadpool was an exception , so its not really a good comparison to a comic book character like superman or Batman that have particular followers. It had no expectation and was lightening in a bottle unlike any other superhero movie ever.

2) You say that Success has noting to do with what audience wants but audience wants to be entertained ? What are you saying here ? Studios only care about giving audiences what they want, they don't care if its good or bad once it reaches the widest amount of people. That's why so many movies that cost upwards of 100m will have a runtime limited to 2 hours, lowish parental rating and some double entendre moments for adults. The 2 hour threshold has nothing to do with what makes a good movie, I am not sure why people have that in their heads!

BVS wasn't a good movie because I liked it, it was just a movie I really enjoyed. I don't have a problem with people not enjoying it, I am highlighting peoples contradicting reasons given for not liking it. Its runtime wasn't bad, was less the LOTR movies. The "Martha" plot wasn't anymore flakey then lets say having to watch a hobbit for 12 hours trekking somewhere that he could of done in a few minutes with a giant bird. But the difference is that if you enjoy the journey you don't care about the minor things that don't matter. I felt after watching the movie a second and subsequent time, the Martha plot was more powerful, but others chose to just hate on the movie and that's their choice which is fine.

Justice League was a bit of fun, but lacked the tension, grit and stakes that BVS had and felt less epic IMO. I thought BVS was very different to Marvel stuff and enjoyed it for its differences. I feel WW and this were a step back into the "safezone" for DC and I understand why. But its exactly why we will see less Logan's and Deadpool, studios are SELDOM rewarded for trying major things differently.

Yep, can't argue with that. That's a really bad example on my part. Genuinely shocked though that the theatrical releases were that long, that's insane! However I would personally argue that unlike BvS, LotR totally warrants it given the source material. The issue with BvS and the extended edition (which I haven't seen) is that having seen the theatrical I don't think there are any plot points in BvS which warrant an extended version.

Audiences do have the attention span for long films, that has been proven with the likes of LotR and the Dark Knight trilogy, but in order to hold people's attention for that long the film has to be not just different from anything else on offer, it has to be pretty damn good and I do not think that that is unreasonable. As you said yourself BvS wasn't a particularly good film, enjoyable maybe (I'm not going to get into that discussion) but it was lacking. Compare it to The Dark Knight which as an identical runtime of two and a half hours (1 minute difference according to imdb) I think it's pretty clear why one was more successful than the other and it has nothing to do with the audience's attention span.

As mentioned previously, I haven't seen Justice League but from what I've heard, even from your own reasonably positive verdict, it's not a movie that would be made that had the studio released a longer cut.

18-11-2017 11:58PM

It was pretty awful, in fairness.

A short runtime and too many characters meant that everyone had such little screentime and character development, outside of Wonder Woman, Superman, and Batman.

The Flash just seemed to have been written as a stereotypical autistic person.

There's also a big issue; when you start making Superman as strong as he is in this, it totally negates any sense of tension or anxiety there may be.

Once he showed up in the final sequence, that was pretty much it.

Wouldn't be surprised if the DC movie universe gets canned now, or at least the Justice League strand, after supposedly vastly underperforming.

youngblood · 19-11-2017 12:06AM

I really liked this.....

I dont know where all the hate and bad reviews are coming from but anyone who's seen all the recent DC movies, Wonder Woman aside, this is the best attempt at a solid superhero movie by DCEU.

Wonder woman was excellent,

her intro action scene looked as if it was lifted straight from a comic strip

, really well done

Aquaman was good for the most part, still think they dont know how fun-aquabro to make him yet-underwater scenes for action dont work well,

the creation of space effect underwater to talk

was good

Batman suffered hugely from a character point from the cut & paste job of this movie, Affleck is still good

Cavill, finally the Superman we deserve, never warmed to him until this movie, the use of the Original

Superman theme tune twice, and the Batman theme tune were wonderful

Cyborg.....he's grand for the most part,

not sure if it was his character or his acting ability but he couldve been replaced with any generic hero

Loved the snapshot of the

Green Lantern Corp fighting Steppenwolf's original coming

thought they'd make a proper/surprise appearance on the final battle field.

The runtime of this movie is bang on, if it had been longer it wouldve just been just another opportunity to feck this mish/mash of a movie up even more

This movie also suffers from underwhelming Villain fatique....Never as menacing as it should've been or creating the urgency we need before the villain problem is resolved. Its a common villain problem in all recent supermovies, this movie no different

When I say mish mash, the movie is clearly cut and inserted with additional scenes which everyone knows before going into the movie, had been shot when Synder had to leave. Although normally, reshoots and additional scenes are common and arent this noticeable as they are in this movie.

When I say noticeable its both visual and to do with characters/character development.

Visual like the scene of Barry's witty lines which were clearly added in after due to the change in Barry's hairstyle and 1 shot I noticed of Cavill's moustache. His moustache for the main part in not noticeable at all or as distracting as others have made out.Additional Wheedon dialogue scenes were blazingly obvious additions that dont work well. Character wise, this movie doesnt flow like other established

superhero movies because of the cuts and reshoots and possibly poor writing.

Considering my expectations were on the floor I actually came out smiling, they could've done much worse here and they could yet pull a decent movie out of this franchise yet!

I left the cinema with Hope!

(Not pure rage like Man of Steel, BvS etc)

IncognitoMan · 19-11-2017 12:46AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

There's also a big issue;
when you start making Superman as strong as he is in this, it totally negates any sense of tension or anxiety there may be.

Once he showed up in the final sequence, that was pretty much it.

Nah,

It would have been lunacy to have had steppenwolf be able to go toe to toe with Superman.

Darkseid is a couple of levels above Steppenwolf so you couldn't possibly have Superman struggle with him and be able to go with Darkseid.

Steppenwolf is a first wave villain. You don't send out the big guns first.

This one is about getting the league together. Their true test must come later.

Optimalprimerib · 19-11-2017 07:13AM

I need to post her to remind me that I watched it already. That was forgettable. A very simple story that seemed surprisingly low stakes considering they needed a team together to fight.

Why is it so important that humour needs to be sprinkled through all of these movies. It was very forced in this with the flash never really endearing to me.

I was constantly thinking that the only reason this even exists is because marvel are doing it and DC need to do it as well. Worst one so far imo, too dull.

Notorious · 19-11-2017 09:36AM

youngblood wrote: »

Cavill, finally the Superman we deserve, never warmed to him until this movie, the use of the Original

I felt the opposite. I thought Cavill played the part very well until Dawn of Justice. His performance didn’t sit well with me in Justice League; he delivered his lines almost robotically. His character didn’t work for me this time.

TerrorFirmer · 19-11-2017 10:25AM

Notorious wrote: »

I felt the opposite. I thought Cavill played the part very well until Dawn of Justice. His performance didn’t sit well with me in Justice League; he delivered his lines almost robotically. His character didn’t work for me this time.

That was actually the most noticeable standout for me in Justice League - I felt Cavill was seriously and very jarringly phoning it in, which is odd because he was perfectly decent in MOS and BvS. Does the controversial mustache have anything to do with it? Who knows, but I felt he let the film down a lot.

The film itself - not bad at all. I felt the first 20 or 30 minutes were very ropy but it picked up well after that and despite half the cast being extremely underdeveloped it all worked quite well considering the lean 120 minute runtime for a movie of this scope.

Ben Affleck's Batman is a bit different than his last outing in BvS - not as dark, jaded or menacing courtesy of some (not entirely unwelcome) injected humor. But he's still a good batman in my opinion, and I do like the way in which they portray that he's most definitely 'over the hill' in the pivotal role. He's done a fine job and it's a shame that his excellent turn in BvS was overshadowed by the poor reception to that movie overall.

Wonder Woman is very likable, I could see people being 50/50 on The Flash but for me he fell on the right side of the coin and I enjoyed the character. Jason Momoa is good as Aquaman though while I felt Flash's backstory was told very well in an extremely limited window, Aquaman's felt horribly clunky with really poor exposition.

Wasn't gone on Cyborg. I get that the nature of the character means he's not going to be the most dynamic personality, but he felt a little flat and generic to me - not helped by some patchy CGI in spots.

Villian - Steppenwolf - was grand. Nothing radical or new here at all, more of the usual "I've come to destroy your planet because I can" that is the backbone of most superhero movies. But good cast and decent action mean I can overlook this one, because the movie flows quite well in general.

Overall I enjoyed it. Truth be told I've always thought The Avengers was horribly over-rated and a poor relation to most of the individual Marvel movies, so for me Justice League was no better or worse, and just as entertaining.

And - as out of place as it seemed in the context of Afflecks turn in BvS - the line

Uggghhhh....something's definitely bleeding

did make me burst out laughing.

So yeah, not without it's faults but all things considered I'd say it's a very solid 7/10.

techdiver · 19-11-2017 10:53AM

I'm actually surprised that here on boards that this is being generally better received than the critical reception.

Looking back over all the reaction here seems to me to be generally positive

At the end of the day, it is fun and an enjoyable watch which is the main purpose of a movie. I'm going to see it again today which usually is a good sign l for me.

ancapailldorcha · 19-11-2017 12:03PM

I went to see it last night with low expectations.

I thought it was ok. It wasn't nearly as bad as I had braced myself for. However, what DC are trying to do is to emulate the MCU in a small fraction of the time and this was quite detrimental to the film. It's at its best when the characters are still sizing each other up and interacting with each other but there is just far too little of this.

Cyborg and The Flash weren't given much in the way of plot development though credit for finally getting a version of Aquaman out there who's not pathetic.

Steppenwolf was a fairly functional villain but these characters do feel a bit overpowered which hampers the action sequences a tad in my opinion. On Themyscira, he could probably just have sat sipping tea and the Amazons wouldn't have been able to scratch him. The MCU seems to have found a good balance toning down some of the more powerful characters in that they're still powerful, not just invincible.

It's basically what it says on the tin but I hope DC try to use the upcoming films to develop it a bit more given that some of these character are quite enjoyable on the big screen and there's room for some interesting themes to be explored like Cyborg's life and humanity. The lack of the weak humor might hopefully be a good omen in this regard.

q2xv9rjei4awgb · 19-11-2017 12:56PM

That opening scene....Batman referring to Alfred, calling him by his name, in front of a criminal.

Turtyturd · 19-11-2017 06:00PM

Isabelle Helpful Variable wrote: »

That opening scene....Batman referring to Alfred, calling him by his name, in front of a criminal.

Lois calling out ‘Clark’ in front of two police officers was much worse.

Goodshape · 19-11-2017 06:22PM

All over the place but, given rock bottom expectations, it was an enjoyable enough spectacle tbh. Although I too long for the days of wind-up mechanical penguins.

Henry Cavil's CGI moustache remover was dreadful, distracting, comical at times.

Gal Gadot is the only one who really seems to embody the role she has. Pretty flawless.

There was some silly stuff about a box, but I don't think it mattered.

tunguska · 19-11-2017 07:24PM

I really enjoyed this. Went in with low expectations after reading the reviews but I was suprised how enjoyable it is. Plot was a a bit LOTR-esque and the villian wasnt the best but Gal Gadot was great, aqua man gets all the best lines and Ben affeck is actually turning out to be a very likable Batman, IMO anyway......all in all its an entertaining pre christmas movie

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