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Eircode - Why did they bother?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,559 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Older people are much more capable than you think.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,453 ✭✭✭Shenshen


    Patww79 wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    You make it sound like naming roads and numbering houses is a fantastically absurd idea.... I would have though,t personally, that it would have made a sensible starting point, rather than assigning random identity numbers to houses, and even then getting some wrong with no way of fixing it.

    Just as an aside, my house has a road and street number. And yet, somehow, the Eircode assigned to it still won't find it on a map.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,932 ✭✭✭irishgeo


    People are saying small businesses aren't using it. Google eircode bandb.

    Loads of them.

    Honestly the people complaining people aren't using it. Maybe if you asked people what's your eircode when going to their house. They might have to go look for it. But you can say great I can put into Google maps and ill get straight to your door. Educate people on it. Not just say it's useless. I know a guy who uses it as a carpet cleaner and floor sander it's ideal for finding rural houses.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 165 ✭✭PDVerse


    I see. You could though, with "terms and conditions" so to speak, to exonerate An Post/Eircode in the event someone is disappointed they didn't guess their area right. Just like this online map is available for perusal.

    You are very wrong on this point (below), and I think that helps me understand the whole flaws in the system and how it failed to be adopted by people around me.



    The areas do exist, simply, they have evolving boundaries.

    Eircode is a concept, and not a simple one either since there's the concept of "areas" embedded in it, and all other important factors.

    You simply cannot expect Joe and Josephine to buy in to a concept without understanding it.

    Companies got it : pay money, get your data set, save money. Who cares how the data set is got at.

    For people it's different, and you see, even though you won't admit it because the little bouncy markers are impressive, and they tick some boxes, a lot of people outside of the business sphere have failed to understand it all, and so they don't know and use their Eircode.

    So by showing them the map with Area codes (there's a lingo to it, oh yeah, routing keys), you are helping people understand the concept, and showing people that actually, one can make sense of their new code.

    It's easier to get someone to own a concept by showing them what is, and what isn't. So by showing the map, you're showing them "this is you", and "this is not you". "This is your neighbour out by the mountain", "this is your niece near Clonmel", "this is Maura out in co Mayo" and "there is the code for the cousins near Maura, they have the same prefix". "Their code is not like yours".


    This would be a minimum, to ensure people can understand the rationale behind an Eircode that looks nonsensical in an individual bubble, and relate it to themselves.

    There is a point in doing that, if the intention is really that everyone learn and start using their Eircode, not just businesses.

    Of course, you could just not care.

    I'll deal with your claims one by one
    1. Eircode didn't care about less technically savvy, isolated, older communities etc.
    Fact: There was a specific progam run by The Wheel that did exactly that. An Eircode Champion was appointed in each County and they liased with community groups, e.g. friends of the elderly, and explained Eircode to them. They brought the message to their members. That was part of the 3.77million that was spent explaining Eircode via Radio, TV and a direct letter to every household.

    2. Eircodes aren't being adopted
    Fact: They are. No, it isn't just "companies". People in rural areas use Eircode more frequently than people in urban areas.
    Adoption will continue to increase as more and more organisations implement Eircode and ask people for them in order to provide efficient services.

    3. Eircodes adoption is primarily affected by memorability of Eircode.
    Fact: I don't know my car reg, I do know my mobile number. Why? Frequency of use. Short term memory is affected by memory chunking, but long term memory is primarily about frequency of use. The more frequently people are asked for their Eircode the more likely they are to recall it. It really is as simple as that. Why do people in the UK know their Postcode? Because they are asked for it all the time.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 369 ✭✭maccydoodies


    Get this. Eir, who have the contract for the rollout of FTTH through the National Broadband plan dont have their eircode on their website. If they do its hard to find. I converse with someone daily for work who works in eir and they don't have it on the siggy. Numpties, Yet if you contact them thats the first thing they ask you.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,705 ✭✭✭Mountainsandh


    PDVerse;
    1. Eircode didn't care about less technically savvy, isolated, older communities etc.
    Fact: There was a specific progam run by The Wheel that did exactly that. An Eircode Champion was appointed in each County and they liased with community groups, e.g. friends of the elderly, and explained Eircode to them. They brought the message to their members. That was part of the 3.77million that was spent explaining Eircode via Radio, TV and a direct letter to every household.
    Never heard of that. Didn't work anyway, since like I said, no one I know uses their Eircode.
    2. Eircodes aren't being adopted
    Fact: They are. No, it isn't just "companies". People in rural areas use Eircode more frequently than people in urban areas.
    Adoption will continue to increase as more and more organisations implement Eircode and ask people for them in order to provide efficient services.
    Source ?
    3. Eircodes adoption is primarily affected by memorability of Eircode.
    Fact: I don't know my car reg, I do know my mobile number. Why? Frequency of use. Short term memory is affected by memory chunking, but long term memory is primarily about frequency of use. The more frequently people are asked for their Eircode the more likely they are to recall it. It really is as simple as that. Why do people in the UK know their Postcode? Because they are asked for it all the time.
    [/QUOTE]

    My car reg makes sense, therefore it's easier to remember.
    Assign meaning to a random sequence to memorize it quicker and more efficiently. It's not a new idea in fairness, if you explore the concepts of memory, whether short or long term.

    Mnemonics, cognitive strategies, chunking, and repetition.

    You know this of course, since your first argument is that people were sent to "explain" things. Evidently this aspect was not very successful.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,705 ✭✭✭Mountainsandh


    TheChizler wrote: »
    Older people are much more capable than you think.

    I am not saying older people are incapable of remembering Eircodes.
    I am positively saying that the older generation, myself included at 45, are much more likely to buy into something if they understand it, or to rephrase, much more likely to question the rationale behind a new initiative rather than just take it at face value.

    That's not so much about ability as procedure, and trust maybe also.

    I don't know your age, but if you are of my generation and up, do you just take every government initiative at face value, do you buy into it immediately and deliver on it ?

    Are people really suggesting that we should just accept whatever is presented to us, do as we're told (learn Eircode dammit), although we don't understand the concept in the first place ?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    Get this. Eir, who have the contract for the rollout of FTTH through the National Broadband plan dont have their eircode on their website. If they do its hard to find. I converse with someone daily for work who works in eir and they don't have it on the siggy. Numpties, Yet if you contact them thats the first thing they ask you.

    Have you need to visit the eir call centre?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,549 ✭✭✭maryishere



    My car reg makes sense, therefore it's easier to remember.
    Assign meaning to a random sequence to memorize it quicker and more efficiently. It's not a new idea in fairness, if you explore the concepts of memory, whether short or long term.

    Mnemonics, cognitive strategies, chunking, and repetition.

    Correct. Anyway, the reasons Eircode is a failure are fairly obvious.
    When it was introduced hauliers repeatedly expressed reservations about it. Quote "A survey showed 96 per cent don’t use Eircode. The Freight Transport Association Ireland said the random nature of the code system (adjacent properties have no numerical correlation with each other’s Eircodes) means it’s unsuitable for a delivery system."

    An Post say that less than 5 per cent of mail customers are using Eircode.

    "What was the point of spending €38 million on something so few are using? Sadly, we know no one will be taken to task over this. We specialise in rewarding mediocrity and shrugging off failures. Why would anyone be compelled to change that culture of failure when there are no consequences?"

    Eircode is simply another €38m down the drain when even the fire brigade does not use it, according to the OP when he rung with a chimney fire. A well designed post code system would have been a good idea. Eircode cost €20 million more than was forecast.
    Poorly designed postcode system should already have been returned to sender. I wonder do the few posters here in favour of Eircode work for Eircode because surveys show only a few per cent of people even know their own eircode.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/eircode-there-goes-another-38m-down-the-drain-1.2972751


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 369 ✭✭maccydoodies


    Have you need to visit the eir call centre?

    Not at all but I do need to send them letters through my work and I like to have the full address on them. Lets face it Eircode is here to stay. It might take a few years to catch on but its here to stay.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,611 ✭✭✭server down


    I am not saying older people are incapable of remembering Eircodes.
    I am positively saying that the older generation, myself included at 45, are much more likely to buy into something if they understand it, or to rephrase, much more likely to question the rationale behind a new initiative rather than just take it at face value.

    That's not so much about ability as procedure, and trust maybe also.

    I don't know your age, but if you are of my generation and up, do you just take every government initiative at face value, do you buy into it immediately and deliver on it ?

    Are people really suggesting that we should just accept whatever is presented to us, do as we're told (learn Eircode dammit), although we don't understand the concept in the first place ?

    45? I thought you were posting like a 70 year old. The internet is that old. Most 40 year olds have smart phones.

    I think you are creating an issue that doesn’t exist. You admit eircode is useful to you. You seem to think the rest of the population can’t hack it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 165 ✭✭PDVerse


    maryishere wrote: »
    Correct. Anyway, the reasons Eircode is a failure are fairly obvious.
    When it was introduced hauliers repeatedly expressed reservations about it. Quote "A survey showed 96 per cent don’t use Eircode. The Freight Transport Association Ireland said the random nature of the code system (adjacent properties have no numerical correlation with each other’s Eircodes) means it’s unsuitable for a delivery system."

    An Post say that less than 5 per cent of mail customers are using Eircode.

    "What was the point of spending €38 million on something so few are using? Sadly, we know no one will be taken to task over this. We specialise in rewarding mediocrity and shrugging off failures. Why would anyone be compelled to change that culture of failure when there are no consequences?"

    Eircode is used over one million times per week. Couriers are the largest users. The only failure here is your refusal to accept reality.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    Eircode cant use adjacent numbering as

    - its premises specific another premises between two would knock it out of kilter


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 165 ✭✭PDVerse


    PDVerse;

    Never heard of that. Didn't work anyway, since like I said, no one I know uses their Eircode.


    Source ?



    My car reg makes sense, therefore it's easier to remember.
    Assign meaning to a random sequence to memorize it quicker and more efficiently. It's not a new idea in fairness, if you explore the concepts of memory, whether short or long term.

    Mnemonics, cognitive strategies, chunking, and repetition.

    You know this of course, since your first argument is that people were sent to "explain" things. Evidently this aspect was not very successful.
    The fact you never heard of it is irrelevant, it happened.
    You weren't a target of the program, you received a letter to your house that explained Eircode to you.
    "Some people aren't using Eircode" is not a refutation of "Eircode is being used extensively". That's a logic fail.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,549 ✭✭✭maryishere


    PDVerse wrote: »
    Eircode is used over one million times per week. Couriers are the largest users. The only failure here is your refusal to accept reality.

    Considering there are over 20 million items delivered per week then eircode is an expensive failure. Except for the scammers behind it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    maryishere wrote: »

    An Post say that less than 5 per cent of mail customers are using Eircode.


    Not at all but I do need to send them letters through my work and I like to have the full address on them. Lets face it Eircode is here to stay. It might take a few years to catch on but its here to stay.

    You both seem to miss an important point. Eircodes were neither designed for, intended for use for nor needed for deliveries by An Post.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,549 ✭✭✭maryishere


    Why has nobody been fired over Eircode?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    maryishere wrote: »
    Considering there are over 20 million items delivered per week then eircode is an expensive failure. Except for the scammers behind it.

    That makes no sense. Millions of courier deliveries have used it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    I though Mary you lived in the UK Brexit and all that???


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,549 ✭✭✭maryishere


    snowflaker wrote: »
    I though Mary you lived in the UK Brexit and all that???
    You thought wrong.


    You both seem to miss an important point. Eircodes were neither designed for, intended for use for nor needed for deliveries by An Post.

    You miss the point. "Freight and supermarket companies were expected to use it widely, yet in the run up to its launch hauliers repeatedly expressed reservations about it. A survey showed 96 per cent don’t use Eircode. The Freight Transport Association Ireland said the random nature of the code system (adjacent properties have no numerical correlation with each other’s Eircodes) means it’s unsuitable for a delivery system."


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,768 ✭✭✭✭tomwaterford


    maryishere wrote: »
    You miss the point. "Freight and supermarket companies were expected to use it widely, yet in the run up to its launch hauliers repeatedly expressed reservations about it. A survey showed 96 per cent don’t use Eircode. The Freight Transport Association Ireland said the random nature of the code system (adjacent properties have no numerical correlation with each other’s Eircodes) means it’s unsuitable for a delivery system."

    When was this survey?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    maryishere wrote: »
    Why has nobody been fired over Eircode?

    Ach,Mary. Loads of people use it. It has made receipt of deliveries painless for thousands of people, emergency services have reached people quicker.

    This is just contrarianism for the sake of it.


    Many are happy with it. We use it. We can cope with it. Worth every penny for the benefits it has added to our lives. It's working and it's here to stay. Just live with it. There are more important injustices and problems in the country that are real.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    Couriers in Rural Ireland certainly use it!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,549 ✭✭✭maryishere


    That makes no sense. Millions of courier deliveries have used it.
    And hundreds of millions have not.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    In fact, I like Eircode even more now!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,922 ✭✭✭snowflaker


    maryishere wrote: »
    And hundreds of millions have not.

    cos they are not based in the Irish republic???


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,549 ✭✭✭maryishere


    When was this survey?
    Read the article, I gave you the link earlier.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    maryishere wrote: »
    You thought wrong.





    You miss the point. "Freight and supermarket companies were expected to use it widely, yet in the run up to its launch hauliers repeatedly expressed reservations about it. A survey showed 96 per cent don’t use Eircode. The Freight Transport Association Ireland said the random nature of the code system (adjacent properties have no numerical correlation with each other’s Eircodes) means it’s unsuitable for a delivery system."

    In the run up. They have seen the advantages and are certainly using it. I live beside a haulier who saw the light after about a year and now all his drivers use it.. But I think explaining or discussing it with you is pointless as you're determined to keep on quoting either out of date items or other posters who are incorrect in their anecdotal evidence.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,932 ✭✭✭irishgeo


    never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience


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