Breaking lights at empty crossroads = victimless crime, or is it?

Synthol · 08-10-2017 11:37AM

doolox wrote: »

Red light on for ages. Taxi ahead of me waited for 4 or 5 minutes then pulled out carefully onto the dual carriageway when it was empty.

I pulled out in a similar fashion with no harm done.

On a similar note the lights at the Brewery Road interchange went off and there was complete chaos. I was intending to turn right but quickly changed my mind to a left turn which was still physically possible, then went towards town, did a u turn and was able to get through the junction while people around me were stuck trying to make a right turn on an unlit traffic junction.

You should be sentenced to death for your unspeakable heinous crimes. Should have waited until somebody has fixed the traffic light.

sdanseo · 08-10-2017 11:40AM

The only time where it's OK and doesn't pose a risk is pedestrian lights. Especially where you've watched the asshat cross the road on red after pressing the button. Why press it if you don't need the lights to help you cross!

I'd ignore them in that scenario if it didn't carry penalty points, but I value my licence so I don't.

CiniO · 08-10-2017 02:43PM

Synthol wrote: »

Traffic lights should be turned off like in most countries during the night and a system of primary/secondary road used. It's absolutely ridiculous when you are going somewhere in the middle of the night and sit at the traffic lights for 5 minutes waiting until all the pedestrian lights go off even though there is nobody in sight for miles. You just sit there for ages because you have to obey a light bulb.

But in Ireland, all traffic light junctions don't have separate right of way assignments by traffic signs (major/minor road) so how do you propose driver don't crash on junctions when traffic lights are off at night?

AugustusMinimus · 08-10-2017 02:53PM

My view is that all signalised roundabouts should revert to flashing amber after a certain hour at night. Absolutely no need for some of them to still have lights active when there is very little traffic.

People also need to get real on broken red lights. If they are broken, people should attempt to proceed is a cautious and safe manner. Anyone who says they will stop until the light is fixed is an idiot of the highest order. This is the kind of person who needs to be spoon fed their entire life.

dil999 · 08-10-2017 03:14PM

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

My view is that all signalised roundabouts should revert to flashing amber after a certain hour at night. Absolutely no need for some of them to still have lights active when there is very little traffic.

People also need to get real on broken red lights. If they are broken, people should attempt to proceed is a cautious and safe manner. Anyone who says they will stop until the light is fixed is an idiot of the highest order. This is the kind of person who needs to be spoon fed their entire life.

This broken red lights argument is a load of nonsense. the only people talking about broken red lights are the muppets trying to justify breaking working red lights. If red lights are broken and stuck on red, then a driver has no option but to safely proceed. Read the whole thread. Its eye opening.

Steve · 08-10-2017 03:51PM

Last time I looked (and I admit it was a few years ago now) there was nothing in Irish law that says anything about traffic lights.

I got pulled over about 10 years ago for going through a red at 2 in the morning after having to finish off something in work, came to a red, stopped, no other cars around so proceeded through. I knew the junction well and knew the light would take ages to turn.
The Guard was in an unmarked car parked up somewhere, followed me and stopped me, walked up to the window, then said he saw me break a red light... I asked him is there a law against that? he muttered something and then walked away.

No offence to AGS meant in my post.

GM228 · 08-10-2017 05:14PM

Steve wrote: »

Last time I looked (and I admit it was a few years ago now) there was nothing in Irish law that says anything about traffic lights.

Must have been a very long time ago, traffic lights have had an illuminating presence in Irish law since 1956.

bucketybuck · 08-10-2017 05:39PM

Synthol wrote: »

Traffic lights should be turned off like in most countries during the night and a system of primary/secondary road used.

Yeah, just turn them all of, may as well seeing as we appear to be surrounded by morons who prefer to drive using gut feeling and think that codified rules of the road are just some bother that should be ignored when it suits.

Steve · 08-10-2017 06:14PM

GM228 wrote: »

Must have been a very long time ago, traffic lights have had an illuminating presence in Irish law since 1956.

Any link to an actual law?

shaunr68 · 08-10-2017 06:18PM

CiniO wrote: »

But in Ireland, all traffic light junctions don't have separate right of way assignments by traffic signs (major/minor road) so how do you propose driver don't crash on junctions when traffic lights are off at night?

Proceed with caution when lights are disabled. I remember navigating a very busy roundabout Marrakesh where all the traffic lights had failed. A chaotic enough place to drive, locals regard traffic lights as advisory at the best of times, and I've seen people driving horses and carts the wrong way around the roundabout, people stopping on the roundabout and hanging out the window to chat to their mates, pedestrians wandering aimlessly across the road, people setting up market stalls on the roundabout...on the actual LANE! Drivers parking on the roundabout and tootling off to do some business...you get the picture.

The thing is with all the lights out people had to take more care than usual and it wasn't a bloodbath like some of the automatons here would have you believe.

mikeecho · 08-10-2017 06:27PM

How many commentators here, regularly drive between 3 and 5am?

I do, and their is virtually no traffic.
There are plenty of junctions , where if you slow down, or come to a stop, and then proceed through a red light, it is safe.

However there are some junctions, where you just don't do it. These are junctions where you don't have a line of sight.

Breaking a red light, in a quiet area in the early hours is not dangerous if done safely.
Blasting through stop signs and red lights.. that's a different matter.

that's dangerous.

CiniO · 08-10-2017 06:38PM

shaunr68 wrote: »

Proceed with caution when lights are disabled. I remember navigating a very busy roundabout Marrakesh .....

It sounds strange.
There might be two drivers both proceeding with caution, but still might crash into each other. Whose fault is it then?

Junctions can't be organised like that. There has to be some right of way rules.

Comparing Ireland to Marrakesh is bit nuts... Completely different worlds I believe.

shaunr68 · 08-10-2017 07:06PM

CiniO wrote: »

It sounds strange.
There might be two drivers both proceeding with caution, but still might crash into each other. Whose fault is it then?

Junctions can't be organised like that. There has to be some right of way rules.

Realistically, two drivers proceeding with caution aren't going to just drive into one another. They will slow to a stop if necessary and with a combination of shrugs and waves they will work it out. One will voluntarily give way to the other, same as happens on a narrow country lane here.

CiniO wrote: »

Comparing Ireland to Marrakesh is bit nuts... Completely different worlds I believe.

Just an extreme example of how in the absence of traffic lights the road network doesn't immediately descend into a bloodbath. Drivers will generally take more care and work it out between them.

Come to think of it though this does remind me of Ennis on market day

traffic-city-marrakesh-morocco-nov-november-morocco-45961606.jpg

bucketybuck · 08-10-2017 07:18PM

shaunr68 wrote: »

Just an extreme example of how in the absence of traffic lights the road network doesn't immediately descend into a bloodbath. Drivers will generally take more care and work it out between them.

Jesus H Christ, are you seriously holding up Morocco as some example of how well things work when drivers just drive as they feel and work things out between themselves?

188 people died on Irish roads in 2016, in Morocco the figure was 3956.

Ireland has 4.1 deaths per 100,000 people. Morocco has 18.

Ireland has 7.6 deaths per 100,000 vehicles, Morocco has 209!!!.

Holding Morocco up as some standard to be followed is ****ing ridiculous, not to mention 3956 people dead could easily be termed as that bloodbath you seem to think doesn't happen.

shaunr68 · 08-10-2017 07:26PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Jesus H Christ, are you seriously holding up Morocco as some example of how well things work when drivers just drive as they feel and work things out between themselves?

No I wasn't. Please don't get so worked up.

It was a specific example of what happened when the traffic lights failed at a busy roundabout and drivers had to work it out for themselves, the country is irrelevant but was mentioned more by the way of an amusing anecdote.

Synthol · 08-10-2017 07:41PM

CiniO wrote: »

But in Ireland, all traffic light junctions don't have separate right of way assignments by traffic signs (major/minor road) so how do you propose driver don't crash on junctions when traffic lights are off at night?

Is it really that hard to put up signs? Jesus m8

Synthol · 08-10-2017 07:42PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Yeah, just turn them all of, may as well seeing as we appear to be surrounded by morons who prefer to drive using gut feeling and think that codified rules of the road are just some bother that should be ignored when it suits.

Yeah leave that for the smart folks in Germany

Synthol · 08-10-2017 07:45PM

CiniO wrote: »

It sounds strange.
There might be two drivers both proceeding with caution, but still might crash into each other. Whose fault is it then?

Junctions can't be organised like that. There has to be some right of way rules.

Comparing Ireland to Marrakesh is bit nuts... Completely different worlds I believe.

I honestly believe you should have your licence revoked. Did you read the theory test book when you did your test? Because if you did you would know that cars from the left have the right of way in uncontrolled junctions

AugustusMinimus · 08-10-2017 08:11PM

CiniO wrote: »

shaunr68 wrote: »

Proceed with caution when lights are disabled. I remember navigating a very busy roundabout Marrakesh .....

It sounds strange.
There might be two drivers both proceeding with caution, but still might crash into each other. Whose fault is it then?

Junctions can't be organised like that. There has to be some right of way rules.

Comparing Ireland to Marrakesh is bit nuts... Completely different worlds I believe.

It’s very simple. The traffic with right of way are given a flashing amber while the sides that have to yield are presented with flashing red.

This isn’t rocket science.

CiniO · 08-10-2017 08:22PM

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

It’s very simple. The traffic with right of way are given a flashing amber while the sides that have to yield are presented with flashing red.

This isn’t rocket science.

Sounds like a good idea allright.
But I don't believe it's prescribed into any Irish law.

Is such system used anywhere else in any other country?

CiniO · 08-10-2017 08:24PM

Synthol wrote: »

Is it really that hard to put up signs? Jesus m8

No, it's not hard.
But Irish law doesn't allow to put both traffic light and road priority signs like yield or stop.

It works well in countries where law clearly states that in case of existance of both traffic light and road signs, traffic lights (if lit) take precedence over signs.

But there is no such law in Ireland.

CiniO · 08-10-2017 08:25PM

Synthol wrote: »

I honestly believe you should have your licence revoked.

As far as I know it's a free country, so anyone can believe in anything they wish.

Did you read the theory test book when you did your test? Because if you did you would know that cars from the left have the right of way in uncontrolled junctions

I did read it, and you are incorrect.

In Ireland, on junctions of roads of equal importance, it's a vehicles coming from the right which have right of way.

AugustusMinimus · 08-10-2017 08:30PM

CiniO wrote: »

Synthol wrote: »

Is it really that hard to put up signs? Jesus m8

No, it's not hard.
But Irish law doesn't allow to put both traffic light and road priority signs like yield or stop.

It works well in countries where law clearly states that in case of existance of both traffic light and road signs, traffic lights (if lit) take precedence over signs.

But there is no such law in Ireland.

I don’t know if this is in Irish law but this is the sequence which traffic lights can be switched to when they break to allow traffic to still flow.

Steve · 08-10-2017 08:43PM

Like I said earlier, there is nothing in the law that covers traffic lights.

It anyone can correct me on that I'll gladly eat humble pie.

http://www.lawreform.ie/_fileupload/RevisedActs/WithAnnotations/HTML/EN_ACT_1961_0024.htm

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1961/act/24/enacted/en/html

dil999 · 08-10-2017 09:01PM

Steve wrote: »

Like I said earlier, there is nothing in the law that covers traffic lights.

It anyone can correct me on that I'll gladly eat humble pie.

http://www.lawreform.ie/_fileupload/RevisedActs/WithAnnotations/HTML/EN_ACT_1961_0024.htm

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1961/act/24/enacted/en/html

Did you seriously think for one second that there was no legislation covering traffic lights? :eek:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1997/si/182/made/en/print

gerryirl · 08-10-2017 09:18PM

how do you unsubscribe to a thread....boom

RustyNut · 08-10-2017 09:26PM

Synthol wrote: »

Because if you did you would know that cars from the left have the right of way in uncontrolled junctions

In what country is this?

Steve · 08-10-2017 09:32PM

dil999 wrote: »

Did you seriously think for one second that there was no legislation covering traffic lights? :eek:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/1997/si/182/made/en/print

Actually, yeah, I did. I've been looking for that legislation for years and could never find it..

Surprised it's not included in the LRC revision.

Thanks, it's good to learn stuff. Pie is in the oven..

GM228 · 09-10-2017 05:59AM

Steve wrote: »

Actually, yeah, I did. I've been looking for that legislation for years and could never find it..

Surprised it's not included in the LRC revision.

Thanks, it's good to learn stuff. Pie is in the oven..

As I said traffic lights first entered Irish law in 1956.

It's not included in the consolidated LRC version of the Road Traffic Act 1961 as it is not part of the act.

Dravokivich · 09-10-2017 09:49AM

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

It’s very simple. The traffic with right of way are given a flashing amber while the sides that have to yield are presented with flashing red.

This isn’t rocket science.

Eh... flashing Amber means yield. How are you supposed to perceive it as you've right of way?

Breaking lights at empty crossroads = victimless crime, or is it?

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