"you can be attracted to men without masculinity." Do you agree?

jeanjolie · 09-05-2017 10:52PM #1

Heard this during a heated Reddit debate from a woman in response to a gay guy who said 'If I wanted femininity/androgyny, I would be with a woman'.

Now granted that most men are masculine and most women are feminine, but why do so many people believe that wanting a biologically female person means you that more masculine/androgynous appearance and behaviour is unattractive and vice versa for men? Why so black and white

I thought that our liberal, progressive western culture was becoming more open minded to people not adhering to masculinity/femininity. Doesn't seem so. People do have every right to date whoever they want to, but I am always get this vibe of sexism when reading comments like such from gay guys as shown above.

Dyr · 09-05-2017 10:55PM

jeanjolie wrote: »

Heard this during a heated Reddit debate from a woman in response to a gay guy who said 'If I wanted femininity/androgyny, I would be with a woman'.

Now granted that most men are masculine and most women are feminine, but why do so many people believe that wanting a biologically female person means you that more masculine/androgynous appearance and behaviour is unattractive and vice versa for men? Why so black and white

I thought that our liberal, progressive western culture was becoming more open minded to people not adhering to masculinity/femininity. Doesn't seem so. People do have every right to date whoever they want to, but I am always get this vibe of sexism when reading comments like such from gay guys as shown above.

we're deffo becoming tolerant of people who cant string coherent sentences together

Mod-Banned

Armchair Andy · 09-05-2017 10:57PM

Bambi wrote:

we're deffo becoming tolerant of people who cant string coherent sentences together

True daaat.

LuckyLloyd · 09-05-2017 10:57PM

Our culture can be as progressive as it likes, but basic characteristics of gender and sexual attraction (and it's a bell curve on both counts obviously) aren't changing any time soon.

ohnonotgmail · 09-05-2017 11:00PM

Pehaps it's just that people are individuals and are attracted to different things? I wasnt aware that a persons political leanings had a bearing on who they fancied. I quite like a bit of androgyny myself.

greencap · 09-05-2017 11:25PM

Theres a bit in our brains that sees certain shapes/characteristics and then activates the weiner/flaps accordingly.

In heterosexual males this shape is (.)(.)
Which causes the weiner to activate.

In heterosexual females this shape is €€
Which causes the landing bay doors to open.

Big boobies means lots of milk for my offspring. - male mind.

Big money means lots of food and security for my offspring. (and shoes) - female mind.

When theres both big boobies and big money it means that the baby grows up strong and safe in Blackrock. We call this baby a Tristan or a Sorcha.

If one of the elements is missing the baby risks being a commonplace Dave. Or in the case of both elements being missing, may result in a Jayo.

This is why signs of gender are important to our brain. They tell us who to fck and who not to fck.
Which is why society is obsessed with appearance.
Because we have two basic drives. Survival, and reproduction.

Our brains also cause us to freeze, **** ourselves, or run like a .... really fast person when we see shapes like fangs or tentacles or claws or heights.

Its our instincts.

But yes you can be attracted to more androgynous individuals if you try.
Just like you can remain calm in the face of dangerous shapes, if you try.

ohnonotgmail · 09-05-2017 11:27PM

greencap wrote: »

Theres a bit in our brains that sees certain shapes/characteristics and then activates the weiner/flaps accordingly.

In heterosexual males this shape is (.)(.)
Which causes the weiner to activate.

In heterosexual females this shape is €€
Which causes the landing bay doors to open.

Big boobies means lots of milk for my offspring. - male mind.

Big money means lots of food and security for my offspring. (and shoes) - female mind.

When theres both big boobies and big money it means that the baby grows up strong and safe in Blackrock. We call this baby a Tristan or a Sorcha.

If one of the elements is missing the baby risks being a commonplace Dave. Or in the case of both elements being missing, may result in a Jayo.

This is why signs of gender are important to our brain. They tell us who to fck and who not to fck.
Which is why society is obsessed with appearance.
Because we have two basic drives. Survival, and reproduction.

Our brains also cause us to freeze, **** ourselves, or run like a .... really fast person when we see shapes like fangs or tentacles or claws or heights.

Its our instincts.

But yes you can be attracted to more androgynous individuals if you try.
Just like you can remain calm in the face of dangerous shapes.

It honestly doesnt take that much effort

greencap · 09-05-2017 11:28PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

It honestly doesnt take that much effort

John Major.

ohnonotgmail · 09-05-2017 11:29PM

greencap wrote: »

John Major.

if you think he is androgynous you need to consult a dictionary.

greencap · 09-05-2017 11:33PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

if you think he is androgynous you need to consult a dictionary.

not that he's fully androgynous, but that he's not highly masculine.

George Kostanza. Rosey O'donnell.

Neither with highly indicative traits.

Both not found on bedroom walls.

ohnonotgmail · 09-05-2017 11:37PM

greencap wrote: »

not that he's fully androgynous, but that he's not highly masculine.

George Kostanza. Rosey O'donnell.

Neither with highly indicative traits.

Both not found on bedroom walls.

none of these people are even slightly androgynous. Tilda Swinton is androgynous. Rosie O'Donnell is not.

con___manx1 · 09-05-2017 11:40PM

Bambi wrote: »

we're deffo becoming tolerant of people who cant string coherent sentences together

I really love posters on boards that correct other peoples mistakes and don't mention anything about the actual post. it would be great if there was more people on boards like you bambi. your my boards hero.

Jobs OXO · 09-05-2017 11:42PM

jeanjolie wrote: »

Heard this during a heated Reddit debate from a woman in response to a gay guy who said 'If I wanted femininity/androgyny, I would be with a woman'.

Now granted that most men are masculine and most women are feminine, but why do so many people believe that wanting a biologically female person means you that more masculine/androgynous appearance and behaviour is unattractive and vice versa for men? Why so black and white

I thought that our liberal, progressive western culture was becoming more open minded to people not adhering to masculinity/femininity. Doesn't seem so. People do have every right to date whoever they want to, but I am always get this vibe of sexism when reading comments like such from gay guys as shown above.

Wat??? All I know is vageens are designed to be pummelled by sex sticks....

AnGaelach · 09-05-2017 11:44PM

jeanjolie wrote: »

I thought that our liberal, progressive western culture was becoming more open minded to people not adhering to masculinity/femininity. Doesn't seem so. People do have every right to date whoever they want to, but I am always get this vibe of sexism when reading comments like such from gay guys as shown above.

Because men are supposed to be masculine and women are supposed to be feminine. Human nature has existed long before liberal democracy and will exist long after it.

greencap · 09-05-2017 11:45PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

none of these people are even slightly androgynous. Tilda Swinton is androgynous. Rosie O'Donnell is not.

Not androgynous.

Lacking in their relative gender traits.

George lacks upper body muscle.

Rosey lacks a certain format of curves/hip-waist ratio.

Gender traits are the core of attractiveness.

Thereafter all things are possible - kinks, fetishes, associations.

You can find androgeny appealing, as you CAN find scars, big feet or a model ship glued to the head appealing also.

But deep down the primary drivers are for signs which tell our simpleton reptilian brain that hey 'THIS' is a female, or 'THIS' is a male ... now go mate with it.

Thus Jessica Rabbit.

Thus a tall dark handsome prince.

pumpkin4life · 09-05-2017 11:49PM

greencap wrote: »

not that he's fully androgynous, but that he's not highly masculine.

George Kostanza. Rosey O'donnell.

Neither with highly indicative traits.

Both not found on bedroom walls.

soups05 · 10-05-2017 12:04AM

I would suggest neither sex would find this whiny waste of flesh attractive. Nothing to do with looks, all to do with attitude.

a "lesbian man" lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpM5Wyg1mes&t=308s&ab_channel=Bearing

10-05-2017 12:17AM

I would say that our society becoming more liberal doesn't necessarily mean that the types of attraction will or must change but rather that those people who do find them attractive become freer to do so

clairewithani · 10-05-2017 12:22AM

greencap wrote: »

Not androgynous.

Lacking in their relative gender traits.

George lacks upper body muscle.

Rosey lacks a certain format of curves/hip-waist ratio.

Gender traits are the core of attractiveness.

Thereafter all things are possible - kinks, fetishes, associations.

You can find androgeny appealing, as you CAN find scars, big feet or a model ship glued to the head appealing also.

But deep down the primary drivers are for signs which tell our simpleton reptilian brain that hey 'THIS' is a female, or 'THIS' is a male ... now go mate with it.

Thus Jessica Rabbit.

Thus a tall dark handsome prince.

Jessica Rabbit and tall dark handsome Prince are in fiction

professore · 10-05-2017 12:38AM

I'm told I should be attracted to pencil thin models, fat chicks and trans men by society. I'm supposed to be attracted to the ball busting Sheryl Sandbergs and Marissa Mayers of this world.

I'm not. I'm attracted to smart feminine caucasian women (tanned is nice) who are good craic, and know their own mind with curves in the right places. This doesn't make me racist or transphobic, I'm quite happy to be friends with anyone, but don't tell me who I should be attracted to.

Definitely wouldn't find a woman attractive who thinks other people can tell her who she should find attractive. Massive turn off.

greencap · 10-05-2017 12:41AM

clairewithani wrote: »

Jessica Rabbit and tall dark handsome Prince are in fiction

because they're the fictional ideal mate for the average person.

mills and boon; athletic billionaire doctor.

fhm; 20yo double d cup bunny girl with slender waist.

this is what most people overall are attracted to, on average.

because thats what our reptilian brain has learned to take as signs of a good mate, through evolution.

ceadaoin. · 10-05-2017 12:42AM

jeanjolie wrote: »

Heard this during a heated Reddit debate from a woman in response to a gay guy who said 'If I wanted femininity/androgyny, I would be with a woman'.

Now granted that most men are masculine and most women are feminine, but why do so many people believe that wanting a biologically female person means you that more masculine/androgynous appearance and behaviour is unattractive and vice versa for men? Why so black and white

I thought that our liberal, progressive western culture was becoming more open minded to people not adhering to masculinity/femininity. Doesn't seem so. People do have every right to date whoever they want to, but I am always get this vibe of sexism when reading comments like such from gay guys as shown above.

You said it yourself, people have the right to date whoever they want and to reject potential mates for whatever reason they want. Why would that offend you? Guilting or labelling someone as sexist or (insert here)phobic for having a sexual preference is creepy. why do you care so much?

Outlaw Pete · 10-05-2017 12:44AM

What is a rampant rabbit but a man without masculinity.

Glenster · 10-05-2017 12:49AM

greencap wrote: »

because they're the fictional ideal mate for the average person.

mills and boon; athletic billionaire doctor.

fhm; 20yo double d cup bunny girl with slender waist.

this is what most people overall are attracted to, on average.

because thats what our reptilian brain has learned to take as signs of a good mate, through evolution.

Naaah, she sounds like hard work mate.

greencap · 10-05-2017 12:51AM

Glenster wrote: »

Naaah, she sounds like hard work mate.

for you.

(bane quote complete)

Irish Guitarist · 10-05-2017 01:25AM

Samaris · 10-05-2017 01:31AM

You know, skimming over this conversation and all the instructions on who and what traits one should find attractive, it's quite possible to come away with the confused feeling that one is supposed to be sexually attracted to rabbits.

jeanjolie · 10-05-2017 10:09AM

AnGaelach wrote: »

Because men are supposed to be masculine and women are supposed to be feminine. Human nature has existed long before liberal democracy and will exist long after it.

Are we supposed to be limited by our nature in regards to things we can make progress to change?

It may be that Ireland has more than its fair share of ignorant people. Other Western European countries have more progressive individuals.

I never said that we would get rid of masculinity and femininity, I do understand that there is a biological origin, its just that I believe people are bit quite close minded in regards to individuals who are non gender conforming.

valoren · 10-05-2017 11:05AM

So if your a straight man but are sleeping with a straight woman, who happens to look like a man, it's a sort of cocknitive dissonance?

Parchment · 10-05-2017 11:09AM

Prince?!

10-05-2017 12:00PM

jeanjolie wrote: »

I thought that our liberal, progressive western culture was becoming more open minded to people not adhering to masculinity/femininity.

What are the "masculine traits" that I am meant to be adhering to exactly? I have never really been clear on what they even are myself.

Without knowing what the traits are the question in the OP and statements like this -

AnGaelach wrote: »

Because men are supposed to be masculine and women are supposed to be feminine.

- are difficult to find any meaning in.

"you can be attracted to men without masculinity." Do you agree?

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