"Why I did not report my rapist"

Penn · 24-02-2017 10:41AM

F*cking hell lads...

Once again, I was too ashamed – of my own meanness to say no. I remember thinking, he’ll get the message eventually. We kissed. He tried to undress me. I said no. He tried again – my top came off. I told him I didn’t want to have sex. We kissed some more. He tried to take off my bottoms. I said no.

He wasn’t pushy – at least not physically – but he was stubborn. After several “no”s, I remember thinking, ‘it would just be easier to let him do it.’ So I stopped saying no, and I lay there, and he had sex with me.

She said no, and he didn't stop.
She said no, and he didn't stop.
She said no, and he didn't stop.
She stopped saying no, because he wouldn't stop.

How the f*ck is that not rape?

Don't get me wrong, I get annoyed with talk about how men should be educated on what consent is etc bullsh*t, but some of you would actually really benefit from such classes.

She said no, and he didn't stop.
She said no, and he didn't stop.
She said no, and he didn't stop.
She stopped saying no, because he wouldn't stop.

Butters1979 · 24-02-2017 10:41AM

meeeeh wrote: »

It was digitally rape by someone working in hostel in Turkey. There was no kissing there or no other 'frienfdly' contact. I got away before anything more happened. Happy? I can't prove my credentials further I am afraid bit I am glad at least you will get some entertainment out of it.

If that's true then what happened to you is nothing like what she's calling rape. As a genuine victim does it not make you angry than someone can willingly have sex and then 15 years later call it rape for victim points scoring on her blog?

neonsofa · 24-02-2017 10:43AM

namloc1980 wrote: »

I presume she is going to report this now that it's in the public domain? Otherwise it would be a terrible undermining of rape victims out there.

Many people who have been raped don't report it. Who are they undermining?

BeeMee_123 · 24-02-2017 10:44AM

pumpkin4life

1/ how the hell do you know what people in this position do?

2/ Why the hell would anyone lie so publicly about this experience?

'I'm noticing this more and more with Millenial wans. They will speak with glee and happiness about some guy touching her ass for two seconds in a club and then it turns into a massive sexual harassment thing.'

I can tell already you seem like the ass grabbing asshole yourself! Who speaks of glee at getting their ass grabbed then accuses person of sexual harassment? your not making any sense at all.

This whole thread is disappointing

steddyeddy · 24-02-2017 10:50AM

I find it difficult to understand how some people don't seem to grasp the word no. She said no and he didn't accept that. Not OK in the slightest.

meeeeh · 24-02-2017 10:51AM

Butters1979 wrote: »

If that's true then what happened to you is nothing like what she's calling rape. As a genuine victim does it not make you angry than someone can willingly have sex and then 15 years later call it rape for victim points scoring on her blog?

It was not willing though was it? People give in for different reasons but it doesn't mean it's ok.

Neyite · 24-02-2017 11:00AM

anna080 wrote: »

I don't believe it was rape because in that moment she made a choice and she decided it was easier for him to have sex with her than to tell him no several more times. Rape victims don't have that choice. That is the crux of it.

I fixed your post.

Maybe you can tell me then, how many times does someone need to say no for it to qualify as a rape: Three times? Ten? Or all the way to the end? Is it more rapey if a person screams and struggles, and less if she just cries quietly? How about skirt size? Previous partners? If a person chooses during the not-rape not to fight off someone bigger and stronger than her, how many bruises do the Gardai need to count before they call it a rape?

Then there is the drink being involved. We all know that being drunk is simultaneously a valid defence for a rapist and a contributory factor that falls under 'asking for it' for the victim.

Rape might be a grey area for some to understand, but consent isn't. Someone says no, you stop until they state otherwise. Someone passed out? Don't shag them. Then there are no grey areas and no confusion. Pretending to not know whether your partner is up for it or not and carrying on anyway is at best a crap lover who is only interested in having sex on someone not with someone. At worst, well there is a name for people like that. Not exactly something to brag about either way.

midlandsmissus · 24-02-2017 11:00AM

To people who say 'hah it was just a mistake and she regrets it', this girl is very upsetabout something that has happened to her.
I would like people to google the case of Thordis Elva, who was raped. Her rapist admitted to raping her, and still there were many comments saying it was her fault, she didn't explicitly say no etc.
The real issue lies with some men seeing women as lesser, and seeing what they want as more important than what the woman wants. This is what Thordis's rapist said, 'that he felt entitled to her body'.
There is no pain like your body being violated.
I am happy to see many men on here also speaking positively about this.

Boom_Bap · 24-02-2017 11:06AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

To people who say 'hah it was just a mistake and she regrets it', this girl is very upsetabout something that has happened to her.
I would like people to google the case of Thordis Elva, who was raped. Her rapist admitted to raping her, and still there were many comments saying it was her fault, she didn't explicitly say no etc.
The real issue lies with some men seeing women as lesser, and seeing what they want as more important than what the woman wants. This is what Thordis's rapist said, 'that he felt entitled to her body'.
There is no pain like your body being violated.
I am happy to see many men on here also speaking positively about this.

They done a TED talk together recently

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gyPoqFcvt9w

Wibbs · 24-02-2017 11:06AM

namloc1980 wrote: »

I presume she is going to report this now that it's in the public domain? Otherwise it would be a terrible undermining of rape victims out there.

Nah. Better to air one's grievances in he court of public opinion where proof of guilt is not required. It might get messy if the guy in question finds out about this. If he does and his story differs he should go legal on her arse. That's the other aspect. It's her story. One that handily fits the current narrative of certain echo chambers.

midlandsmissus wrote:

Holy f*cking Christ. There is a long way to go with men in this country.

Just the men eh?

If someone is reluctant to have sex - don't have sex with them!

Of course. 100%. However the other side of that personal responsibility is be clear about reluctance. She was(in her side of it), yet still went ahead and had sex with this guy she says she didn't fancy. Twice.

BeeMee_123 wrote: »

2/ Why the hell would anyone lie so publicly about this experience?

Possible reasons? Attention. Simple as and common as muck these days on social media and the media in general. Another is climbing on whatever bandwagon you're having yourself to telegraph one's "credentials" and egg each other on. Yet another is to try to raise exposure and even personal revenue.

I can tell already you seem like the ass grabbing asshole yourself!

Nice.

mzungu · 24-02-2017 11:07AM

LightlyGo wrote: »

I agree. However I think it's not as clear cut as that in all situations. In this instance I can see how he read mixed signals, she recognised she was giving mixed signals and the situation was certainly unfortunate and I'm sure upsetting. I guess for me if someone went to take my top off and I said no but it came off anyway a few minutes later I would not be continuing on kissing them for a while. I fully think he should have stopped but I think for her in her future relationships and for young women it's wise to also have in mind that if you mean no it has to be more than a word. If you're with someone you don't want to be with and they're not hearing no very early in the encounter you stop it. You protect yourself, you can't continue and say "no, but opps you did that and it's ok, I'll continue" etc .

Crucially though when it came to the sex she decided it was easier to let it happen than say look "no, please leave". She didn't say she was afraid to say no, or her head was spinning too much to gather herself or that he was forceful.

I just don't think the man deserves to be branded rapist over it.

He continued on after being asked to stop on numerous occasions, ergo it was rape.

pumpkin4life · 24-02-2017 11:08AM

steddyeddy wrote: »

I find it difficult to understand how some people don't seem to grasp the word no. She said no and he didn't accept that. Not OK in the slightest.

Watch what people do, rather than what they say.

It sounds like regret sex, with the guy treating her like crap/getting the hell away from her after all of this; the lad who was supposed to call her the next day kind of thing. She feels like she was used/exploited by him, so she harbors real hate/obsession for this lad. Then, with the new emerging industry of victimitis for third wave feminists right now, she hops on board with this story to make some money/attention from it.

That's it.

Wibbs · 24-02-2017 11:12AM

Neyite wrote: »

Then there is the drink being involved. We all know that being drunk is simultaneously a valid defence for a rapist

No, "we" don't. And neither does a court of law. It is anything but a "valid defence". I dunno where you pulled that nonsense from.

and a contributory factor that falls under 'asking for it' for the victim.

More in play, but more about diminished responsibility in the case of a potential victim. And again not a "valid defence" for an accused rapist. Quite the opposite in fact.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-02-2017 11:15AM

Surely there are different nos though?
Like for example, a FWB wants to have sex while you're both at a house party and you say no because someone might hear or walk in, but it's a no I don't think it's a good idea rather than a no if you touch me it's rape.

neonsofa · 24-02-2017 11:22AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Surely there are different nos though?
Like for example, a FWB wants to have sex while you're both at a house party and you say no because someone might hear or walk in, but it's a no I don't think it's a good idea rather than a no if you touch me it's rape.

I get what you're saying and agree with you, but just thinking out loud for a sec, then what happens if the person being told no views it as a more trivial "ah I really shouldnt" kind of no, whereas the person saying no means it as no I do not want to have sex full stop. Who gets to decide what type of no it is, if not the woman saying no. And in this case she did say no. I don't know how I feel about it all tbh. It's complex.

24-02-2017 11:23AM

midlandsmissus wrote: »

To people who say 'hah it was just a mistake and she regrets it', this girl is very upsetabout something that has happened to her.
I would like people to google the case of Thordis Elva, who was raped. Her rapist admitted to raping her, and still there were many comments saying it was her fault, she didn't explicitly say no etc.
The real issue lies with some men seeing women as lesser, and seeing what they want as more important than what the woman wants. This is what Thordis's rapist said, 'that he felt entitled to her body'.
There is no pain like your body being violated.
I am happy to see many men on here also speaking positively about this.

What happened to her is wrong/horrible but her not going to the authoritys about it raises a question of why hasn't she and the cynic in me thinks that she's using it for blog views/no's or making a career out of it like some others have

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-02-2017 11:24AM

If you're actually so worried that you're going to be raped surely it'll be
"Seriously, I said stop!"
"Get off me, I'm not into you"
"Leave me alone i don't want to have sex"

Penn · 24-02-2017 11:25AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Surely there are different nos though?
Like for example, a FWB wants to have sex while you're both at a house party and you say no because someone might hear or walk in, but it's a no I don't think it's a good idea rather than a no if you touch me it's rape.

Regardless of the reason for the no, if he then began having sex with you even though you continued to say no, that's rape. Doesn't matter if it's a FWB, partner, husband, if you explicitly say no, and they have sex with you anyway, that's rape. It may not be violent rape, and you might not fight him off, but it is rape. You did not consent to having sex.

24-02-2017 11:25AM

Deleted User wrote: »

I think the post you're responding to was 100% correct. Lumping everything in under sexual assault/rape and merely handwaving the range from 'pinching without consent' to violent rape as differing steps in aggravation is hugely problematic (ya I said problematic deal with it).

Consent to anything you're not happy about is not the deciding factor in whether or not that event has actually occurred, or occurred as you claim it did many years later.

Not sure what you mean by "problematic, deal with it".

If you're saying there has to be the act of intercourse...well, yes...ummmmm....obviously.

But the issue here is the consent, and no means no means no. There is no credit for not breaking her nose, not dragging her into bushes etc. As I said, if it was demonstrated that she said no, repeatedly, well he'd have an uphill battle. Of course, lapse of time etc. might mean a doubt about consent, hence I prefaced my point with "if it was demonstrated that she said no"...

inforfun · 24-02-2017 11:26AM

Hi Rosemary

Isnt that your goal anyway as "social influencer", that you are being discussed?
Of course here not everybody agrees with you but hey.... that is used to be life.

24-02-2017 11:27AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Surely there are different nos though?

Oh there are, which do not go to guilt or innocence, but the sentence.

The no gently ignored should draw a shorter sentence than the no overcome by a punch breaking the nose and knocking out teeth, but both are no.

meeeeh · 24-02-2017 11:31AM

Dimitri Red Newsman wrote: »

What happened to her is wrong/horrible but her not going to the authoritys about it raises a question of why hasn't she and the cynic in me thinks that she's using it for blog views/no's or making a career out of it like some others have

The majority of victims don't report. And no it's not because they want to write a blog. Btw if you actually read the whole thing you would know why she didn't report.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 24-02-2017 11:31AM

Dimitri Red Newsman wrote: »

What happened to her is wrong/horrible but her not going to the authoritys about it raises a question of why hasn't she and the cynic in me thinks that she's using it for blog views/no's or making a career out of it like some others have

I was raped when I was 17 and I didn't go to the guards for a few reasons C

1. I was drunk and met him in a nightclub underage
2. I went home with him because he said he had beer and looking back on it how stupid was I
3. What if they didn't believe me?
4. Was mortified
5. I couldn't bear the thoughts of my parents, especially my dad, finding out someone hurt me.
6. I believed for ages it was my own fault and
7. To me it wasn't a rapey rape? He didn't beat me up, pull me down an alley, have a knife, threathen to kill me. As rapists go, he was quite nice to me. I thought they wouldn't take it as seriously.

retro:electro · 24-02-2017 11:33AM

Neyite wrote: »

I fixed your post.

Maybe you can tell me then, how many times does someone need to say no for it to qualify as a rape: Three times? Ten? Or all the way to the end? Is it more rapey if a person screams and struggles, and less if she just cries quietly? How about skirt size? Previous partners? If a person chooses during the not-rape not to fight off someone bigger and stronger than her, how many bruises do the Gardai need to count before they call it a rape?

Then there is the drink being involved. We all know that being drunk is simultaneously a valid defence for a rapist and a contributory factor that falls under 'asking for it' for the victim.

Rape might be a grey area for some to understand, but consent isn't. Someone says no, you stop until they state otherwise. Someone passed out? Don't shag them. Then there are no grey areas and no confusion. Pretending to not know whether your partner is up for it or not and carrying on anyway is at best a crap lover who is only interested in having sex on someone not with someone. At worst, well there is a name for people like that. Not exactly something to brag about either way.

I agree with all your points there. Not sure what they have to do with this issue though.
Anyway, my whole point was she had a choice. She decided, in her own words, "it would be easier to let him do it than have the awkward I don't fancy you conversation". That is not rape. She made a conscious decision to have sex with this person instead of telling him to fcuk off away from her. Rape victims don't have that choice, that decision is taken away from them. It's worrying now upon reading her blog post how many other girls are going to decide that they too were raped because they weren't into it at the time but DECIDED to do it anyway.

retro:electro · 24-02-2017 11:36AM

Penn wrote: »

Regardless of the reason for the no, if he then began having sex with you even though you continued to say no, that's rape. Doesn't matter if it's a FWB, partner, husband, if you explicitly say no, and they have sex with you anyway, that's rape. It may not be violent rape, and you might not fight him off, but it is rape. You did not consent to having sex.

I disagree. She consented when she decided it would be easier to have sex than have an awkward conversation.

Penn · 24-02-2017 11:37AM

anna080 wrote: »

I disagree. She consented when she decided it would be easier to have sex than have an awkward conversation.

She said no, and he didn't stop.
She said no, and he didn't stop.
She said no, and he didn't stop.
She stopped saying no, because he wouldn't stop.

Grayson · 24-02-2017 11:37AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

I was raped when I was 17 and I didn't go to the guards for a few reasons C

1. I was drunk and met him in a nightclub underage
2. I went home with him because he said he had beer and looking back on it how stupid was I
3. What if they didn't believe me?
4. Was mortified
5. I couldn't bear the thoughts of my parents, especially my dad, finding out someone hurt me.
6. I believed for ages it was my own fault and
7. To me it wasn't a rapey rape? He didn't beat me up, pull me down an alley, have a knife, threathen to kill me. As rapists go, he was quite nice to me. I thought they wouldn't take it as seriously.

I had a friend who didn't tell for similar reasons. When she told us and we believed her it was such a relief for her. The guy who had raped her was a popular person and she didn't think anyone would believe that nice guy could be a rapist.

Little CuChulainn · 24-02-2017 11:37AM

A no can be difficult to interpret in some situations. Is she simply saying no to taking off her top? Does she not like foreplay? But a flat out "I don't want to have sex with you" is pretty clear. You stop trying to go there. If she subsequently changes her mind and indicates so then fair enough but simply not resisting can not be taken as her changing her mind.

pilly · 24-02-2017 11:38AM

Jesus, if women were to cry rape every time they did it when they weren't really in the humour then the jails would be full pretty quick!!

Whilst I understand what people are saying about her saying no she did continue to kiss him at the same time so mixed messages there.

If I really didn't want to do it I'd get out of the bed, go get a drink or something and then tell him to get out of the room. If he doesn't at that stage then there's a problem.

pumpkin4life · 24-02-2017 11:39AM

meeeeh wrote: »

The majority of victims don't report. And no it's not because they want to write a blog. Btw if you actually read the whole thing you would know why she didn't report.

Yeah.

Because people who are abused are absolutely terrified to admit to themselves they were abused. They will repress the memory, develop different personalities. They will develop stockholm syndrome (he was a nice abuser), all of that. They will say that they deserved it or they caused the whole thing. Milo is a recent example of that.

Because people who are abused might have shaky relationships with friends/family and they're terrified of the fallout.

They will not plaster it all over the internet.

"Why I did not report my rapist"

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