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Child refugees -majority to be males aged 17???

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Comments

  • #572
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Mary63 wrote: »
    Im not too happy about the vitriolic comments about rape, its ok for men to make jokes about rape, women never do.Im not complaining though, its the internet.

    Who said it was ok to make jokes about rape?

    Why shouldn't I say I wouldn't go on holidays anywhere the Irish navy is landing economic migrants who nobody has any records for, we don't know how many are dangerous sexual deviants but based on the numbers that congregated in Cologne we can guess a fair few.I have heard that the women taken on board the Irish navy vessel have to be separated immediately for their own safety.I don't know is this true because any footage of these economic migrants seem to show all men and most seem to be the same age.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/cologne-police-accused-of-heavy-handed-new-year-s-eve-security-1.2923563

    A repeat of what happened in Cologne was prevented by the German police which is a mercy.

    Its all very well for us to say aren't the Irish navy doing a good job, they aren't landing these people in Dunlaoghaire, if they were the navy ship would be back tied up in Ireland.This whole exercise is just ridiculous, does it go on indefinitely and the longer it does the more non paying passengers it is going to pick up.Are the Germans paying the bill for this, Angela Merkel should be because she was the one who effectively told the whole of North Africa she would take them in if they came to Europe and its to Germany these people want to get to.

    I feel so sorry for the Greeks whose economy is in tatters and I didn't see Angela Merkel rushing to help the Greeks out.She said we have a duty to illegal migrants, what about her duty to help Greece, a fellow EU member out.Now Greece is going to be overrun by these migrants and Greece hasn't the resources to cope with them, it will have even less now that its tourism market has been destroyed.Turkeys tourism market is destroyed too now that the lunatics have taken over the asylum, thank god Turkey wasn't admitted into the EU.

    More broad strokes. They're all potential rapists, none of them are genuine refugees etc. .

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #573
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Mary63 wrote: »
    Im not too happy about the vitriolic comments about rape, its ok for men to make jokes about rape, women never do.Im not complaining though, its the internet.

    Why shouldn't I say I wouldn't go on holidays anywhere the Irish navy is landing economic migrants who nobody has any records for, we don't know how many are dangerous sexual deviants but based on the numbers that congregated in Cologne we can guess a fair few.I have heard that the women taken on board the Irish navy vessel have to be separated immediately for their own safety.I don't know is this true because any footage of these economic migrants seem to show all men and most seem to be the same age.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/europe/cologne-police-accused-of-heavy-handed-new-year-s-eve-security-1.2923563

    A repeat of what happened in Cologne was prevented by the German police which is a mercy.

    Its all very well for us to say aren't the Irish navy doing a good job, they aren't landing these people in Dunlaoghaire, if they were the navy ship would be back tied up in Ireland.This whole exercise is just ridiculous, does it go on indefinitely and the longer it does the more non paying passengers it is going to pick up.Are the Germans paying the bill for this, Angela Merkel should be because she was the one who effectively told the whole of North Africa she would take them in if they came to Europe and its to Germany these people want to get to.

    I feel so sorry for the Greeks whose economy is in tatters and I didn't see Angela Merkel rushing to help the Greeks out.She said we have a duty to illegal migrants, what about her duty to help Greece, a fellow EU member out.Now Greece is going to be overrun by these migrants and Greece hasn't the resources to cope with them, it will have even less now that its tourism market has been destroyed.Turkeys tourism market is destroyed too now that the lunatics have taken over the asylum, thank god Turkey wasn't admitted into the EU.

    You are right about the jokes, a bit facetious at best. Also agree in part r.e the navy as I feel they are encouraging attempts and therefore drownings, and encouraging illegal trafficking. I suspect many genuine people can't or won't go that route and are stuck back in places like Aleppo.


  • #574
    jmayo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,224 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    Mary63 wrote: »
    The Australians have the right idea too.They have decided that illegal aliens just aren't getting in so no point in bringing boat loads of them to Australia.Not only are these immigrants not allowed into Australia but their details are taken and they will never be allowed into Australia not even as tourists in the future.

    I don't think Hungary or Australia have been hit by terrorist attacks, their Governments will do what has to be done to protect their people.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/asia-pacific/asylum-seekers-face-lifetime-australia-ban-if-they-arrive-by-boat-1.2848529

    Actually they have probably saved lives because once word spread that illegal immigrants, migrants, refugees, asylum seekers arriving on boats would not get into Asuatrlia then the boats stopped coming.

    I wonder how many Europe would have saved from drowning if it had done likewise.

    Having the Irish navy along with all the others acting as a pickup service is encouraging even more boats and even more drowning, but one side of this argument refuses to acknowledge this salient truth.
    jacksie66 wrote: »
    So that attack on the Lindt cafe in Sydney a couple of years ago didn't happen? Or the nearly continuous police operations in Australia to prevent further attacks?
    Besides, Australia was founded on immigration. Illegal or legal..

    Funny you shoudl mention the Lindt cafe attack.
    It was carried out by an Iranian refugee, a convert from shia to sunni, who wanted an ISIL flag brought to him during the seige.

    Oh and during his time in Asutralia he so culturally enriched the place he was being sought for accessory to murder of his ex wfire who was found stabbed 17 times, he was also wanted for over 40 counts of sexual assaults, for writing hate mail to the families of soldiers killed in Afghanistan.

    Of course he was mentally ill.

    How many of the Vietnamese refugees have culturally enriched Australia to such a degree.
    bubblypop wrote: »
    Well thankfully the Irish navy has more compassion than you, they are saving people's lives.
    And we do take refugees from those camps in Greece and Italy.

    Ehh once again can we highlight fact that most of the so called refugees in Italy are not Syrian, but probably contyains a fair sprinkling of such people as that gent who was fleeing jail time in Tunisia and ultimately decided to drive a truck through a market of people in Berlin.

    Also most of the ones in camps in Italy and Greece are actually young men, not the women and kids who are probably sitting in the real camps in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon.

    Oh and as I said above the Irish navy is helping to encourage ever more boats which leads to ever more drownings.

    I am not allowed discuss …



  • #575
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    jmayo wrote: »
    Actually they have probably saved lives because once word spread that illegal immigrants, migrants, refugees, asylum seekers arriving on boats would not get into Asuatrlia then the boats stopped coming.

    I wonder how many Europe would have saved from drowning if it had done likewise.

    Having the Irish navy along with all the others acting as a pickup service is encouraging even more boats and even more drowning, but one side of this argument refuses to acknowledge this salient truth.



    Funny you shoudl mention the Lindt cafe attack.
    It was carried out by an Iranian refugee, a convert from shia to sunni, who wanted an ISIL flag brought to him during the seige.

    Oh and during his time in Asutralia he so culturally enriched the place he was being sought for accessory to murder of his ex wfire who was found stabbed 17 times, he was also wanted for over 40 counts of sexual assaults, for writing hate mail to the families of soldiers killed in Afghanistan.

    Of course he was mentally ill.

    How many of the Vietnamese refugees have culturally enriched Australia to such a degree.



    Ehh once again can we highlight fact that most of the so called refugees in Italy are not Syrian, but probably contyains a fair sprinkling of such people as that gent who was fleeing jail time in Tunisia and ultimately decided to drive a truck through a market of people in Berlin.

    Also most of the ones in camps in Italy and Greece are actually young men, not the women and kids who are probably sitting in the real camps in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon.

    Oh and as I said above the Irish navy is helping to encourage ever more boats which leads to ever more drownings.


    The road to hell is paved with good intentions.


  • #576
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    You are right about the jokes, a bit facetious at best. Also agree in part r.e the navy as I feel they are encouraging attempts and therefore drownings, and encouraging illegal trafficking. I suspect many genuine people can't or won't go that route and are stuck back in places like Aleppo.

    What jokes? Who is joking about rape? Who said it's ok for men & women never joke about it?
    The Irish navy along with other navy's are reacting to the crises that was people drowning in the med. Do you understand that? There were thousands of people drowning to death in the med. But you and the likes of Mary would rather see those people die, rather than them ruin your holiday destinations!


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  • #577
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Widdershins wrote: »
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

    The road the hell is more likely paved with bad intentions, if you think about it logically.

    Without some altruism the world would be fecked.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #578
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    bubblypop wrote: »
    What jokes? Who is joking about rape? Who said it's ok for men & women never joke about it?
    The Irish navy along with other navy's are reacting to the crises that was people drowning in the med. Do you understand that? There were thousands of people drowning to death in the med. But you and the likes of Mary would rather see those people die, rather than them ruin your holiday destinations!

    You don't speak for me so don't pretend you do. You are a liar. I made no such comment about holiday destinations.


  • #579
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Brian? wrote: »
    The road the hell is more likely paved with bad intentions, if you think about it logically.

    Without some altruism the world would be fecked.

    Yes but nobody's argued against altruistic efforts. That old saying is supposed to mean that you need to use your head while following your heart, or else you unwittingly cause more harm than good.

    Anyway, I don't really believe -some- of the actions involved in the whole refugee relocation process have been altruistic at all. It looks like there was self serving intent behind some of it.


  • #580
    endacl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,453 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    Old Bill wrote: »
    The whole "refugee" thing is a scam. These people are economic migrants.
    We've been migrating to improve our circumstances since the first cavemen said 'jaysus lads. It's getting a bit chilly. Let's up sticks and head down that way'.

    Nothing wrong with that.


  • #581
    rgossip30
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    bubblypop wrote: »
    What jokes? Who is joking about rape? Who said it's ok for men & women never joke about it?
    The Irish navy along with other navy's are reacting to the crises that was people drowning in the med. Do you understand that? There were thousands of people drowning to death in the med. But you and the likes of Mary would rather see those people die, rather than them ruin your holiday destinations!

    They are still drowning in greater numbers despite the Irish navy service !!

    http://www.unhcr.org/news/latest/2016/10/580f3e684/mediterranean-death-toll-soars-2016-deadliest-year.html


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  • #582
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    bubblypop wrote: »
    What jokes? Who is joking about rape? Who said it's ok for men & women never joke about it?
    The Irish navy along with other navy's are reacting to the crises that was people drowning in the med. Do you understand that? There were thousands of people drowning to death in the med. But you and the likes of Mary would rather see those people die, rather than them ruin your holiday destinations!

    I hope you have the decency to take your vile comment back.


  • #583
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    endacl wrote: »
    We've been migrating to improve our circumstances since the first cavemen said 'jaysus lads. It's getting a bit chilly. Let's up sticks and head down that way'.

    Nothing wrong with that.

    No there isn't but there are laws and rules for that kind of migration. For good reasons.


  • #584
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,178 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    tourism must be badly affected in Greece, and a small country in turmoil with refugee camps is no longer a holiday destination for anybody.

    So, you don't think that refugees have affected holiday destinations then......


  • #585
    rgossip30
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    bubblypop wrote: »
    So, you don't think that refugees have affected holiday destinations then......

    I remember 25 years ago on a holiday in Sardinia being constantly asked to buy watches or sun glasses on a beach there .yuck .


  • #586
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    bubblypop wrote: »
    So, you don't think that refugees have affected holiday destinations then......

    Of course they have affected Greece which is what Mary said and I agreed in her defense that it's probably less of a tourist hotspot with turmoil and camps. I didn't agree with her comment about refugees swimming to shore and it not being relaxing. Stop avoiding what you said.
    You remarked that people like me ''would rather people die than..''

    And you haven't apologised yet?

    Don't bother twisting, unless you apologise I'll just press 'ignore'.


  • #587
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 1,690 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Of course they have affected Greece which is what Mary said and I agreed in her defense that it's probably less of a tourist hotspot with turmoil and camps. I didn't agree with her comment about refugees swimming to shore and it not being relaxing. Stop avoiding what you said.
    You remarked that people like me ''would rather people die than..''

    And you haven't apologised yet?

    Don't bother twisting, unless you apologise I'll just press 'ignore'.

    You might be better off pressing "report".

    That was a horrendous -and untrue - allegation.


  • #588
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Yes but nobody's argued against altruistic efforts. That old saying is supposed to mean that you need to use your head while following your heart, or else you unwittingly cause more harm than good.

    Anyway, I don't really believe -some- of the actions involved in the whole refugee relocation process have been altruistic at all. It looks like there was self serving intent behind some of it.

    Actually taking in refugees can be altruistic and have the knock on effect of benefitting the host country. I've said this all along. An influx of working age migrants will be good for Germany in the long run, they have an aging workforce and need the workers. They do need to manage the social consequences though.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #589
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Of course they have affected Greece which is what Mary said and I agreed in her defense that it's probably less of a tourist hotspot with turmoil and camps. I didn't agree with her comment about refugees swimming to shore and it not being relaxing. Stop avoiding what you said.
    You remarked that people like me ''would rather people die than..''

    And you haven't apologised yet?

    Don't bother twisting, unless you apologise I'll just press 'ignore'.

    You never said you'd prefer the people to die. But if you don't want the Irish Navy to be in the med rescuing them, what do you'll think will happen?

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #590
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Brian? wrote: »
    You never said you'd prefer the people to die. But if you don't want the Irish Navy to be in the med rescuing them, what do you'll think will happen?

    I never said that, either. I said there could be the effect of encouraging more attempts but that's not the same as saying they should just stop running rescue missions. I never elaborated on what I thought they should do-because I don't know, I don't have all the answers. A bit of a nasty assumption to make, though, Brian.


  • #591
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Brian? wrote: »
    Actually taking in refugees can be altruistic and have the knock on effect of benefitting the host country. I've said this all along. An influx of working age migrants will be good for Germany in the long run, they have an aging workforce and need the workers. They do need to manage the social consequences though.

    Well that's debatable. As a non expert, I'd say yes and no, but another poster pointed out that low skilled and even higher skilled workers could be looking at joblessness soon enough because of their roles becoming redundant when automation becomes prevalent. And yes to managing the social consequences. My main issue in all of this is how it's planned.

    Obviously the basic desire to help them is purely altruistic and one that I'm sure most people share, including me!


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  • #592
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Widdershins wrote: »
    I never said that, either. I said there could be the effect of encouraging more attempts but that's not the same as saying they should just stop running rescue missions. I never elaborated on what I thought they should do-because I don't know, I don't have all the answers. A bit of a nasty assumption to make, though, Brian.

    What assumption is nasty? You questioned whether the Navy should be running rescue missions, they either run them or not. If they don't, more people drown in the med. please don't be so defensive, I'm not accusing you of wanting people to die.

    However, some of the sentiments expressed by Mary really make me question if she feels that the refugees should be left to drown in the med. I can't help wonder.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #593
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Well that's debatable. As a non expert, I'd say yes and no, but another poster pointed out that low skilled and even higher skilled workers could be looking at joblessness soon enough because of their roles becoming redundant when automation becomes prevalent. And yes to managing the social consequences. My main issue in all of this is how it's planned.

    Obviously the basic desire to help them is purely altruistic and one that I'm sure most people share, including me!

    I'll be honest horse, I see a lot of posters on here who don't seem to want to help at all. Not you, but others.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #594
    Widdershins
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Brian? wrote: »
    What assumption is nasty? You questioned whether the Navy should be running rescue missions, they either run them or not. If they don't, more people drown in the med. please don't be so defensive, I'm not accusing you of wanting people to die.

    However, some of the sentiments expressed by Mary really make me question if she feels that the refugees should be left to drown in the med. I can't help wonder.

    That I thought they should just pull out of the Mediterranean. Fair Enough.

    I don't know what the alternative is. I think a few suggestions were made by others as to how it could be handled. I can't remember just now.

    I've read a few very good sugestions and ideas over the past weeks on these threads but seriously it would put you off discussions if you're going to get accused of things Maybe that's the intention.

    You never really know what any posters really think though, r.e Mary or anyone else! So I don't like to assume everyone's callous.


  • #595
    rgossip30
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭rgossip30


    Brian? wrote: »
    I'll be honest horse, I see a lot of posters on here who don't seem to want to help at all. Not you, but others.

    What are you doing to help ?


  • #596
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Well that's debatable. As a non expert, I'd say yes and no, but another poster pointed out that low skilled and even higher skilled workers could be looking at joblessness soon enough because of their roles becoming redundant when automation becomes prevalent.

    Good point,If brian? would like to head over to the do you support multicultralism thread a poster has pointed out an issue where we actually need people leaving rather than arriving

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057580682&page=285

    And very well written out.


  • #597
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    rgossip30 wrote: »
    What are you doing to help ?

    Apart from donating to NGOs and opening my home to foster children?

    You're right I'm not doing enough. I'll have to pull my socks up.

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #598
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    Good point,If brian? would like to head over to the do you support multicultralism thread a poster has pointed out an issue where we actually need people leaving rather than arriving

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057580682&page=285

    And very well written out.

    You linked a post inviting people to move to Russia, am I missing something?

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



  • #599
    gitzy16v
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,093 ✭✭✭gitzy16v


    Brian? wrote: »
    You linked a post inviting people to move to Russia, am I missing something?

    I wasnt sure how to link to a single post,its on that page posted by wibbs


  • #600
    Brian?
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,819 Mod ✭✭✭✭Brian?


    gitzy16v wrote: »
    I wasnt sure how to link to a single post,its on that page posted by wibbs

    There isn't a post by Wibbs on the page that I can see. I'm on the mobile

    they/them/theirs


    The more you can increase fear of drugs and crime, welfare mothers, immigrants and aliens, the more you control all of the people.

    Noam Chomsky



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  • #601
    Mr.Micro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,336 ✭✭✭Mr.Micro


    Brian? wrote: »
    Actually taking in refugees can be altruistic and have the knock on effect of benefitting the host country. I've said this all along. An influx of working age migrants will be good for Germany in the long run, they have an aging workforce and need the workers. They do need to manage the social consequences though.

    That is the major problem, social consequences. I am no expert but some of the problems I can see, IMO are. How can the huge numbers of refugee immigrants be managed? What happens then when the majority are male? So there is already an inbuilt imbalance, even before a country tries to integrate these people into the population, aside from the cultural differences. It might be easier if the numbers were of families and half men and half women. Then, there is a demand on the health service, social security, accomadation and all the rest. Here in Ireland we cannot even cope with our own population with regards to the Health services. It's a nightmare for the refugees and also the countries trying to assimilate these people. It's the sheer numbers as well.


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