UK Votes to leave EU

MrPudding · 06-10-2016 08:42PM

VinLieger wrote: »

LOL this is fantastic

So-called "fantastic".

MrP (on the mainland)

catbear · 06-10-2016 08:43PM

SeanW wrote: »

France and Spain will veto any application to join the EU by Scotland. They don't want to give their Basque separatists etc. any ideas.

Wasn't this all thrashed out months ago, I believe the guidance was that Spain wouldn't oppose Scotland joining the EU after first breaking its constitutional link with the UK and secondly Scotland retaining the UK currency exemption is also a non runner.

A Dub in Glasgo · 06-10-2016 08:51PM

SeanW wrote: »

France and Spain will veto any application to join the EU by Scotland. They don't want to give their Basque separatists etc. any ideas.

been covered before and not as clear cut as you make out

steddyeddy · 06-10-2016 09:33PM

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Me neither. My new workplace seems ok though. Might look at Germany...

Good stuff man. I'm not unhappy here either. Just looking to the future.

maryishere · 06-10-2016 10:41PM

SeanW wrote: »

France and Spain will veto any application to join the EU by Scotland. They don't want to give their Basque separatists etc. any ideas.

+1. The like of Spain will not want the EC to impose too unfair a deal on the UK post brexit either, given the huge amount it earns from tourism from the UK. And if the auld dictator Merkel wants to impose trade barriers to stop the UK exporting easily to the EC, I'm sure the German car manufacturers (who make a fortune out of exporting cars to the UK ) will love her for that when it in turn affects their exports. Merkel should concern herself more with the doomed EC and the huge debts of the German banks anyway.
The UK is right to look to trade more with the likes of the USA, China, Singapore, Australisa etc.
Wonder how long before a North Atlantic trade alliance (UK, Iceland, Ireland, US, possibly Denmark etc).

catbear · 06-10-2016 10:52PM

maryishere wrote: »

+1. The like of Spain will not want the EC to impose too unfair a deal on the UK post brexit either, given the huge amount it earns from tourism from the UK. And if the auld dictator Merkel wants to impose trade barriers to stop the UK exporting easily to the EC, I'm sure the German car manufacturers (who make a fortune out of exporting cars to the UK ) will love her for that when it in turn affects their exports. Merkel should concern herself more with the doomed EC and the huge debts of the German banks anyway.
The UK is right to look to trade more with the likes of the USA, China, Singapore, Australisa etc.
Wonder how long before a North Atlantic trade alliance (UK, Iceland, Ireland, US, possibly Denmark etc).

This has all been trashed out before. The vast majority of cars made in the UK are for the European market, what Germany loses in UK sales it gains by reduced competition.
Every EU country will want a piece of the UK. Even Norway is threatening blocking UKs EEA membership in return for a big slice of UK territorial water.
Even the commonwealth nations have jointly stated this week in London that a weakened Sterling has hit their trade with the UK and they'll be needing to look elsewhere.

The UK created the first global trade empire, but now globalized trade has left the UK far behind.

FrancieBrady · 06-10-2016 10:53PM

Everything is looking so rosy for the UK it's a wonder they didn't leave years ago. Well played Nigel, old chap!

Fratton Fred · 06-10-2016 10:59PM

catbear wrote: »

This has all been trashed out before. The vast majority of cars made in the UK are for the European market, what Germany loses in UK sales it gains by reduced competition.

It hasn't been thrashed out at all, other than by a few internet warriors.

ZeroThreat · 06-10-2016 11:14PM

catbear wrote: »

This has all been trashed out before. The vast majority of cars made in the UK are for the European market, what Germany loses in UK sales it gains by reduced competition.
Every EU country will want a piece of the UK. Even Norway is threatening blocking UKs EEA membership in return for a big slice of UK territorial water.
Even the commonwealth nations have jointly stated this week in London that a weakened Sterling has hit their trade with the UK and they'll be needing to look elsewhere.

The UK created the first global trade empire, but now globalized trade has left the UK far behind.

I somehow doubt the Brits are going to give sovereign territory away, especially to a pipsqueak nation such as Norway.

catbear · 06-10-2016 11:18PM

ZeroThreat wrote: »

I somehow doubt the Brits are going to give sovereign territory away, especially to a pipsqueak nation such as Norway.

Indeed. They seem happy enough to fall down economic table but go up the sovereignty table to the point where they might knock North Korea off the top.

ZeroThreat · 06-10-2016 11:25PM

catbear wrote: »

Indeed. They seem happy enough to fall down economic table but go up the sovereignty table to the point where they might knock North Korea off the top.

If things go really bad, they may have to reacquire the back garden next door for food security reasons.

FrancieBrady · 06-10-2016 11:27PM

David Trimble woken out of retirement by the BBC to claim that Brexit will have minimal impact in NI.

K-9 · 06-10-2016 11:52PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Judging by Scotland's economy they can most definitely do it alone.

And just like many on the Brexit side of the debate, many will think Scottish Independence will be worth any negatives.

As for a French and Spanish veto, it's a different dynamic now with the UK out. Even Donaldson in the DUP is open to closer North South links given the new situation.

dasdog · 07-10-2016 12:14AM

Sterling just collapsed on the Asian market open, euro spiked up to 95p and GBP/USD jumped down to $1.10. Anyone trading that the wrong way just got stung badly. Stabilising now and back above $1.20 in a matter of seconds. That is extreme volatility.

Junkyard Tom · 07-10-2016 12:30AM

maryishere wrote: »

The like of Spain will not want the EC to impose too unfair a deal on the UK post brexit either, given the huge amount it earns from tourism from the UK.

How much of the percentage of their economy would they stand to lose from British holidaymakers and expats if the EU welcomes a hard brexit. This is a simple question; can you answer it?

And if the auld dictator Merkel

How is Merkel a dictator? This is a simple question. Can you answer it?

I'm sure the German car manufacturers (who make a fortune out of exporting cars to the UK

What percentage of Germany's or France's national income comes from selling cars to Britain. This is a simple question, can you answer it?

The UK is right to look to trade more with the likes of the USA, China, Singapore, Australisa etc.

Why?

Wonder how long before a North Atlantic trade alliance (UK, Iceland, Ireland, US, possibly Denmark etc).

What is the North Atlantic Trade Alliance?

Capt'n Midnight · 07-10-2016 01:00AM

maryishere wrote: »

+1. The like of Spain will not want the EC to impose too unfair a deal on the UK post brexit either, given the huge amount it earns from tourism from the UK.

Spain is sunny and close to the UK.
Where else will the UK tourists go ?
Other Eurozone countries will have same restrictions on entry / exchange rate.

Or the million plus UK ex-pats living there ?

Spain will still be exporting food and drink to the UK even with tariffs simply because of transport costs.

maryishere · 07-10-2016 01:19AM

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Spain is sunny and close to the UK.
Where else will the UK tourists go ?
Other Eurozone countries will have same restrictions on entry / exchange rate.
.

If dictator Merkel imposes visas necessary for UK tourists to Spain, a hard border around the EC etc I can see more UK tourists going outside the EC (to Morocco, or the Caribbean for example , for those who want sun holidays, instead of the Canaries ).
When the EC falls apart Spain will still want to trade with the UK, and curse German interference.

As regards this little island, neither Dublin or London want a hard border...nobody in these islands do. If the EC imposes a hard border, it will be interference from Europe. And time to tell Europe to get stuffed. Not that Europe thinks a lot of us after our Apple tax attitude..

Junkyard Tom · 07-10-2016 01:26AM

maryishere wrote: »

dictator Merkel ... more UK tourists going outside the EC

Hi Mary, I hope you are well. Can you take a look at the questions I asked you and respond to them please? Go raibh maith agat.

learn_more · 07-10-2016 01:26AM

Jesus Christ, this EU malarkey is turning out to be more trouble than it's worth.

It doesn't seem that European countries have come closer together, rather it seems to be pushing us further apart.

Who would have though that Scotland want to leave the UK, but would want to remain part of the EU, even with a devolved parliament in place? I don't get it.

All I see is further fracturing of the EU as a result of Brexit.

If any country in the EU has any grievance with EU policy then all we are going to hear is that policy is being dictated from Brussels. And I worry that domestic issues will be sidelined in favour of boring EU controversies in the media forever and a day.

I'm beginning to think that the only way the EU would work is if we have a single EU government, where local issues are decided, well, locally.

I would have been all for further integration, especially an EU army. I think an EU army would mix up the usa/russia superpower proxy wars nonsense that is very relevant today in Syria. The UN is a completely ineffectual organisation. An EU superpower would be.

But I think now it's just ain't going to happen, or anything like it. People are still too patriotic, too nationalist, to see the bigger picture.

wes · 07-10-2016 01:44AM

maryishere wrote: »

If dictator Merkel imposes visas necessary for UK tourists to Spain, a hard border around the EC etc

She was democratically elected....... and can't impose anything on schegen area countries.

maryishere wrote: »

I can see more UK tourists going outside the EC (to Morocco, or the Caribbean for example , for those who want sun holidays, instead of the Canaries ).
When the EC falls apart Spain will still want to trade with the UK, and curse German interference.

I doubt Brits are going to holiday in North Africa, with all the instability there. Also, has anyone announced such visa restrictions?

BTW, the Brits own attitude to foreigners isn't exactly great, and I fully expect the EU countries to treat British citizens the same way they treat EU citizens.

maryishere wrote: »

As regards this little island, neither Dublin or London want a hard border...nobody in these islands do. If the EC imposes a hard border, it will be interference from Europe. And time to tell Europe to get stuffed. Not that Europe thinks a lot of us after our Apple tax attitude..

The EU won't be imposing anything. The Brits have decided to change things, and not the EU. If they go for a hard Brexit, then any changes that will cause, is on them. Trying to say that evil EU is imposing things is nonsense.

We joined the EU, and signed up the various treaties, and elected MEPs. The claim of things being imposed is simply not true. We made a choice like everyone else.

catbear · 07-10-2016 02:20AM

learn_more wrote: »

If any country in the EU has any grievance with EU policy then all we are going to hear is that policy is being dictated from Brussels. And I worry that domestic issues will be sidelined in favour of boring EU controversies in the media forever and a day.

I'm beginning to think that the only way the EU would work is if we have a single EU government, where local issues are decided, well, locally.

Do you realise you made a case both for and against Brussels in the same post?

Wow, hovering now around around .90 .
Wouldn't be surprised if it that was the Japanese saying enough of this crap, we're out

maryishere · 07-10-2016 02:25AM

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

How much of the percentage of their economy would they stand to lose from British holidaymakers and expats if the EU welcomes a hard brexit. This is a simple question; can you answer it?

Like your other silly questions, what has that to do with the price of eggs?
A quick google will tell you 12,790,998 British people holidayed in Spain last year. More British people holidayed in Spain than people from any other country in the world i.e the UK was the biggest source of revenue for the Spanish tourist industry. Also, Spain's foreign tourist industry has grown into the second-biggest in the world. The Spanish depend on the money from British tourists and pensioners....ever with this it has Banks close to bankrupt, huge national debt and youth unemployment close to 50%. If Merkel imposes restrictions, it will be at her peril. Germany cannot bailout out PIGS countries forever...wonder which one of those 4 will leave first?

K-9 · 07-10-2016 02:36AM

Holiday visas wont be a problem, both for tourists into Britain and out.

JupiterKid · 07-10-2016 02:55AM

I have little doubt that Brexit will be to Britain's cost, economically and politically. It may not happen tomorrow, or next week, or next month but the repercussions will be undoubedetly negative.

Just how negative those repercussions will be remains to be seen. Yes, the EU needs major and deep reform but leaving the union was not the answer.

Also, the lurching of the UK towards an anti foreign, right wing stance is unsettling to say the least.

And finally, Irish exporters to the UK, particularly the agri sector, will suffer.

Junkyard Tom · 07-10-2016 03:07AM

maryishere wrote: »

Like your other silly questions..

Hi Mary, thanks for getting back to me! Go raibh maith agat. How much of the percentage of the Spanish economy would they stand to lose from British holidaymakers and expats if the EU welcomes a hard brexit.

Q. Have you got a percentage for how much the Spanish stand to lose from British expats and holidaymakers Mary?

A.

Look, I've even made it easy for you to fill in the blanks. Just quote my post and fill in the answer to the claim you've made.

ancapailldorcha · 07-10-2016 03:57AM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Good stuff man. I'm not unhappy here either. Just looking to the future.

I just started my new job so it's a bit early to be thinking about moving yet. That said, if I can sort something in Germany...

CMOTDibbler · 07-10-2016 06:36AM

catbear wrote: »

Do you realise you made a case both for and against Brussels in the same post?

Wow, hovering now around around .90 .
Wouldn't be surprised if it that was the Japanese saying enough of this crap, we're out

Mad to think that just before the Brexit vote a pound bought €1.50. It now buys €1.12. That's a 25% fall in just over four months. That has to be having a knock on effect on inflation in the UK by now.

A Dub in Glasgo · 07-10-2016 07:21AM

maryishere wrote: »

Like your other silly questions, what has that to do with the price of eggs?
A quick google will tell you 12,790,998 British people holidayed in Spain last year. More British people holidayed in Spain than people from any other country in the world i.e the UK was the biggest source of revenue for the Spanish tourist industry. Also, Spain's foreign tourist industry has grown into the second-biggest in the world. The Spanish depend on the money from British tourists and pensioners....ever with this it has Banks close to bankrupt, huge national debt and youth unemployment close to 50%. If Merkel imposes restrictions, it will be at her peril. Germany cannot bailout out PIGS countries forever...wonder which one of those 4 will leave first?

Sounds like you have never travelled as part of the summer holiday migration to Spain, a few pointers for you

1. Spain has the weather that British (& Irish) crave during their summer holidays

2. Most resorts are a about 2 hours from most major conurbations in the UK

3. Most resorts are English speaking

4. Most resorts have the infrastructure to cater for the tourists

The holiday companies will include whatever requirements are needed to holiday to Spain in their brochures / bookings going forward

It is ridiculous to think that British folk will not want to holiday in Spain when Brexit happens

Peregrinus · 07-10-2016 07:37AM

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

It is ridiculous to think that British folk will not want to holiday in Spain when Brexit happens

Completely ridiculous. After all, British people holidayed in Spain in large numbers before the UK was in the EU, and they holidayed in Spain in large numbers when the UK was in the EU but Spain wasn't. So that notion that, when Spain is in the EU but the UK isn't, British people will not want to holiday in Spain, or will be prevented from doing so by onerous visa requirements or border controls or anything of the kind, is not very plausible.

To be honest, what's much more likely to adversely affect UK travel to Spain is not any kind of travel restriction; it's the decline in the value of Sterling. As CMOTDibbler points out, since the Brexit vote Sterling has lost 25% of its value relative to the Euro. That makes holidays in for Brits in Spain (or anywhere in Euroland) dramatically more expensive than they were a few months back. I don't think we've seen the effects of this yet; many of the holidays taken in the summer season just completed would have been booked and paid for before the Brexit vote. But from this point on I'd expect a measurable decline in UK travel to Euroland (and a measurable rise in Euroland travel to the UK), which will persist unless and until Sterling recovers.

CMOTDibbler · 07-10-2016 07:47AM

Peregrinus wrote: »

Completely ridiculous. After all, British people holidayed in Spain in large numbers before the UK was in the EU, and they holidayed in Spain in large numbers when the UK was in the EU but Spain wasn't. So that notion that, when Spain is in the EU but the UK isn't, British people will not want to holiday in Spain, or will be prevented from doing so by onerous visa requirements or border controls or anything of the kind, is not very plausible.

To be honest, what's much more likely to adversely affect UK travel to Spain is not any kind of travel restriction; it's the decline in the value of Sterling. As CMOTDibbler points out, since the Brexit vote Sterling has lost 25% of its value relative to the Euro. That makes holidays in for Brits in Spain (or anywhere in Euroland) dramatically more expensive than they were a few months back. I don't think we've seen the effects of this yet; many of the holidays taken in the summer season just completed would have been booked and paid for before the Brexit vote. But from this point on I'd expect a measurable decline in UK travel to Euroland (and a measurable rise in Euroland travel to the UK), which will persist unless and until Sterling recovers.

Thanks for the mention

The only alternative from a holiday point of view is to stay at home, since other destinations will most probably involve pound to dollar exchanges which are similarly affected. In any event, holidays in locations outside Europe are significantly more expensive so they would be limited in any case.

There may well be at least a short term slump in British holidays abroad and after that, it's hard to tell, since other factors could also come into play in the medium to long term. Inflation and wage stagnation being one.

UK Votes to leave EU

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