Texas Democrats flee to Oklahoma...

sanvean

I came across this in the Times. Just wondering what you all make of it. Is what the republicans are doing really in line with a democracy? Or is it the Democrats who are in the wrong? It seems a little bit curious, to say the least, that any party should be able to redraw political boundaries in order to put in more of their representatives in power. I would think undemocratic.

May 14, 2003

Democrat desperados flee Texas to foil Republican map plot
From Tim Reid in Washington



POLITICAL parties use many ruses to block legislation. They can debate a Bill to death, or kill it with amendments. But in Texas, when the going gets tough, the politicians get going, with state troopers in hot pursuit.
In an act of political sabotage that has more to do with the tactics of Butch Cassidy than parliamentary cunning, the Texas House of Representatives has been brought to a standstill after 58 Democrats skipped town, fled the state and went into hiding, with the fabled Texas Rangers hot on their tail.

Last night a large gang of the Democrat desperados were found in a hotel in Ardmore, Oklahoma, with no intention of returning to Austin to complete what has clearly been a highly divisive legislative session.

Under state law the Republicans, who control the governor’s mansion and the state House and Senate for the first time in 130 years, need 100 of 150 representatives on the floor of the House before they can form a quorum to vote on legislation.

In front of them is a plan by Republicans to redraw the congressional districting map, a brazen political manoeuvre that would help up to six more Texas Republicans to get seats in the US House of Representatives in Washington.

The move has the support of Tom DeLay, the US House Majority Leader and one of President Bush’s most powerful allies. Mr Bush is a former Texas Governor.

On Sunday, the day that the state House was to take up the redistricting Bill, the Democrats high-tailed it out of town. Under Texas law, the political leadership has the power to force politicians to attend votes, so Rick Parry, the Governor, duly dispatched state troopers and Rangers to arrest the Democrats and bring them back to Austin.

But the Democrats were no fools. Texas police have no authority to make the arrests in another state.

It was initially believed that the group, who also object to what they claim is a Republican legislative agenda that will hurt schools and health care but help big business, was hiding in New Mexico. That state was asked to co-operate.

However, Patricia Madrid, New Mexico’s Attorney-General said no. “I have put out an all-points bulletin for law enforcement to be on the lookout for politicians in favour of health care for the needy and against tax cuts for the wealthy,” Mrs Madrid said.

The Texas legislative session is scheduled to last for three more weeks. The Democrats have vowed to stay in Oklahoma until Thursday, the deadline for passing Bills.

The Democrat disappearing act is not without precedent. In 1979, 12 Texas state Democrat senators seeking to block legislation hid in an apartment in Austin for several days.

Sparks

You know, the more that I see Bush doing, the more I am reminded of Hitler's rise to power through the democratic system.

Sand

Sounds like something youd hear of in a "developing" democracy doesnt it:)

Not that its going to shake the world or anything but theyre setting a pretty bad precedent imo - as long as any party has 51 representives they can simply dig their feet in and prevent any bill going through even if it has strong support. Checks and balances I guess.

Biffa Bacon

Originally posted by Sparks
You know, the more that I see Bush doing, the more I am reminded of Hitler's rise to power through the democratic system.

Why, what was Bush's role in this?

Sparks

Why, what was Bush's role in this?

Don't be silly, I'm commenting on the similarities. We know there was no link between Bush and the Nazi party until after they came to power.

Captain Trips

Originally posted by Sparks
Don't be silly, I'm commenting on the similarities. We know there was no link between Bush and the Nazi party until after they came to power.

*cough* Leo Strauss *cough*

Sparks

Trips,
Well, yes, but that's not a direct link - I mean, I read Mein Kampf during history class, but that wouldn't count as a direct link - I hope!

Captain Trips

Sparks, if you ever get into government in this country I will be first in line to say you were a fan of Hitler when younger.

I suppose (irony not included here) that there are always tenuous links when looking at almost everything retrospectively. E.g., the numbers conspiracy from 9/11 and so on. It's easy to make a trail.

But there is still a trail................................:)

Sparks

lol trips, okay, since both of those scenarios are equally likely - but you have to be fair and decry the history teacher as well!

sanvean

Originally posted by Biffa Bacon
Why, what was Bush's role in this?

His approval. from the Irish Times yesterday:

The comic opera in President George Bush's home state has national implications. The redistricting measure was engineered from the US Congress in Washington by House majority leader, Mr Tom DeLay, with Mr Bush's approval.

linklinklink:
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/world/2003/0515/4222762294FR15TEXAS.html

vorbis

oh dear, bush isn't to blame for everything you know. As for the story, I dound it hilarious. They probably should be brought back as it is a bit undemocratic to disrupt a leglisative house in such a manner. Good plan though!

Sparks

vorbis,

bush isn't to blame for everything you know

Of course not.
*looks at Cheney, Rumsfeld, Ashcroft, Jeb Bush, and most of the PNAC members*

They probably should be brought back as it is a bit undemocratic to disrupt a leglisative house in such a manner.

And the plans to redraw constituency lines?

TomF

I can't be sure without doing a pile of tiresome research, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that Democrats in the Texas legislature were long implicated in redrawing district boundaries to make sure they include a majority of dependable voters for the Democratic ticket, and the present controversy is the result of the Republicans trying to make the boundaries fairer to them. It was once the case in the U.S. South that districts were redrawn to include most black voters in districts with a majority of white voters to ensure that segregation laws were not challenged. We know the same happened in Northern Ireland, and in fact that is probably the reason that Monaghan and Cavan didn't get included when the border was drawn--too many undependable voters. Gerrymandering here was the case, to paraphrase an overused piece of rhetoric "From the foundation of the Statelet."

sanvean

From the little I know about the American system, the Democrats are far from being innocent with regards to being undemocratic. Does anyone recall the percentage of votes the first Mayor Daly of Chicago got? Apparently people were rising from the dead to vote for him.

And the stories concerning black voters really doesn't surprise me, especially in the deep south. Does anyone remember the road blocks in Florida during the Bush election?

Captain Trips

Well let's face, if the US was Ireland and Bush didn't get his way, they'd just let it slide for a year to "re-educate" us (Mary Harney) and have the vote again a year later when people miraculously voted for him more appropriately.

Sparks

Using Daley as a metrestick of Democrat's morality is somewhat like using Hitler as a measure of German morality - the man is about as immoral as you can get in office.
(I'm a bit annoyed at him, in case you can't tell, over the whole Meigs Field debacle)

sanvean

I don't understand quite what you mean. The Democratic Party is far from left-wing, and is nearly as corrupt and morally deficient as the republican party. in fact, it's really only saved by the contrast to the republican party in its reagan era incarnation. remember back in the sixties and early seventies, there really was little or no difference between the two. wasn't it kennedy who implemented the Cuban blockade?

Sparks

sanvean,
I'm not saying the Democrats are wonderful people - I'm saying Daley isn't a good metric to use, as there's a long family history of his ilk running chicago in a corrupt fashion.
Besides, he's a thug.
[mutter]Carving up a beautiful airport with backhoes in the middle of the night like some gestapo tosspot... *fume* [/mutter]

Captain Trips

I think the Republicans are as corrupt as the Democrats, but are simply more honest and open about it.

sanvean

Sparks: i can see where you're coming from. point taken.

Originally posted by Sparks
[mutter]Carving up a beautiful airport with backhoes in the middle of the night like some gestapo tosspot... *fume* [/mutter]

buh? what happened there? is this o'hare?

Sparks

sanvean,
No, Meigs Field

sanvean

Oh, right. I hadn't heard of that until now (in fact, I hadn't even heard of that airport, despite having lived there for ... what, four months?).

I was talking about his father, btw. like father like son, i guess.

Sparks

sanvean,
Never heard of Meigs Field? Haven't you ever played Microsoft Flight Simulator?

sanvean

Originally posted by Sparks
sanvean,
Never heard of Meigs Field? Haven't you ever played Microsoft Flight Simulator?

Interestingly, when I searched google for just what Meigs Field was (what it was exactly, as it was quite obvious that it was an air field of some sort) everyone was complaining about it being levelled primarily because it was used in a flight simulator game. how bizarre. And, no I've never played it (as you could probably have guessed). flight simulators are too complicated for me, i'm afraid (give me mariokart anyday).