NTL Ireland for Sale - 100,000 euros (Indo).

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 8:50am #1

The Independent is reporting that NTL Ireland is up for sale. Originally costing 674 M euros, 'sources close to the company' believe it is unlikely to be sold for more than 100,000 euros. Full story here.

crawler · 06-03-2003 8:58am

I believe EVERYTHING I read in the paper!

In particular papers owned by O'Reilly & Eircom & Co!!

It makes me laugh........

No smoke without fire and all that but realistically....

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 9:04am

Hey, I'm just reporting what it says.

Apparently, these same sources say that the Irish operation is "just a distraction at the group level".

dahamsta · 06-03-2003 9:11am

There's been a lot of speculation about this in the past, although I think a lot of it has been hope on customers part. I hope it's true though, and I hope it's taken over by local (or localish) investors. Knowing our good friend Etain Doyle though, she'll probably be encouraging Tony O'Reilly to take a shareholding. I mean, only a simpleton would allow a shareholder in Ireland's most abusive telecommunication provider retain his shareholding in Ireland's most incompetent cable provider, so this would be par for the course. Go for it Etain!

adam

crawler · 06-03-2003 9:17am

I know skeptic - Just being reactive , sorry!

It's lots of rehashed news and was bound to follow after the Chater 11 process was completed.

O'Reilly and Co have a vested interest in bad news on this front.

Dangger · 06-03-2003 10:04am

Any one buyin' or selling' de cableco .... two previous owners, going for a song, step up now......

Anyone any interest in chipping in?

DMC · 06-03-2003 10:11am

I have €2.60. Anyone else?

MDR · 06-03-2003 10:13am

right the chairman has gone insane,
abandon ship .....:D

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 11:31am

Remember that Irish times interview with Stephen Carter back in 2001:

Can you give the consumer an idea of when the focus would move to broadband?

No.

Can we [Irish consumers] put it off for at least a year?

Someone once told me the only luxury you have in an interview is not to say something, we are doing what we are doing in broadband. We've had a trial going in west Dublin that's gone very well. We're emerging from chapter 11 process, we've got new leadership in the business in Ireland, we re rolling out digital, improving customer service and we have some exciting plans for broadband. I think if you look at the telecoms and technology territory that's a pretty good place for the company to be.

"Exciting plans for broadband"- What does that mean?

I don't know yet.

When will the company know?

When it knows.

If the top story is true, I doubt if it is great news for the Irish consumer - the network and customer base would probably be sold to asset sweating investors, however isn't that basically what we've got now?

dahamsta · 06-03-2003 11:46am

the network and customer base would probably be sold to asset sweating investors, however isn't that basically what we've got now?

What we've had now for quite some time.

I know that a lot of people are critical of Denis O'Brien's business methods, but I have to say - again - that I'd like to see Denis take over NTL or Chorus. He's definitely ruthless in his approach, but he's also pragmatic, and pragmatism for a cable operator says that if you can get the cash, the Internet and particularly service bundles are the way forward. Obviously you're going to need a /lot/ of cash to buy your way out of the mess NTL has made of itself, but Denis has already proven that he can source the cash if he wants to.

Unfortunately for the poor bstards - like me - stuck with Chorus, expansion would have to go on the back burner for a good while, and we'd be stuck with Chorus for even longer. However, a start's a start.

adam

MarVeL · 06-03-2003 12:15pm

Thought I'd have a quick look at the NTL site to see if there was any mention of this. No sign so far. Interesting/ominous link in the press section for executive profiles though

Hmmmm

Should we be worried? :-)

BoneCollector · 06-03-2003 12:58pm

and the lesson to be learned by any foriegn investors

WARNING!!!
DO not buy anything thats "Gauranteed Irish"
cus thats no Gaurantee at all

Calibos · 06-03-2003 1:03pm

If NTL had of paid €100,000 for Cablelink they could have spent that €500,000,000 on infrastructure investment and we'd all have cable modems by now. Maybe this $100,000 means the new owner will have the capital to carry out the required investment?

Maybe this story could have a silver lining??

Just got NTL digital today BTW!:D I might be making the Direct Debit mandate out to a different company!!:D

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 1:11pm

I've got a feeling this is more 'poor mouth' from NTL somehow.

I doubt if it is O Reilly (part owner of Chorus) bad-mouthing NTL as has been suggested in another forum since the two companies don't compete and Chorus has been up for sale for some time now.

BoneCollector · 06-03-2003 1:17pm

how about a 1000 of us pull together and spend 100 € and buy it and provide our own Network

DeVore · 06-03-2003 1:19pm

Isnt O'Reilly part owner of Eircom? Eircom and NTL sure as hell compete.

The indo's a rag anyway.

Here, Dangger bud, I'll swap yah two packets of fags and a can of coke eh? Gowan now... I've a carburetor from an aul Morris Minor I'll throw in for free...

DeV.

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 1:25pm

Originally posted by DeVore
Isnt O'Reilly part owner of Eircom? Eircom and NTL sure as hell compete.

NTL still do some leased line level business along with a number of other companies, but they recently got out of the residential telco business claiming that they did not get a good deal from Eircom. Their cable network, is no threat to Eircom.

DeVore · 06-03-2003 1:38pm

Comms companies see each other as competition in the future, look at Eircom's attempt to muscle into TV and they know that anyone with a network is a potential competitor to them. I wouldnt be surprised if they view ESB and Bord Gais as competitors too (they are!).

DeV.

dahamsta · 06-03-2003 1:39pm

Maybe this $100,000 means the new owner will have the capital to carry out the required investment?

No. They'll also be buying debt and regulatory-required investment requirements. The real cost will be much higher.

adam

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 2:04pm

Originally posted by DeVore
Comms companies see each other as competition in the future, look at Eircom's attempt to muscle into TV and they know that anyone with a network is a potential competitor to them. I wouldnt be surprised if they view ESB and Bord Gais as competitors too (they are!).

They are indeed, but Eircom's usual line is to inflate their threat from competitors in the press. Almost from day one, their line was that the market was terribly competitive. Most likely they do this to get concessions out of the regulatory authorities. Most recently they have been claiming to be under threat from the mobile operators.

One possible thing they may be trying to do (assuming NTL are trying to sell the Irish operation) is depress the sale price so that the O Reilly group can acquire it cheaply. If they are trying to sell Chorus however, this would work against them. It would be like trying to sell your house while pointing out that the one next door is worth squat.

That's why I think that either the story is true or else it is NTL putting on the poor mouth.

crawler · 06-03-2003 2:28pm

I think that €100k could actually be €100m - bit of a difference.

http://www.electricnews.net/news.html?code=9351649

dahamsta · 06-03-2003 2:32pm

I think that €100k could actually be €100m - bit of a difference.

Only a moron would buy NTL Ireland at that figure, unless NTL was willing to write off some or all of the debt. Which is a possibility I suppose.

adam

longword · 06-03-2003 2:47pm

Originally posted by dahamsta
Only a moron would buy NTL Ireland at that figure, unless NTL was willing to write off some or all of the debt. Which is a possibility I suppose.

How much debt is NTL Ireland carrying? They've usually been in profit and they've made no major capital investments, where would the debt come from?

SkepticOne · 06-03-2003 2:52pm

Originally posted by longword
How much debt is NTL Ireland carrying? They've usually been in profit and they've made no major capital investments, where would the debt come from?

According to the article, most of their 'losses' are from an inter-company loan and depreciation. The inter-company loan of course, just means that NTL Ireland can present a difficult financial situation to the regulator here while continueing to export money in the form of interest payments to the their UK parent. At the group level such loans would be eliminated.

dahamsta · 06-03-2003 3:14pm

The inter-company loan of course, just means that NTL Ireland can present a difficult financial situation to the regulator here while continueing to export money in the form of interest payments to the their UK parent.

Very true. Obviously it will come in handy in any takeover negotiations too though. That said, this is all of course idle speculation at the moment. The Irish Independent is hardly an authoritative or trustworthy source when it comes to communications matters.

adam

crawler · 06-03-2003 3:27pm

Well said Adam - it's not even for sale......

The Indo has really become a rag these days - which is a pity.

De Rebel · 06-03-2003 3:44pm

Originally posted by BoneCollector
how about a 1000 of us pull together and spend 100 € and buy it and provide our own Network

great idea, the lowest bidder gets to be customer services director....

De Rebel · 06-03-2003 3:48pm

whatever the truth of the matter, its pretty irrelevant to this forum. if anybody buys NTL-Ireland it will be to use it as a cash cow there is no possibility of the capital to re- cable the existing areas being made available.

as an aside..... is this a record for IOLLF......... there appears to be unanimity regarding the standard of journalism in the Indo...

crawler · 06-03-2003 4:01pm

To end the rumour.

http://www.businessworld.ie/livenews.htm?a=638983

De Rebel , I agree, This post does not help the cause really anyway but I think it is best to be infomed.

De Rebel · 06-03-2003 4:09pm

Originally posted by crawler
De Rebel , I agree, This post does not help the cause really anyway but I think it is best to be infomed.

Sorry, wasn't criticising Skeptic for posting, was just observing that there is almost zero chance of Cable being the solution to our problems. I agree its good to be informed. (and its nice to know whats in the indo too, not that that has anything to do with being informed

)

KdjaCL · 06-03-2003 4:33pm

If true i woundt be surprised to see Esat/BT (actually BT ) buying it ,total domination of the cable market and cable internet.
Only competition would be Sky and BT and SKy in UK are very close.

kdjac

sceptre · 06-03-2003 4:55pm

Give that it was only a rumour, I'll be lazy and just close this.

Oh yeah - the Indo is a rag - you wouldn't catch me carrying one

NTL Ireland for Sale - 100,000 euros (Indo).

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