Are games an art form?

Sliotar

In the "is gaming a sport" thread, blitz mentioned that there are thousands of different games, and they are all so different, that "gaming" in general can never be a sport. i think hes right there. in that thread we were mainly thinking about FPS like quake and cs.

but what about games like metal gear solid, mario, final fantasy, silent hill? theres no competetive element in these games so they cant possibly be any kind of sport.

but are they art? just as film was the new art form for the 20th century, are games the art form for the 21st century?

i've always thought so. but its not commonly accepted as art. probably because games have been very simplistic untill recently(well, the alst decade). people would look at a game like space invaders back in the 70's and say "oooh what a nice toy", but never "what an exceptional example of neo post-modernistic art", or something like that....

but they've reached, or are reaching, the level of sophistication to achive art statis.

anyways i'm rambling, what do you's all think?

Jimi-Spandex

Well, games have been works of art, way ahead of their time, Mario64 for example, but the catch is that games don't age nearly as well as art, the graphics become dated, the concept becomes tired and in some cases the gameplay becomes dated,(eg 90% of arcade games from 1985 onwards-fun but most inherintly unoriginal). Games are unlike any artform we have ever seen, games for the most part get less fun as they get older(well not for me as my mame collection suggests), does this happen to music? are classical tunes any less appealing than the day they were composed? Are the paintings of the renaissance any less stunning centuries later? There are excecptions -Asteroids, BattleZone, Street Fighter 2, Mario3 etc, perhaps it is merely the only sign of a true classic piece of gaming art.

Another issue facing gaming's transition to an art form is acceptance, not acceptance by us the "hardcore" as it were, acceptance by the general public, this is coming closer and closer as time goes by but its a long way off, the casual gamer usually won't go outside the familiar (random ea game), (random wwf game), champ manager to something deeper eg Deus Ex, Zelda, MetalGearSolid etc. The reason being that they don't want to have to sit down with the game for more than 20 mins to enjoy it. I would roughly predict that it will be 201X before i see Space War!, Asteroids or a Battle Zone arcade machine in the Gugenheim

seo é mo chúpla phingin

amp

Well if a pile of bricks or a sheep suspended in formaldehyde can be called art then by jimmny so can games.

But I think the problem in defining games as art is that they are essentially collages. You've got yer 3d, yer 2d, music etc. In that way games are more akin to movies than art. But I guess some movies can be defined as art as well.

Then you've got the whole problem of defining art!

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Sliotar

and thats a whole different conversation...

one i dont want to even try get my head 'round...

BlitzKrieg

Well seeing i caused this post (without intention) I will try to answer it.

lets see IS GAMING A ART.............Can it be defined as art...........well i can say yes. We have mentioned grpahics and 2d and 3d etc etc. BUT would you say tha is where the games heart beaths....noooooooo


We'll take a example which i have recently revisited DEUS EX. good game? yes. Why? Becuase of its DESIGN (i gotta learn to use bold)


The art form i see in deus ex is not its story or its graphics. Its how its played. Like how Virtua fighter is played differently to tekken. The art is how it moves and reacts.


U HAVE CRAPPY ART:

Games hich move in shadow of others and move to a boring design a "useless" IDEA.


U HAVE THE CLASSIC ART

Simple pre gaming renisance which move on the idea tha they move to bring joy, by sheer playability example street fighter 2 and other classic. the picture it paints has no depth (not much anyway) BUT it does feel the part it intended and is a complete jaw dropper to experiance.


RENASANCE (spelt wrong cant be arsed to get a dictionary)GAMING

Yes the depth appears the idea which can performe a hunderd results. Back to my subject deus ex. Its a form of reniasance art born of system shock. Its depth of the picture is how u can get lost in the freedom it espresses in the players ability to do wha he wants. So its a game which its art is expressing freedom at basic. this would be the idea of the painting. then give it a scene Future conspiracy. then emotion GUNS, PLOT, ACTION, etc.

So u got uer gaming art form. Its the idea and design which expresses something wrapped in a setting and drama which u control.


U have pre renisance redone example The new sonic and mario games which hold the same true to fashion gaming which existed but with a improved depth and emotion.


U have collages of expressions and ideas.

Then u gotta take in the fact tha gaaming then takes from all the art forms. Story telling cinematics visual audio immagitive epressive and more.


YES GAMING IS A ART FORM and though as rightly pointed they quickly become dated its the expression behind the game which is the art which is then covered in another art form. So a hunderd games can share the same artform of shooting incoming aliens.

-BEFORE YOU FLAME ME!!!
-MY SISTER IS A ANIMATION STUDENT SO U CAN GUESS I HEAR THIS AT THE FAMILY DINNERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (and u already know tha sliot)

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oooo thats cunning

Sliotar

well i've never been to one of your "family dinners", but i can guess that they must be pretty interesting, judging by the sh|t you were coming up with there j/k

all very true though blitz, man i love games, maybe i should go out and get a new one, been playing the same game for 6 months straight (tfc) not to mention my little spree with cs (how did i ever play that sh|t3 so fervently??)

whats a good pc game??

BlitzKrieg

Well i would recommand trying deus ex its not everyones cup of tea so u can borrow my copy (not copied) next time i see ye.

But MAX PAYNE IS shapping up nicely and its out next month this month THIS TIME.


BUT

I cant recommand i've fallen off my game been watching too much anime and manga (TENCHI!!!) and nt playing enuf.


boo hoo hoo without adren to p!ss me off i'm totally off my gaming knowledge

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People of the Boards

I have a cunning plan

and before u ask how cunning

just trust me its cunning

oooo thats cunning

Sliotar

hmmm, max payne, was'nt that supposed to come out a year ago?? dam if only i could get red alert 2 to work on my comp, then i'd have somethin to play