Battle of the Sneakers...

hamster

Sneaking for a living?

I thought I'd do a quick comparison of Thief vs Deus Ex showing the differences between each game when you go ahead and try to take out the enemy in a non-lethal way. Concentrating on the AI and items on hand.


* Sneaking up within striking range:

In Thief, when you crouch sneak towards your unsuspecting opponent. You have to be real careful though sneaking up bit by bit. You have to watch the surface you sneak up especially metal or marble. In Deus Ex, you can sneak up behind no problem... doesn't matter what the surface is... the tension comes when...


* Knocking out the unsuspecting enemy

In Thief, you are always 100% successful knocking out the guards (well you are a master thief) or locals if they are not aware of your presence. Only that some guards wearing helmets that force other tactics.. eg gas. Deus Ex, on the other hand, you can never be quite 100% that you can knock out the target with the baton all the time (even on master)... but Deus Ex added realism here. But...


* Reaction of the Guards upon discovery of one or more bodies

In Thief, you will want to hide the bodies otherwise you facing a demanding manhunt which on expert level can last several minutes and they don't give up easy. In addition, the guards remain on edge afterwards... making all knockouts afterwards even more difficult with stun tactics. They go around screaming "murder!" alerting the other guards. Soon you got the local area on your tail. In Deus Ex, the guards don't even register the bodies exist (what body?). In one example a guard sat down on his chair with 6 of buddies laid on the floor all around him. Although you can still hide the bodies which keeps that realism going (with a touch of '007). More...


* Alternatives

I like that in Deus Ex you got several alternatives to the non-lethal approach... knockout darts which add a nice tension situation. The guy may find or get you before he passes out. Riot gas, pepper gas and the prod gun broaden this approach.
In Thief, you can use your trusty blackjack with a flashbomb (visually stuns) to knock them out.


* Being spotted... uh oh

In Thief, that's it. You WILL NEED to hide effectively for quite some time or out with the flash bombs (if you're lucky). They don't give up easily and will give chase. In Deus Ex, if you get into the
shadows or a real dark area... ie if they lose contact with you for more than 20 seconds... that's it... they just give up... "He's probably miles away now" or "No sigh of him now". I remember this in one scene when I just escaped from a my cell in a maximum security area! The A.I can be really made to pay for this: You can take out a guard one at a time... with 20-30 seconds intervals in between each knockout especially with the dart gun. Similarly in when taking them out with a sniper rifle. The Poor AI just settle back down into the same room/area again after getting a tad bit upset that yet another one of their buddies has hit the ground.

But this is only one way going about it in Deus Ex... slaughter them could just as rewarding. In Thief you sometimes have to "ghost it", ie, don't knock out or kill anybody. That's is sneak around completely without detection.

Barry Aldwell

You talk about sneaking, yet you don't mention Metal Gear Solid. Okay, so the 2nd one was a bit crap, and more about shooting, but the 1st one was the master, you've got to admit.

jaggeh

no game can come close to thief at master level when it comes to sneaking.

Sand

Nah, Thief 2 was the master - look up sneak em up in the dictionary and youll find Thief 2:)

Deus Ex wasnt all that as a sneak em up - some parts required some stealth but only in so far youd try to pick off the enemy one by one rather than take em on all at once - it was basically an expanded fps. Dunno how realistic it was tbh - lost count of how many times id shoot a guy in the back of the head and hed trun around and start shooting back.....when youre shot in the head, you drop unless youve partaken of vast quantites of cocaine:)

Sangre

Yeah you really only had to sneak in Deus Ex at the start when you had low level skills, after that I just hacked every computer and got the turrets to gun down the enemies.

Retr0gamer

My nikes are alright

DiscoStu

Originally posted by Sand
Nah, Thief 2 was the master - look up sneak em up in the dictionary and youll find Thief 2:)

Deus Ex wasnt all that as a sneak em up - some parts required some stealth but only in so far youd try to pick off the enemy one by one rather than take em on all at once - it was basically an expanded fps. Dunno how realistic it was tbh - lost count of how many times id shoot a guy in the back of the head and hed trun around and start shooting back.....when youre shot in the head, you drop unless youve partaken of vast quantites of cocaine:)

have to agree there. theif was a pure sneak em up. deus ex while stealth was an option it was not the only option. the fact that the story was so good, so well told, each mission could be tackled from a different point of view and it looked so bloody good at the time you could overlook the slight lacking of brains on the part of the grunts etc. and just be drawn into a compelling world.

po0k

*cough* hitman tbh
Piano wire.