prostitution

Silent Grape

Hey there, merry christmas etc. : )

i was just wondering what anybody thought about prostitution, escorts, brothels, strippers etc etc. do you think its okay to be a prostitute and that they deserve as much respect as any other working person, or do you think the complete opposite?

is there a difference between the girls (and boys) on the streets and those that operate out of high class apartments?? would you continue a friendship/relationship/aquaintance with someone if you found out that they were being paid for sex?
would you visit a prostitute? its just something ive been thinking about since that person wrote about his thoughts of visiting a prostitute.

i hope everyone had a peaceful christmas
xx

Mercury_Tilt

This post has been deleted.

Silent Grape

yeh thats something i also meant to add in my first post. People do have a perception of esorts as people who have fallen down on their luck, and are forced into it. The reality is somewhat different, though of course there are plently of unfortunate cases like that. the girls you see wandering the streets are usually (and i dont mean to generalise, but its true) very hard up. lots of them are single mothers, seriously depressed, homeless or being forced to do it by dominant males in their lives. this is of course terrible and disgraceful. the men who use these girls either dont know about other prostitution services offered (which is unlikely) or are just bastards. i heard one guy say the other week that although he only uses a certain company's girls, it 'couldn't beat the thrill of a pick - up' i just thought that was disguisting.

what about the escorts who have their own websites, and travel all over the place, earning thousands and clearly having the choice of continuing this kind of life or not? people still seem to pity them. Even their employers seem to pity them!

i know many escorts and strippers and the like and they dont have a problem with doing it. and they're probably the richest people on the planet

anyway i just want to known what other people think, and here i am warbling my way down the page : )

xx

Shad0r

Originally posted by Silent Grape
i was just wondering what anybody thought about prostitution, escorts, brothels, strippers etc etc. do you think its okay to be a prostitute and that they deserve as much respect as any other working person, or do you think the complete opposite?

Yeah they deserve the same amount of respect as anyone else. They are human beings at the end of the day. I'm pro choice so whatever floats one's boat.

is there a difference between the girls (and boys) on the streets and those that operate out of high class apartments??

Probably only about 20 or 30 STD's and a heroin habit.

would you continue a friendship/relationship/aquaintance with someone if you found out that they were being paid for sex?

Friendship/aquaintance, yes. Relationship? Not a chance.

would you visit a prostitute? its just something ive been thinking about since that person wrote about his thoughts of visiting a prostitute.

I wouldnt but each to their own. I doubt it will be like you think it will though. If you were going to Russia or Estonia (where they have borderline supermodels that are prostitutes) it would probably be a different ball game, but over here....

The Gopher

You often read about women who are tricked in Russia into coming here for decent jobs only to become prostitutes and be trapped here doing it.Either the whole process is badly explained by the media or the prostitutes are using this as an excuse when theyre caught.
How can they not escape,unless they are confined to a brothel,and even there they could organise with the rest of them to attack thepimps and escape.If they are working on the street they could run to the nearest Garda station.After all there isnt one pimp for every prostitute.They cannot keep an eye on them all the time.
As for would I visit one yes,but probably only the expensive ones,and seeing as I cant be throwing away 500 euro an hour to a woman who hasnt got a disease my experience of call girls might never materialise. Its no wonder celebrities use them all the time with the money they earn.
All these moralistic hypcrites in page 3 tit newspapers like the Sun should quit harrasing the likes of Angus Deayton and all the rest just because they visited a prossie.
Can anybody tell me if it was ever mentioned anywhere exactly what percentage of prostitutes inIreland have a disease or a drug habit(or both)?Perhaps before I pass judgement on the street hookers I should hear the facts.
If they please me maybe I would give it a try If there was no such thing as STDs Id be using the cheap ones constantly whether I had a girlfriend or not:)
Just out of curiousity does a condom protect against any type of infection that isnt located outside/around of the body e.g pubic lice,warts etc or is there a risk of picking up the likes of AIDS and chlamydia even with one?Because under my current estimation if you picked up a girl off the street(preferably with the shaven haven to prevent the old crabs:) )and you had a look around for any herpes related sores you would be doing OK for yourself using a good quality connie.Am I right?

Gordon

Not having enough time to answer the first of your post I will answer the second of you rpost, quickly.

You can get STD's from sexual intercourse by using a condom. You can get Pubic lice, herpes... well I don't know much more but you can get a whole load of sexually transmitted diseases even if you wear a condom!

Basic instinct = WEAR A CONDOM!

Placebo

would you continue a friendship/

"A friend in need is a friend indeed , a friend with weed is better"
Doesnt matter WHAT they do , WHO they are , a friend is a friend.

___________________________________
On that note , my friend says prostitues are easily available in ireland ? Hes wrong , isnt he ?

Silent Grape

i completely agree with you, placebo, a friend is a friend, no matter what.

if any of my friends told me they were a working girl i would have no problem at all with it. i know quite a few as i spent a few months dabbling in the whole adult entertainment thing.

that was such a nice thing you said about friends, placebo. it really perked up my crappy night : )

xx

please dont take a girl offf the street, gopher. have some pity and dignity and go to the internet, where you'll find hundreds of contact numbers for different companies.

Mercury_Tilt

This post has been deleted.

JustHalf

I've always wondered... why would anyone go to a prostitute? Obviously people do, but what's the point? It's not like its hard to get it for free, and if you're willing to go to a prostitute there's no moral problem in using a woman like that anyway.

DapperGent

I think prostitutes provide an alternative to people who don't have the confidence to get it for free from some random chick picked up in a nightclub.

Though for the most part I'd say people use them:

1 to have a sexual experience with absolutely no strings attached.

2 to have a sexual experience which their partner will not/cannot provide them with.

3 to experience sex where what you want is all that matters.

4 to have power over/dominate someone else sexually.

I have never used a prostitute myself and I certainly wouldn't condemn anyone for doing so, given that they didn't do anything that the prostitute/rent boy (is that the accepted term or is it male prostitute?) didn't want them to.

I also have no problem with someone being a prostitute if that's what they want to do and if they are emotionally and intellectually capable of making the decision.

The problem is that I doubt many prostitutes are capable of making that decision (or can think of no other option) and end up destroying theselves in the process.

Clintons Cat

i was just wondering what anybody thought about prostitution, escorts, brothels, strippers etc etc. do you think its okay to be a prostitute and that they deserve as much respect as any other working person, or do you think the complete opposite?

i dont think respect is quite the right word,
i respect nurses,firemen and police,and to a lesser extent the armed services for putting their ideals on the line.
but i dont respect many other professions such as soliciters acountants and taxmen.So if the question is do you prefer Prostitutes to taxmen i guess the answer would be yes.

is there a difference between the girls (and boys) on the streets and those that operate out of high class apartments?

Not really except the cost,general appearance and one would presume cleanliness/general hygene of having en suite facillities also there would be other perks such as ambient lighting and mood music i believe in some establishments there might even provide access to SKY Sports Channel.
I would assume the risk of stds was comparable though.

would you continue a friendship/relationship/aquaintance with someone if you found out that they were being paid for sex?

Friendship yes,aquaintence definately,relationship,probally not unless it was in the distant past.I certainly wouldnt knowingly initiate a sexual relationship with someone in the sex trade for a fear of contracting STDs and general concerns over their physical welfare...Would i be comfortable with my partner placing themselves in a position with a disproportionate risk of attack/rape/murder at the hands of a complete stranger?
well quite frankly no,no matter how good the money was.

would you visit a prostitute? its just something ive been thinking about since that person wrote about his thoughts of visiting a prostitute.

Nope Personally its not my thing.

............

I've always wondered... why would anyone go to a prostitute? Obviously people do, but what's the point? It's not like its hard to get it for free, and if you're willing to go to a prostitute there's no moral problem in using a woman like that anyway.

Maybe because initiating a sexual relationship with someone involves a bit of emmotional intimacy,which some people find either difficult or unwarrented,especially if they are in another relationship,(is it to much of a generalisation to assume that most clients of prostitutes are married men?)
A prostitute isnt going to keep calling your phone afterwards.

Secondly in a Pick up situation there is also the risk of being turned down,by going to a prostitute the uncertainty/vulnrability is negated.Its about sex on demand+/=control

Thirdly because its illiict its a stimulant,the whole doing something naughty sctick.

BEAT

I think it's ridiculous to believe that in this day and age someone is 'forced' into prostitution. They do it because they want to do it or because they are ignorant enough to believe they have todo it because they cant find a legitimate job.
I dont have a problem with them because afterall it is thier life and they can do what they want with it, but if a prostitute says she is forced to live this way of life then that is just ignorant and they deserve whatever misery becomes of them.

Clintons Cat

Alot of eastern european girls end up in brothels after being deceived about the nature of the work they are recruited to undertake.
Many are niave to beleive they are being recruited for au pair or hostess work and end up having to pay back the costs of flight and accomodation to their newly found pimps at vastly inflated intrest rates plus other expenses such as management costs ect.

LegacyUser

Its me,I inadvertendtly logged out and cant be arsed checking my email to get the password back at this moment in time.
Anyway,as Clintons Cat says about the eastern european girls tricked into doing it,nobody has anwsered my original question.Why do they not run to the nearest police station once they are put out on the streets of the west to work?Even if they are confined to a brothel surely there would be some way to esacpe?Such as using a customers mobile to ring for help when he isnt looking.Sorry but if you ask me the excuse of being trapped into it is most probably some yarn they spin in order to stay in the country.IMHO there is no way that a girl could not escape if she was working on the streets.
Look if there is a real explanation would someone please give it rather than criticising me for being ignorant?If there is a real explanation I would really like to hear it:)

Is porn a form of prostitution?When you think about it most porn is where somebody recieves money for having sex through the selling of the pictures/films.

And as a final word what is morally wrong with using street prostitutes as opposed to the more expensive call girls?Some of the call girls may also be supporting a drug habit(though it is more likely to be cocaine,therefore they have a lower disease risk that heroin users).Wasnt the topic originally about not being prejudicial to women who work in the industry,whether on the streets or in their own homes?

BTW wheh you say you dabbled in the adult industry can you elaborate?Im just curious:)

LegacyUser

Just to add on seeing as I cant edit my previous post surely some of the women who work on the street arent addicted to drugs or in any way forced into the business?So is it really all that immoral?And vice versa some of the call girls have been forced into the industry by debt or drug problems.Just because theprositute is from the inner city it doesnt mean she is doing it to support a habit or pay off a debt,and just because the girl is from Howth or Ballsbridge it doesnt mean she isnt in debt or hooked on drugs.

Seeing as we seem to be in support of the call girls how much do they cost on average?:)

Silent Grape

just half, there are lots of reasons people seek out an escort, the main one is losing virginity. lots and lots of 20 something year olds desperate to lose their virginity. its a bit sad. the numbers of married men looking for prostitutes are phenomenal. many are in the 50's or 60's and i guess they're just bored or something. many are 'up in Dublin on business' so you get asked for a weekend sometimes. its not just sex either . there are a LOT of men just looking for oral sex, handjobs, spanking, stripping, BDSM, private lapdancing etc etc. Another thing is that lots of the men who are in Dublin for a few days just want someone to go to business dinners with and whatnot.

Dapper Gent, how do you know that many prostitutes are incapable of making 'the desision'. and what is the descision? to be prostitutes or not???

rape and murder in relation to prostitutes are far more common in daytime american soaps than anywhere else. although i have to admit ive heard of a couple of rapes that have happened to street prostitutes. ive never heard of anything like that happening to escorts. its a whole different story with regards to companies girls. if the girl is working in a centre (brothel type place) then the client will be checked out verbally by the manager when he is making the appointment. there's usually a minder outside the door or close by if there's a problem. a girl is far more likely to get raped in a club than by a client.

gopher, as for street girls going to the police, thats just ****ing funny. its because there socail structures arn't there for them that they are prostitutes. if they went to a police station, not one of them would bat a ****ing eyelid. they'd spend a night in a cell and be turfed out the next day. seen it happen well over twenty times. and what about the homeless girls who are forced into it through brutality and intimidation. they're easy, vulnerable prey and an easy way for some wanker and his friends to make some money. how are eastern girls supposed to gain the knowledge that there is help available for them? most likely they have little knowlegde of the city as it is. not having the language or confidence to march down the street into the nearest garda station and explain clearly what happened , and then be believed? not likely. and what the hell was that about taking a clients phone 'when he isnt looking'?? thats just ****ing naiive, gopher. and if she did get the phone, who would she ring?

i wouldnt say porn is prostitution somehow. people dont generally have sex with pictures, their computers, and
their televisions.

street girls are much more likely to be very hard up and have far less options open to them than girls in a company. also girls in a company are checked out for STD's and have the support of the other girls and their managers. its tough to leave if your employer gets nasty and beats you up, but generally you're free to go. and what about all the independant escorts or usualy use the internet to advertise? they're their own boss, dont have to share their earnings and can pick and choose clients as they want.


i dont particularly want to elaborate here gopher, but feel free to pm me.

DapperGent

Originally posted by Silent Grape
Dapper Gent, how do you know that many prostitutes are incapable of making 'the desision'. and what is the descision? to be prostitutes or not???

Yes the decision is whether to be a prostitute or not. I don't know that many prostitutes are incapable of making this decision I just presume they are, because for the most part it looks a poor decision.

From what I can see prostitution looks like a pretty lousy way to make a living; the health risks are considerable, it's dangerous and it's illegal. The fact that it's illegal means it's unregulated so exploitation is easier and it attracts criminals. It also has social stigma attached to it which makes it difficult to share this part of your life with friends and family.

The fact that it is a criminal activity means that in an organised setting it will be controlled by criminals. Organised criminals are dangerous people so you also have to deal with the fact that (however removed) you are in partnership with people who are dangerous. This must bring it's own worries.

Even apart from all these practicalities what is inherant to the job is having sex with people you don't really want to have sex with. Giving up the right to chose my sexual partners is not something I think would be pleasant.

These things seem pertinently obvious to me and I would imagine they would be just as obvious to anyone else with half a braincell. Therefore I would conclude that people who decide to become prostitutes (and have the luxury of the choice) are either emotionally fraught or just ****ing stupid. I would imagine there are exceptions of strong willed intelligent people making a purely business decision, my gut feeling is that they are few and far between.

Clintons Cat

Anyway,as Clintons Cat says about the eastern european girls tricked into doing it,nobody has anwsered my original question.Why do they not run to the nearest police station once they are put out on the streets of the west to work?Even if they are confined to a brothel surely there would be some way to esacpe?Such as using a customers mobile to ring for help when he isnt looking.Sorry but if you ask me the excuse of being trapped into it is most probably some yarn they spin in order to stay in the country.IMHO there is no way that a girl could not escape if she was working on the streets.

Many reasons,Dapper Gent and silent grape have covered most of this already but to paraphrase.
These Girls in many instances will have totally been removed from their traditional support structures,friends and family,they may not even be able to understand the language of the country they have entered,hell some of them will not even know which country they end up in as the travel arrangements are handled by the pimp.
The only people they come into contact with are other working girls,madames and their clients.From the moment they enter into the hands of the criminals they are subjected to a process of brutalisation,physical intimidation and verbal threats against their families back home if they try to escape.The stigma of becoming a prostitute might mean they are reluctant to run home after all as far as their families are aware they have a well paid respectable job in the west.

.IMHO there is no way that a girl could not escape if she was working on the streets

Thats hardly the point is it though? Many of these girls do eventually escape the clutches of the blackmarketeers and enter either other safer areas of the grey ecconomy or return home.
You might as well argue that women who remain in violently abusive relationships enjoy being punched.

Clintons Cat

rape and murder in relation to prostitutes are far more common in daytime american soaps than anywhere else.

Surely some dramatisation?
In an otherwise very intresting and informative post i feel i should draw issue with this statement.
As an occasional watcher of Daytime tv i cant think of a single example of rape and murder of prostitutes featuring as a major storyline.
However i can think of at least a couple of murders of Norwich Prostitutes in the last couple of years.
In one instance the police initially refused to investigate the disappearance of .18 year old prostitute..<insert name here> who disapeared on new years eve <2001> despite her families insistance that it was atypical for her not to contact them.The police even refused to list her as a missing person because of her occupation.
It wasnt till her badly decompossing body was discovered on wastland some eight months later that the police would even begin to investigate the circumstances of her disappearance.
How many other prostitutes disapear in similar circumstances? Sadly no figures will ever be available and unless their bodies are recovered their fates will never be known to their families.

As for rapes well as you well know most prostitutes dont even bother to report them to the police.Mainly for the reasons you outlined.
But just because they go unreported doesnt mean that they dont happen.

...........

Kellie Pratt Disapeared Sunday June 11 2000
Michelle Bettles Body Found Sunday 31st March 2002
Hayley Curtis Body found Jan 2002

Runfree

Ill anwser this later im in a bit of hurry but like Gordon said

Wear a Condom

Silent Grape

i stand corrected on the murder thing. i just meant in Dublin in my experience. : ) yeh, its an extraordinarily dangerous occupation but whoever said that the girls might be emotionally fraught? is that just your opinion or is it based on anything? a LOT of girls i know and have heard of are competent girls who are seriously only in it for the money. they mainly have generous clients and dont always involve sex. it is hard to remain detatched emotionally and regard what you're doing as a job and you do have to adjust your emotional perception of what you're doing. i think the mental strength of some of these girls (and boys) is unbelievable...

x

eth0_

Originally posted by Silent Grape
a LOT of girls i know and have heard of are competent girls who are seriously only in it for the money

yes but the vast majority in this city are just strung out junkie low lifes who are prepared to let a guy do anything to them just to feed their habit.

I presume the girls you know weren't working off the streets?

Silent Grape

yeah im not talking about street girls, just escorts and such. i feel so sorry for those girls on the streets, i just want to take them all to my house and give them a cup of tea... does it make it okay for them to be working girls if they're junkies? oh and thanks for all the advice on my piercing etho, appreciated it : )

x

eth0_

Originally posted by Silent Grape
does it make it okay for them to be working girls if they're junkies? oh and thanks for all the advice on my piercing etho, appreciated it : )

x

Well I know this sounds harsh but I couldn't give a toss about junkies prostituting themselves because they're low life scum, I have no sympathy for people who take something like heroin where you know EXACTLY what you're getting into before you take it the first time. I feel sorry for their clients who are at risk of catching something off them.

NP about the advice Hope you got it in again!