IS the ODTR the proble or the solution

JimHacker

Looking over the Flat-Rate for past few years its clear that the inactivity of the ODTR - the Regulator herself specifically - has really led us to the hopeless position of today.

Anyone familiar with the legislation knows she could have stepped in where negotiations on FRIACO were going nowhere and imposed a solution - she hasnt - why not?

Am I right?

zynaps

I think she expects people to believe she has no powers at all to attempt to encourage the provision of broadband in Ireland.

I don't know... what can she do? Is it her responsilibity or right to sort out those companies who are holding the reins of telecommunications progress and keeping their horse tied up outside a saloon, dustballs and all? (Yeah... weird)

Is the main opposing force to broadband progress our increasingly apparently incompetent incumbent (sorry) eircom? Is it esat? Is it public apathy and ignorance? Is it the government sitting on its arse and not trying to force progress along?

What's happening? The same old promises (à la ntl's "yeah, cable internet should be out in a few months", when asked on numerous occasions over the phone 2 years ago), or is real broadband actually coming?

twiddly dee...

zynaps

De Rebel

This is a difficult question and will some day form the basis for a thesis on “government/regulatory issues”

Etain Doyle entered the job with approval from most interested parties. She had a reputation for efficiency and clear thinking. From what I understand she also had a clear philosophy that her role was to regulate, to ensure that the pitch was as level as possible for new entrants to compete, to ensure that our market complied with Irish and EU legislation. She never saw the introduction of new products and services as her role. I would imagine that she saw that as being a job for the Minister, the telcos and the consumer.

Like anybody who serves a political master, to survive she has to be attuned to the wishes of her “boss”. Mary O’Rourke never made clear policy decisions. She was long on aspirations and devoid of coherent actions. She certainly never took ownership of the issues and directed to ODTR to follow a particular course. It may well be that Doyle wanted to push the boat out, but I’d surmise that she never felt confident about getting the Minister’s backing and this in effect neutralized here office, irrespective of the legalistic possibilities. In other words, had she taken action, her office could have been hit from both sides; Eircom via the Courts and sanction from the Minister’s office for overstepping the mark. As with any “public servant”, the natural response in this situation is to steer a safe passage.

Some of my response is based on fact, and some on conjecture; in reality there is only one person who can answer your question correctly. And if she remains true to form, Etain Doyle certainly will not speak on the matter this side of her retirement.

Like any of us, I’m sure that Doyle has her faults. But she has also been efficient, professional and a lot more open that other similar agencies. Your question is valid, especially given that she has been appointed to the Commission. But a lot of the other personalized commentary we have seen on boards is unfair and probably counterproductive.

It will be interesting to see if she and her fellow commissioners will now adopt a more proactive approach, given that they appear to have the interest (and hopefully the backing) of a clear thinking and apparently committed Minister.

To answer your initial question in two parts:

1. I believe that the root of the problem was one of the most disasterous Ministers this State has ever seen in office.
2. Hopefully the Commission with the support of the new Minister will be a significant part of the solution.

spongebob

During the Orange / Meteor third GSM licence spat the lawyers apparently scared the crap out of Etain who was advised at one point that the ODTR could have been facing an IEP 100 Million pound liability had the courts found for Orange, she was facing a lose lose scenario at one point in time where Orange got the licence and Meteor then sued her at year 2000 telecomunications company valuations.

Allegedly the RAT found out and as her main funder it threatened to pull the plug on her funding if she was found to be 'negligent'

All of this turned Etain into a bit of a legal advice junkie. I hope her fellow comissioners are not as obsessed with the antics of the funny hairdo and black smock brigade. Keep those hands where we can see them lads

M

JimHacker

She's apparantly telling all that she does not have the legislative powers to implement FRIACO despite the fact that the Minister says she does, the industry says she does, that anyone who has ever read the Comms Bill, interconnect legislation et all.

This should have been done yaers ago. She blatantly has the Minister behind her, he's said he believes she has the powers!!!!! Presumably the Attorney General has told him that she has the powers. So why her inaction. She sould REGULATE NOT PREVAROCATE.!!!!!!!!!

Dustaz

What year did Doyle take office? I believe that should answer your question.

Fallschirmjager

well good question

she is the problem, the office is the solution...

Dustaz

The problem existed well before she became the regulator, and while the ODTR have hardly led the charge to FRIACO, they are not the root cause of the problem.

dahamsta

Not the root cause, but definitely a net contributor. I know what I do when I think I'm not going to be able to do a job...

adam

Rags

They are definetly one of problems. I'm sure theres some good peeps working at the odtr if you look hard enough but Doyle isnt one of them. The woman doesnt even know what powers she has! Its her job to know!

sceptre

Originally posted by dahamsta
Not the root cause, but definitely a net contributor.

Certainly true.

This is one of those clear situations where if you're not part of the solution then you're part of the problem. This purely reactive style of regulation that has characterised the Etain Doyle administration hasn't led to finding solutions for any of the problems faced by her office. Eircom and NTL in particular don't give a damn about regulation brought about by Etain Doyle and the ODTR - it's only a mild irritation to the way they like to do business.

The ODTR don't seem to be part of the solution.

Hence, they're part of the problem.

stormkeeper

Hmm... Upon reading this tread, I'm beginning to have doubts about the ODTR, howver I'm still gonna complain to them regardless...

dahamsta

Hmm... Upon reading this tread, I'm beginning to have doubts about the ODTR, howver I'm still gonna complain to them regardless...

Oh Christ you should! (If you have a valid complaint of course!)

I think that most people that are disillusioned with Doyle feel that way because of her long-term strategies and /major/ decisions, like the way she's handled cable, wireless and DSL. That's not the same as saying she's been a complete loss though -- in all honesty, the large majority of her Decision Notices have been well thought-out and in the best interests of everyone involved. My problem is that all the good stuff is low-level, and she let's us down on the long game, which I consider the /whole/ game.

It wouldn't stop me - and shouldn't stop you - complaining to them though, not for a second. That's a huge part of their job, and they're really good at sorting out problems for people; with the possible exception of the cable operators, who I think in all honesty have pulled the wool completely over Doyle's eyes.

Eircom is just too big and too brutish for them to handle, but they seem to chip away regardless. And more power to 'em for trying.

adam

stormkeeper

Oh believe me, I have an extremely valid complaint, and tonight is the night I have reached the end of my tether:

[05:53:33] <Kennett> not nice things are coming into my head atm, like: FFS Eircom , it took me 10 ******* attempts to connect, it takes ******* ages to connect, and the end result is an ******* joke! You guys ****** up big time!

i needed to vent, and i'm still not calmed down...

I reckon i've spent about 3 Euro alone on trying to dial up, only to get an engaged tone...

To make matters worse, my pc is unstable, and can crash at any moment.

this would be another example:

[05:58:46] * Kennett is now known as Kenny-Fuming
[05:59:18] <dreal> Got gas again, kenny?
[05:59:28] <dreal> You gotta stop eating all those beans.
[05:59:46] <Kenny-Fuming> no, i'm extremely ******* ******* off at a ******* stupid excuse for a ******* telephone company
[06:00:05] <Kenny-Fuming> and that's putting it lightly
[06:00:06] <dreal> How'd they screw you over this time?
[06:00:26] <dreal> And the more important question... Did they at least use lube?

As you can see, I'm not happy at the moment. But, I still have a degree of rational thought... Scepter or Dustaz, if this is deemed unsuitable, could you please delete this post? Thanks

And on one final now; I intend to phone the ODTR, and if it is the last thing I do, I will get compensated for the greaif thay have caused me...

zynaps

You don't pay to get an engaged tone.

You're only wasting money like that when you dial up, and it spends a minute trying to connect then times out, or tells you it couldn't establish the connection...

Which happens too, I guess

stormkeeper

Funny thing is, before I got my line split, I dialled in nearly the first time every time. Ever since I got the splitter in, dialup has taken longer, and it mostly takes 3 attempts before I can get online... Fiun, huh?

JimHacker

After reading all the above replies I remain utterly unconvinced as to the desire of the ODTR to advance change and improvements in this ares.

1. According to the newspapers a fortnight ago there are now 120 people in the ODTR - there was about 20 in the Dept of Communications doing the dsame job before the ODTR's establishment. WHY? What are they doing?

2. Why are the ODTR engaged in producing lengthy, boring reasearch papers etc.?

3. Why does the regulator not assert clearly why and how she cannot advance the FRIACO agenda. Is she not ashmed to preside the bost backward telco environment in Europe. And its NOT the legislation thats the prob - Ive read it - she has broadly the same powers as they do int he UK and rest of Europe.

WHy in the name of God fdoes a Minister have to set out a FRIACO Policy Direction? Etain should have done it years ago.

Ireland, like most of Europe made a decision to privatise the telecoms area and establish a regulator to ensure fairness/progress etc. - it has not happened - the regulator is the problem not the solution.

Convince me otherwise PLEASE!!!!!!!

hmmm

Convince me otherwise PLEASE!!!!!!!

What do you need convincing off, a lot of people here agree with you You only have to go back to the beginning of the year when we were screaming for broadband and flat rate, they were producing research papers on how broadband could be delivered in 2010, whilst doing feck all to encourage the deployment of broadband in 2002.

Paddy20

It is called keeping the unemployment figures down. Most Governments do it, that is creating useless departments to produce surveys which have to be read by more people which means creating another Department too implement or consider the ever increasing red tape creating more jobs et al etc etc.

paddy20

Fallschirmjager

documents, more documents, all they ever produce is documents...she is the regualtor for christs sake...REGULATE and stop whining about i may or may not have the laws....if you try you will know, and then the government will change the law...but until you actually do something -- ANYTHING -- anything that is other then writing delaying documents in of all things MSWORD...we wont have any action.


for the love of the lord baby jesus can we please get off yer asses and make a ****ing decision...

it is back to my previous comments WHY OH WHY are we creating discussion documents on DSL..I can find that on the web if i choose to look. WHY -- the question should not be WHY but HOW and WHEN...the latter questions are currently avioded by everyone in government because WHY means documents, consultancy fees, delaying, not paying, no deciosion you can be fired for whereas HOW and WHEN means a plan and responsibility.


message to the ODTR -- BEGIN -- do something and you will shake it up -- and if you loose -- you will have all our support...because we want you to succeed

pork99

the large majority of her Decision Notices have been well thought-out and in the best interests of everyone involved

the problem is that the situation requires someone to do the regulatory equivalent of going psycho on Eircom's ass with a baseball bat/caman/cricket bat/pickaxe handle or equivalent