[Off Topic Split] Broadband in dublin

ando

yeah, leap look like getting full dublin coverage within the next 5 months... hopefully

gurramok

hate to put a spanner in wth works but from Leap's website, they do not have a residential offering....their wireless offers are only geared towards business

Dustaz

Tell that to the residential subscribers on this forum Gurramok

LFCFan

They charge €99 a month so I don't see what's so great about them. They're only €8 cheaper than ADSL with €ircon and you have to have a fecking arial on the roof. Am I missing something?

scojones

and you have to be in fecking dublin. BOO!!

spongebob

Lfcfan

you should say

LEAP ONLY charge €99 a month for an uncapped 512k product compared to the cheapest €ircon 512k offering which costs at least €8 a month more than LEAP and is capped at a fairly low amount oer month.

Then you wouldn't be missing anything IMO

M

LFCFan

€99 uncapped is still a rip off. We should be paying no more that €40 a month for broadband. Is it so bad in this country that when you are 'Only' charged €99 a month we're supposed to be happy with that?

MDR

whosh .. LFCFan misses the point.

spongebob

he missed this One too......remiss that.

M

Hannibal_12

What exactly did he miss? He is saying that €99 a month for broadband capped or uncapped is a joke (much like everything else in Ireland) and quite frankly I agree.
I suppose we are use to arguing over crumbs in the E-Tub so it doesnt surprise me much.
I may actually even consider leap simply by virtue of the fact that it means I will be giving everyones favourite telco nothing since even they cant monopolise the airwaves (although I am sure they will be looking into doing so).

LFCFan

Finally someone else who doesn't agree with getting shafted! And as far as esatsucks.com goes, if there is anyone out there that wants it that can have it for the $15 I paid for it. At least I registered it before Esat thought of it themselves.

seamus

Originally posted by Muck
he missed this One too......remiss that.

M

Muck......you do know that's a name registered by an American band, obviously called 'Leap'..........

LFCFan, the basic point about Leap is that they are *not* the biggest telco in Ireland, they *do not* have a national network already rolled out, and they *do not* have a monopoly in their area of telecommunications, yet they *do* offer a superior product to eirscum.

spongebob

See Here and I commiserated with him for not getting a brace of them such as that one you mentioned and This one in particular.

M

LFCFan

I'm just saying that it's a sad state of affairs when people can get excited about a rip off service, no matter whether it's better than the main telco's product or not. Fair play to Leap for undercutting €ircon and I hope it will stir up some competition if they do go Dublin wide. I will certainly not be taking it up though at €99 a month. €99 Bi- Monthly would be a much better price though if still a little steep.

LFCFan

Originally posted by Muck
See Here and I commiserated with him for not getting a brace of them such as that one you mentioned and This one in particular.

M

Leap don't suck. Not yet anyway. Give them time though and the Oirish bug of crap customer service and incompetent management will soon attack them and we will be looking for leapsucks.com.

spongebob

you haven't given them a chance to 'suck' yet. Wait till they cover DNS

M

Dustaz

Originally posted by LFCFan
I'm just saying that it's a sad state of affairs when people can get excited about a rip off service, no matter whether it's better than the main telco's product or not. Fair play to Leap for undercutting €ircon and I hope it will stir up some competition if they do go Dublin wide. I will certainly not be taking it up though at €99 a month. €99 Bi- Monthly would be a much better price though if still a little steep.

LFCFan, Your new so heres some information.

€99 a month is expensive for broadband sure, but some business need broadband desperatly and are willing to pay much more than that for it.

Some people (including myself) are happy to pay that amount, even if it is daylight robbery, for the luxury of broadband (and, make no mistake, a luxury is what it is). Your assertion on a different thread that 'nerds will sell a kidney' to get it is quite frankly insulting. You also say on another thread that you wont pay for broadband at that price, yet you insult the people who do. It may have escaped your notice but without ppl using the service, the price will never come down and youll never get your broadband.

On the subject of things that have escaped your attention, heres a quick lesson in economics. You say €99 every two months is too expensive? Please be realistic, €99 = £62. The average price of broadband in the UK seems to be around £30 per month. You cannot expect Eircon to roll out adsl for the same price as it is available in England where the market is 15 times bigger. Its just not going to happen any time soon.

People get excited about ANY news on the broadband front because it means competition, and hopefully a more liberalise market.


Also, please stop dragging threads off topic:)

Rags

Many of us are paying over 100euro a month for crappy 56k and Isdn so I definetly think leaps offer is great. Its definetly a start. It can only get better right.

LFCFan

Originally posted by Dustaz
€99 a month is expensive for broadband sure, but some business need broadband desperatly and are willing to pay much more than that for it.

Listen, I understand fully that BUSINESSES are willing to pay €99 plus for ADSL. I am not a business. I am a resident and if €ircon and our fabulous government weren't so useless then someone like myself could be paying €40 a month which I would gladly do.

Your assertion on a different thread that 'nerds will sell a kidney' to get it is quite frankly insulting.

That was in response to someone else talking about paying Kidneys for Broadband(it was meant in jest) and quite frankly anyone who is willing to pay that kind of money so they can play online games is either a nerd or has way too much time on their hands. I want broadband mainly because I am trying to work as a freelance web designer and dialup is no way to be going about that sort of business but as I am only starting out I cannot afford €107 a month. If peoples reasons for broadband are for online gaming then you're not gonna see too much sympathy from the government on the issue.

You also say on another thread that you wont pay for broadband at that price, yet you insult the people who do.

How did I insult people who pay that kind of money? I remember wondering why people pay it, as in, is it for business or for playing games etc and I concurred with people who's internet charges exceeded €107 a month that paying €107 a month was reasonable.

On the subject of things that have escaped your attention, heres a quick lesson in economics. You say €99 every two months is too expensive? Please be realistic, €99 = £62. The average price of broadband in the UK seems to be around £30 per month. You cannot expect Eircon to roll out adsl for the same price as it is available in England where the market is 15 times bigger.

I seem to remember seeing quotes from Ireland Off Line saying they wanted a Broadband internet product priced at between €30 and €40 a month. Here's a little lesson in maths. €40 X 2 = €80 which is €19 less than the Bi-Monthly €99 I thought was a little steep.

I'm not trying to be smart and I appreciate greatly what IOFFL is doing for us but I am entitled to my opinion just like everyone else in here.

Calibos

Dustaz,

You better get on to our friends at eircom tribunal then and tell them they made a mistake about the price of broadband in Denmark which they have as €29/month. Theres obviously no way they could be that cheap compared to the Uk which has a population 15 times larger and to Ireland which has a similar geographical area and population.

Dustaz

Originally posted by LFCFan


That was in response to someone else talking about paying Kidneys for Broadband(it was meant in jest) and quite frankly anyone who is willing to pay that kind of money so they can play online games is either a nerd or has way too much time on their hands. I want broadband mainly because I am trying to work as a freelance web designer and dialup is no way to be going about that sort of business but as I am only starting out I cannot afford €107 a month. If peoples reasons for broadband are for online gaming then you're not gonna see too much sympathy from the government on the issue.

Where did i say residents only wanted it for games? I (and others) want it because its fast, always on and serves multiple purposes (Im not going to bother listing them, maybe you can look them up when your busy life allows). If i wanted a good ping for online games, id get ISDN since it pings lower than DSL here. Calling gamers nerds and no lifers is fine, i should remind you that they make up a large proportion of the membership here. Saying that people have no life simply because they can afford something that you cant is not on.

I seem to remember seeing quotes from Ireland Off Line saying they wanted a Broadband internet product priced at between €30 and €40 a month.
[/B]

I could be wrong here, but i think thats from EircomTribunal's website. I love that site, but those figures are not going to happen overnight. Look at the price dynamic in the UK. It did not start at that price range, it only came down to the prices its at now after a couple of years. I dont have the figures, but im guessing that is the same for every european country.

You better get on to our friends at eircom tribunal then and tell them they made a mistake about the price of broadband in Denmark which they have as €29/month. Theres obviously no way they could be that cheap compared to the Uk which has a population 15 times larger and to Ireland which has a similar geographical area and population.

Did it start at that price? What was the telco/competion situation like when broadband was rolled out.
To be fair, im not sure myself. My point is that we cannot expect prices comparable to anywhere overnight. These prices are driven by a number of factors such as demand, availibility and (as i accept after hours with xian) availibility of FRIACO.

zynaps

Let's not forget also that if Leap manages to become available and cover all of Dublin (no idea about what their actual coverage will be like, this is just an assumption), then though it may be only a bit cheaper than DSL, it will be available...

Eircom's DSL availability seems to be like a lottery from what I've read on some of the threads here.
I mean, if only a handful of exchanges support it, and being handled by one of those exchanges gives you absolutely no guarantee of DSL availability (hello eircom, what are you DOING?) this does not constitute practically available broadband to me.

If leap go ahead and make it a real option for people, they have my blessing, and I hope they scoop up as many of eircom's DSL rejects as would see fit along the way.

Also, if their service has no download cap, that's a plus, as I wouldn't want a capped DSL in the first place, so would end up buying the i-stream "enhanced" or "uncrippled" or whatever if I was so inclined, which I'm not.

20:1 contention ratio isn't great, but there ye go.

well... highlander the series is on.
zynaps

zynaps

Hmm.. apparently residential users don't get an IP address though.

How does that work?
Surely everyone gets an assigned number?

Calibos

I think the highest figure I ever heard mentioned in the UK computer press over the last few years was stg£50-60. Just did the sterling/euro conversion and thats close(dunno why I never did it before), within about €15 of eircons rate. Dustaz is right. They're robbing us but not by as much as I assumed. I'm still moving to UTVi though:D

LFCFan

But at least in the UK there is a choice. Some may be charging £50 - £60 a month but there are other charging £25 - £30 a month.

LoBo

Leap offer a Business-targeted offering for €99. Have a look at Irish Broadband (http://www.irishbroadband.ie) offering wireless broadband at €40 a month with 8:1 contention - targeted at a residential market. Also look at their thread on this forum (http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=65019) where someone from the company was answering questions.

I sincerely hope they expand to cover more locations, as their product and price seem amazing.

Just to point out a residential product, as compared to leap which is obviously targeting businesses (and yet, still undercut our lumbering behemoth's entry level broadband .:rolleyes: )

Colm

LFCFan

Is irishbroadband.ie a one way system though? You would still need your €ircon line to upload data. Ideally, I'd love for NTL to give me Cable access and it would be bye bye €ircon.

Dustaz

The irishbroadband service is 2 way.

Serbian

Anyone know if leap.ie prices include VAT or not?

Also, is there really a significant difference using wireless broadband (ie leap) rather than something like eircoms ADSL fixed line?

Thanks,

Peter

STaN

u have to give it up to leap, they undercut eircom's prices, offer a HIGHER upload speed and a LOWER ping than ADSL. And with no cap! What are you complaining about?

This is ireland, we're a bit slow, can't do anything about it, and moaning wont help either. Personally i dont really like eircom. If any1 can do what their doing at the & cheaper, Eircom would soon have a market share of 0% . I'm going to get leap as soon as its available, cant complain about a connection equivelent or GREATER than most net café's 1024/1024. Personally i think its worth €249 a month for the top package, and if it comes down in price, great. 10 times faster than isdn, cant complain

seamus

Originally posted by zynaps
Hmm.. apparently residential users don't get an IP address though.

How does that work?
Surely everyone gets an assigned number?

DHCP. You get assigned a number when you connect, and then lose it when you disconnect. You essentially 'rent' the IP (here's another opportunity for eircom to sponge, Line Rental + ADSL + IP rental, "hmmm....what other charges can we make up"...sorry OT ).
Assignment is effectively random, but most of the time, your computer will attempt to get the last IP assigned to you.

LFCFan

Originally posted by Dustaz
The irishbroadband service is 2 way.

Cool. Thanks for clarifying that!

MDR

You cannot expect Eircon to roll out adsl for the same price as it is available in England where the market is 15 times bigger.

Must finish off the Ireland Versus Norway document some time soon ... it dispels alot of these miths ...

LoBo

Sorry, IrishBroadband's price was ex-vat: so it would be €48.40 per month for their 512/512 8:1 option.

From what they've been saying in the IOFFL thread about them (see link above) they claim excellent pings. I've yet to hear from someone who's subscribed to them to tell us about the service, but looks good so far. If it were available in my area i'd certainly sign up.

--> My price comparison from that thread

Originally posted by LoBo
Just to compare prices with Eircom's incredible ADSL offer:

IrishBroadband 512k Residential
512/512 down/up
8:1 contention, no cap
€320.65 installation (equipment is rented, included in monthly price)
€48.40 per month thereafter

Eircom I-Stream solo
512/128 down/up
3GB transfer cap, (unsure of contention ratio)
€199.65 installation (+ €175 or €242 for modem)
€107.69 per month thereafter

So, from my POV its €374 + €107/month for Eircom's offer and €320 + €48/month for IrishBroadband's....

(also available from IrishBroadband: 1Mb connection for €84.70/month....)

ando

i cant remember starting this thread .. maybe i was out of my head drunk or something :cool:

gurramok

Originally posted by MDR
Must finish off the Ireland Versus Norway document some time soon ... it dispels alot of these miths ...

Also don't forget all the other small countries like Iceland/Denmark/Finland/Luxembourg where broadband is readily available at reasonable prices !!

p.s. ( i wont mention the third world ones:D !)

Dustaz

You didnt start it ando, yours was just the first off topic post that this thread was split from

Calibos

LFCfan

But at least in the UK there is a choice. Some may be charging £50 - £60 a month but there are other charging £25 - £30 a month.

Your missing both mine and Duztaz point. Everyone in the UK was charging that when DSL was launched. The point is its only 3 years latter that prices have fallen to sane levels in the UK. I'm sure it was the same elsewhere in Europe. Eircom are no different. They should have learned BT lessons that its only when a certain sane pricepoint is reached that there is mass takeup. Unfortunately it seems they haven't.

STaN

what has an IQ of 65?

... the whole of the eircom management

kamobe

I bet they didnt have a ridiculously low cap though....
I'd actually pay Eircom their stupid IR£80(ish) a month if that was removed.

zynaps

Originally posted by seamus


DHCP. You get assigned a number when you connect, and then lose it when you disconnect. You essentially 'rent' the IP (here's another opportunity for eircom to sponge, Line Rental + ADSL + IP rental, "hmmm....what other charges can we make up"...sorry OT ).

Ahh, right, so they mean you just don't get a static ip every time you connect unless you pick the pricier business options.

Doubt anyone coming from expensive dynamic ip dialupland here is going to be much disappointed..

Though I guess it would make it more difficult if you had a domain name trying to point at your machine... *scratches head*

sceptre

Originally posted by zynaps
Though I guess it would make it more difficult if you had a domain name trying to point at your machine... *scratches head*

Should be able to sort something out with a service like DNS2go (now charging but there are free alternatives). There may be a neater way of doing it but offhand I can't think of one.

It's probably part of the reason they do this (mo'money to charge and all that)

Dustaz

Yeh it is. They dont like you hosting public servers as part of the service.
www.mine.nu should see you right tho.