Insurance Robbing us blind

Kazujo

As I'm sure everyone is aware motorcycle insurance just keeps on gettin more expensive. I just found out today that premiums went up ANOTHER 15% this week. I find this completely rediculous.

My girlfriend is 19 living in dublin with a provisonal licence and got a quote of €2400 third party and €3300 on a category 2 bike (eg. Virago 125) this is the lowest insurnce you can get witout goin to a moped.

How are people expected to get goin if tey have to pay that amount of money just to insure the machine.

I dont think the fact that there is only one insurance company supplying insurance to new riders (i know carole nash is there too, but for taht you need to be over 21 and have a couple of years experience) so this causes a bit of a monoply for most people, it's about time that the government copped on and tryed to encourage european insurers to enter the irish market with the size of there companies the premiums should be lower than what we have at the mo.

Anyone else have anything to make bout teh current situation or know of any alternatives

seamus

Originally posted by Kazujo
My girlfriend is 19 living in dublin with a provisonal licence and got a quote of €2400 third party and €3300 on a category 2 bike (eg. Virago 125) this is the lowest insurnce you can get witout goin to a moped.

I'm a 20 year old male, paying €300 more than that on a 125 marauder - possibly the least powerful 125 around. Plus I have 20,000 road miles under my belt, and I don't care what anyone says, they make a huge fu<king difference!!! Yet Hibernian don't have to recognise them.

The only thing I'm worried about now is the penalty points system. Atm, if you get a speeding fine, well, hey that's life, you pay it and move on. But with penalty points, if you get caught speeding, when you come to renew your insurance, "Oh look, I see you've got 3 penalty points. That's an extra 15%* per penalty point, we might as well remove your no claims bonus." Hibernian are the most brazen of all of them. Despite investigations, uncovering of massive pofiteering, they've had the cheek to raise their premiums TWICE in the last 2 months. I want them to go down, and go down hard :mad:

They're fast overtaking eircom as my most hated rapist Irish company.


*This figure purely imaginary for the added comic benefit of this post

bugs

Theres little that can be done, the irish motorcycling scene is tiny by comparison to that of anywhere else. That in itself should mean a low premium all round. BUT!!! the percentage of accidents is huge due to a small ownership, and hibernian use this as an excuse to bump premiums.
The NSR and RS 125's are the most blatant of all insurance hikes. In 2000 they were in group 2. Hibernian claimed that these bikes were being crashed and claimed on far too much and as a result bumped them to group 4. They rose to group 7 as of december of last year, once again hibernian quoted "high claim rates".

Now its is actually impossible to insure them in the dublin area (where almost all motorcycles are bought and riden) if you're aged below 25.
The claims on these i'm told would be tiny for an insurance company as large as hibernian as the ownership is a joke compared to say cg125's or anything else for that matter.

Deregulation of insurance is supposed to have come into effect for a long time now but theres no sign of anything happening.
I really would love to know the situation with outside companies coming in as it makes no sense as to why an english company/s havent tried to break the market.

Either way, i'm thankful that i put off buying a bike till i finished college, so i'm one of the lucky few who can still insure an NSR, but my premium rose from IE890 last year to E1800, for third party, which is a f**king joke..... and theres absolutely nothing i can do.

dogs

Originally posted by Kazujo

My girlfriend is 19 living in dublin with a provisonal licence and got a quote of €2400 third party and €3300 on a category 2 bike (eg. Virago 125) this is the lowest insurnce you can get witout goin to a moped.

For a mere €200 more, I'm insured (20, just got full licence) on a group 10 bike in er *cough* Waterford.

It's restricted, but they don't take that into account. The reason they gave was "sure we know how easy it is for ye to take them off", which makes about as much sense as saying "We'd insure you on that GN125, but we're going to have to charge you the same as an R6 because we know how easy it is to swap the stickers".

Bah.

seamus

Does anyone actually know where they're getting their figures from.

Last years statistics showed that in all car/bike accidents, in 56% of cases, the car driver was found to be at fault. So that's more than half of all claims involving bikes and cars that the insurance company doesn't have to pay up. Also, unless the bike is doing 50/60 mph, he can't do massive amounts of damage to any car, especially when compared to the damage a car can do to him, so the cost of these claims is negligible compared to the cost of car claims. Would I be going out on a limb here if I assumed that the cost of all car/bike crashes could be covered solely (in Hibernians case) by the profit made on car premiums? Probably not. I'm also assuming all other collisions are quite negligible (bike/truck, bike/person, bike/bike, bike/crash barrier) compared to the amount of car/bike crashes, but someone can correct me on that if I'm wrong.

Statistics also showed that in all crashes where the biker was at fault, 64% of them owned up straight away, whereas only 2% of car drivers admitted liability. Surely this lowers the cost of determining who was at falt for the insurance company, and IMHO demonstrates that bikers are far more aware of things going on around them, and show a better understanding of the rules of the road. Funnily enough, 66% of car drivers think that bikers are dangerous, irresponsible and careless. I think all bikers think the same about car drivers . All these figures were in the Herald a week or two back btw.

I have a funny feeling that we're getting lumped in with the cars when it comes to determining our premiums. Again, does anyone know where they get their figures from? And is the MIAB investigating bike insurance too?

bugs

I'll admit that there are a few kickers as far as bikes are concerned. Payouts "should" be quite small in most instances but bikes die alot more than ppl in cars. I remember sometime last year a guy died along with his girlfriend when they ran up the back end of a car on an NSR doing 90+

I imagine the payout for something like this if payment has to be made somewhere could be astronomical.

But really, we are being giantly fupped over the prices, its that simple. Theres simply no reason as to why we should have to pay premiums that high... surely when someone pays a premium that exceeds the cost of the bike, its no longer insurance, more robbery.

Kazujo

Bikes are nearly as bad to insure as cras now. I know this might sound a bit morbid but on the payout side of things.

Most fatalities on bikes are just the riders wheither it involves another veichle or not, the payout for the rider and pillion could be alot of money.

Now look on the flip side the same situation witha car and passangers. in a high speed collision the occupants are killed or badly injured there could be FIVE people in the car rather than TWO on the bike. If another vehicle is involved ( except trucks and other big vehicles ) are involved the same again that means one accident could kil of injure upto 10 people. compare teh compensation involved.

Bikes cause less damge to other vehicles when involved in an accident and can be cheaper in alot of cases to repair than a car.

The most likely people to be involved in accidents in most cases are mopeds, simply because most are new drivers and have no respect for other road users their machines or themselves. Of course there are exceptions and I know everyone has to start somewhere. The amount of insurance claims by people driving bigger bikes is much less as they have experience and know thw limits of themselves and their bikes.

---

Sorry but this is my thread I'll rant all I like

garthv

What really sucks is if you try and get a bike at a young age,
Im 18 and i wouldn't be caught dead on one of them ****ty little moped thingys(unless u stuck an mv f5 engine in it) so through the process of elimination the next decent bike is a 125cc.

Now ive rang all the insurance comanies possible,which is a big total of one and i got a lovely quote for e4,500 for a suzuki dr125 and 3rd party,now for me to come up with that kinda dosh would mean daylight robbery or something close.

Why can't one of the foreign insurance companies come over and charge e1000 for everyone and anyone,it means that they would rake in everywhere and the profit they made would still apy for every and any claim possible

But nooooo this is not the case as all the f*ckin insurance companies are in cahoots which means we get the end os the stick with all the dog **** on it,yay.

Is there any news on anything happening with these gimpo insurance companies coz if there is i would surely love to find out

Kazujo

What category is the dr (that's an offroad style 2 stroke if I remember ??) ? The cheapest place for insuring a new bike is AON simply because they handle the paperwork so norich union charge them less.

It's not a case of all the companies bein in cahoots it's simply that there is really only one company bar carole nash as I said before but they have restrictinos on age and stuff.

I dont understand why foreign insurers dont come in the relative business might be small but the currency is the same so no hassle there and most things are handled over the net or phone these days so they dont really need a major office in this country.

The Irish government have a strangely skillful way of twisted Eu regulations to screw the public and make money (as I'm sure the insurance companies have to pay something to them !!) Liek teh whole VRT thing when they were told that they cant charge import duty anymore, even though we pay over the odds for the vehicles in this country anyway.

Spunog UIE

i'm really begin to **** myself,

i'm waitin to do my theory test nxt week for my bike (NSR125) and then get my provisional, and then insure it, i don't wanna find out how much the insurance is after finding this out, i've got 2500 tucked away for it and thought i'd only have to spend like 2000max.

I'm twenty and in Kildare, quiet town area, just hopin/prayin that i won't be as bad off as you guys in the city are.

i'm just gonna wait and hope, PLEASEEEEEEEEE.

I checked last year and it was 1800irish third party but i didn't have enough then. SO i've been waiting agesssssssssssss!

seamus

Originally posted by Gideon
i'm just gonna wait and hope, PLEASEEEEEEEEE.

I checked last year and it was 1800irish third party but i didn't have enough then. SO i've been waiting agesssssssssssss!

Ummm....emmm....*ahem*

I really really do not want to say this, but an NSR125 is insurance group 7 (both the low and full power versions). An online quote 'could not be processed' from Hibernian.

Judging by some old insurance tables, you'll be paying *at least* €3200 TPO, and that is probably a very conservative figure. My advice is to not get an NSR, wait until you're old enough to afford the insurance. Plus a 125 with a top speed of 135mph? fs.....you'll kill or badly maim yourself, if this is your first bike. Get a bike that looks just as cool, but with a smaller output (< 15kWh), and with a lower insurance rating. Wait 3 or 4 years and then get a more powerful bike. I mean ffs....some of the professionals on 125s race NSR's that are only slightly tweaked. You're going for a bike way out of your league IMHO. If you already have bought it, sell it, and cut your losses.

Just my advice

Spunog UIE

i have it over a year and i'm well able to ride it, i've had a provisional before too but just wanna get this theory test done so i can take the full lience test soon and limit the amount these bastids are tryin to screw me.

It barely goes over 100miles an hour, tis an '87. I got it really cheap and it ain't worth sellin besides i like it, its not like ur norma/newl nsr's tis a bit bulkier. Tis sickening to think that your insurance is probally worth 3times the amount ya paid for the bike tis just wrong! lemme alone in my denial, i'll hoddel my little corner till nxt week and hope *SNIFFLES*:(

and as for that hiberian site, it never gives you a quote for anything, tis rightly gey unless your really old. But i get what your sayin, just hopin.

DeeJ

i had saved up £2000 for a bike last year when i was 19, and had my heart set on getting an RS125 or maybe a TZR125 - i was qouted £3,100 (pounds not euros).



Bang went my bike dreams. its full of **** i reckon young people especially are being robbed.


not only that, but the premiums for young people's car/bike insurance does not accurately reflect the statistics of crashes - its just that when "boy racers" get in crashes it is publicised more - but the fact is that technically the difference between insurance for young and insurance for older people is not correct if you look at the claim stats.

we are being exploited and taken advantage of because there not much sympathy for a young person in a modified car/fast bike that crashes - Oh they must have been speeding, theyre young"


full of sh1t if you ask me.

which you dont

but im tellin ya anyway

tHE vAGGABOND

jasus Seamus, you sound like Ciaran

(thats the most offensive thing I could think of!!!)

Derek_S

it's crap my mates been driving 3 years with a provisional drives a punto asked how much it would be for him to go on his own coz he's on his da's insurance and got quoted 6000,pants i say most people can afford bikes and cars now,just not the insurance

eth0_

Are most of you guys on 3rd part insurance? I am considering getting a 125cc scooter and was quoted around €800 for 3rd party for that kind of bike. That's for Louth, i'm going to insure it there at my parents' address but I actually live in Dublin.

seamus

Originally posted by eth0_
Are most of you guys on 3rd part insurance? I am considering getting a 125cc scooter and was quoted around €800 for 3rd party for that kind of bike. That's for Louth, i'm going to insure it there at my parents' address but I actually live in Dublin.

Yeah, well I'm TPO anyway @ €2800. It's the problem with being male and young. I dunno about registering it at your parents' address, it could be dodgy if you need to make a claim. The insurance co. will also ask you where you work, so it might be a bit much to say 'Oh I live in louth, but will use my 125cc scooter to commute to Dublin every day'. You could tell them you work in Louth, but if you have an accident in Dublin, there would be questions........

TheDon2010

Back in October my car had an attempted theft on it, the scumbags that tried to break in ended up destroying the whole handle and effectively broke it off. I rang the insurance company and told them what had happened, they informed me that as it was an attempted theft it would not affect my no claims or my premium and sure enough i decided to go ahead with the claim. Today i received a letter saying that my no claims has being reduced and my premium has gone from 64 euro's a month to 190 euro's a month... Thats a triple increase for a 300 euro cheque???? what is that about???

Alanstrainor

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