Filling out a ballot

Yoda

I got my Irish citizenship three years ago and this is my first general election. Let's say there are six candidates from six different parties on my ballot. I put my favourites first through fourth, but the other two I loathe and despise. Am I correct in assuming that if I leave them off entirely I am not spoiling my vote, but am in fact just preventing the two I loathe and despise from getting any points at all?

It's not obvious if you were raised in a different system of ballotting.

Victor

No you would not be spoiling your vote. Many people only fill in their first few preferences. However, leaving off your first preference and only filling in (some) lower preferences would create problems.

However, if it comes to later counts, you may wish to ensure the more 'popular' (based on likely first preferences and transfers) of the 'loathsome' two gets your *last* preference, this would give your preferred candidates a very marginal advantage (but often marginal advantage makes all the difference).

Mathematically, I'm not sure if final preference makes any difference (if you are down to last preferences, isn't everyone eliminated at that stage?).

Our man in Havana

thats excatly right Yoda.

Your under no obligation to go beyond your first choice if you like anyone else on the ballot.

dahamsta

I found this explanation of PR-STV on the RTE website the other day, and it's not too bad. It was handy for search terms for Google too.

adam

Victor

Additional link (may not directly apply to Ireland). http://www.electireland.com/all/howpr.html

yellum

I wish every citizen had the same attitude as you Yoda and were actually going to vote.

dahamsta

I wish every citizen had the same attitude as you Yoda and were actually going to vote.

Well, I've told all my TD's that they won't be appearing on my ballot card, so I don't know who to vote for now. I was thinking of writing to them again and extending the Special Offer.

adam

Yoda

I can't imagine why any intelligent person lucky enough to live in a representative democracy would shun the vote. I mean do people not watch television? Have they not seen what life can be like in other countries where the ballot is not available?

I've seen some pretty foolish statements on another thread, like Terminator's "Well, Bertie's a Dub so I gotta go with FF". (Victor quite correctly pointed out that Mary Harney (PD), Ruairí Quinn (Labour), John Gormley (Green) and Joe Higgins (Socialist) are all Dubs. I wonder if that will make Terminator think again. Or was he just taking the piss?)

It's not so difficult to find out what the issues are and to think about an intelligent choice. Are things OK right now? If not, vote for change.

I don't understand not voting at all. In Ireland, you can even spoil your vote, which is a pretty neat way of saying None Of The Above. But not turning out to vote? Scandalous.

(Dahamsta, if any of your TDs were Fine Gael or Labour, I don't see how you could blame them. They were there trying to get the telecoms bill amended. In my view, IOFFL should reward those parties and hope (reasonably I think) that if in government a better job will be done than has been done to date.)

yellum

I think we saw a great protest vote in France recently with le Pen doing so well. I expect the politicians to respect their voters more now and its a good lesson to be learned. I wish the Irish people would do the same.

I really can't stand people moaning about the government here and then they don't go out and vote.

I'll probably vote Kathy Sinnot. If she gets in shes sure to make Fianna Fail squirm if they need her support.

Stephen

I hope the new government won't be requiring jackie healy-rae's support this time round. The man's an embarrassment to Irish people in my opinion.

yellum

He's pretty popular with those in his region that he looked after so well.

DadaKopf

What that RTE thing doesnt say is that PR-STV favours bigger parties and diminishes smaller parties' shares. That's fine for FF and FG but not if anyone wants party-system change and real proportionality.

We should adopt PR-List - we're the only country in Europe using PR-STV, the rest use PR-List except for France and Britain. PR-List is also used for MEP elections.

Yoda

I remember a story by Arthur C. Clarke (I think; or it might have been Kim Stanley Robinson) in which he praised PR, and referred to Australia and New Zealand. I wonder what flavour of PR they use...

Victor

Originally posted by DadaKopf
What that RTE thing doesnt say is that PR-STV favours bigger parties and diminishes smaller parties' shares.

But not as mush as 'first past the post'. Of course PR list also favours extremists and accentuates a proliferation of small parties.

sceptre

Originally posted by yellum
He's pretty popular with those in his region that he looked after so well.

Taking credit for every small improvement in south Kerry - every job created, every pothole filled...

Originally posted by dahamsta
Well, I've told all my TD's that they won't be appearing on my ballot card, so I don't know who to vote for now. I was thinking of writing to them again and extending the Special Offer.
adam

Agree with Yoda on the effort made by both Labout and Fine Gael on the comms bill. Plus the fact that the only replies I got either before or after that Thursday were from Fine Gael.

As a student I have my choice of two constituencies to vote in. Michael Noonan got a reply back to my email in under three hours, which I found fairly impressive. Also it wasn't just a "read your comments" reply - though it was short, it did tell me what Fine Gael were going to do the next day.

I got a letter from Paul Bradford (Cork East) during the week, explaining that he only got my email after the event as he was in Dublin (reasonable - unlike MNoonan, not all TDs have a flat in Dublin with access to their email). The letter was fairly firm that he was interested in receiving further information on the problem (and I'll certainly take that offer up after the election)

So bottom line, like Adam, my promise was that a party tackling the issue would get my vote.

On those grounds, it's going to be Fine Gael. I don't see the point of voting for a party which won't deal with issues raised in a communication, let alone even acknowledge a communication.

Exams will dictate that I'll be in Limerick on May 17. Baldy Noonan is is then (politicians may be slow to keep promises, but a promise from me saying "I will vote for you only if..." is a cast-iron promise from me)

There are other issues that lead me to vote for a party oter than Fianna Fail, but I'll list those for discussion some other time.