Should the need for Irish be done away with as a subject for Joining the Garda?

Hellrazer

With all the talk of Dublin becoming a violent,crime troubled city and people screaming out for extra police on our streets I was wondering what people think of the situation regarding the need for Irish and becoming a Garda.
IMO I would probably have joined the Garda if not for the total lack of my fluency in Irish.And I do believe that the intake would be faster/greater if Irish was no longer required.
Anyone?

SheroN

what exactly is the irish requirement?....a C in higher level?...a B in lower? or some such?

tHE vAGGABOND

well, Irish should be done away with period..

but for getting into gardas/college and that kind of thing totally

Saruman

Certainly should be,, all official forms are in English as well as Irish! and besides. how many Garda actually understand a word of Irish.. just coz they passed the exam does not mean they know the language!! stupidity... or in boards fasion complete muppetry if you ask me!

logic1

The main reason for Irish as a requirement besides the whole national pride thing is that if you arrest someone and they only speak Irish you *have to* be able to carry out the arrest in Irish.

If you can't then you can't arrest that person.

.logic.

tHE vAGGABOND

what about the africans then? or european holiday makers?

If they have to arest them do they all have to be able to speak africans and nigerian and french and german now too then?

what a stupid reason

Hellrazer

Maybe if we got rid of Irish we could get a few african guards then they could arrest each other in their native language:)

bonkey

Originally posted by tHE vAGGABOND
what about the africans then? or european holiday makers?

If they have to arest them do they all have to be able to speak africans and nigerian and french and german now too then?

what a stupid reason

Actually - its a very simple reason. Our constitution recognises two official languages in this country. English and Irish.

As a result, all official documentation must be available in both languages - hence the bi-lingual forms.

Also - technically - you must be able to carry out an arrest as Gaeilge as well as in English as a garda, because they are the two national languages.

I disagree with Irish being a requirement in certain cases, but this is one where there is a valid (if ineffective) reason.

The alternative would be to have a referendum to reduce the status of Irish - in effect abandoning it as our national language. You may think this a good idea, but I would imagine the majority of the country would disagree.

jc

Hobbes

Originally posted by logic1
If you can't then you can't arrest that person.

Not sure about that, but I do know you can ask for your court case to be in Irish in which case the gardai would need a translator if they didn't have the language.

I think Gardai should be required to know Irish. Also they should do promotions similar to the Civil service acceptance exams, in that if you do your whole test/interview in Irish you are given +10% marks of your total exam results.

Saruman

I think we have hit on a possilble legal loophole!! If someone is stopped and they will only reply to the garda in Irish the Garda would have to reply in Irish.. if he cant then he cant arrest him.. probably even cat give him a ticket as he cant explain why he is being given a ticket... hmmm

bonkey

Originally posted by Saruman
I think we have hit on a possilble legal loophole!! If someone is stopped and they will only reply to the garda in Irish the Garda would have to reply in Irish.. if he cant then he cant arrest him.. probably even cat give him a ticket as he cant explain why he is being given a ticket... hmmm

More likely he'd arrest or ticket you anyway, and it would be up to you to appeal on grounds of language discrimination. Of course - you'd probably have to prove that Irish really was your main tongue, and possibly that your grasp of english really was poor.

jc

Saruman

wud nor be toooo ard ta pruv me engisch be bawd..

logic1

Originally posted by Hobbes


Not sure about that, but I do know you can ask for your court case to be in Irish in which case the gardai would need a translator if they didn't have the language.

I think Gardai should be required to know Irish. Also they should do promotions similar to the Civil service acceptance exams, in that if you do your whole test/interview in Irish you are given +10% marks of your total exam results.

It's very true. One of my mates is a Guard. But as Bonkey said they'll arrest you or ticket you anyway and it's up to you to prove Irish is your daily language.

.logic.

seamus

Originally posted by logic1


It's very true. One of my mates is a Guard. But as Bonkey said they'll arrest you or ticket you anyway and it's up to you to prove Irish is your daily language.

.logic.

Well then, definitely it should be abandoned. The Gardai are complaining that they haven't enough to keep the streets safe enough. The do say there are more Gardai than ever before, but still not enough. I'm sure there are literally thousands of people willing to become guards, but haven't got the Irish (in fact, I'd be one if/when I fail college )

SheroN

I'd be a guard cept i don't have the trotters for it....oh teh funneh!

lynchie

I believe that Gaeilge should be kept as a requirement for An Garda Síochána. Technically all state bodies should be able to do day to day business as Gaeilge. If I were to ring any government department I can carry out my business over the phone in Irish and they must provide me with somebody to converse with in Irish. Most departments probably dont have many people who could speak fluently but it is my right to do so.

A friend of mine was arrested a while back for Drunk and Disordly. He refused to speak English to them and they had to get a garda to come from Store street station to Pearse St. to read him his rights. Also, he asked for his arrest form as gaeilge which they had to get from a station in Ringsend as they had no Irish forms available. They knew he could speak English but there was nothing they could do.

You are under no obligation to prove that Irish is your daily language. If you want to speak to a Garda as gaeilge you may do so and he is required to speak back to you. It doesnt matter if you are not fluent.

Victor

Originally posted by lynchie
You are under no obligation to prove that Irish is your daily language. If you want to speak to a Garda as gaeilge you may do so and he is required to speak back to you. It doesnt matter if you are not fluent.

All well and good, however if they have read you your rights in English (and you are bilingual) you can't then claim you couldn't understand those rights.

Kappar

Originally posted by bonkey


The alternative would be to have a referendum to reduce the status of Irish - in effect abandoning it as our national language. You may think this a good idea, but I would imagine the majority of the country would disagree.

Article 8

3. Provision may, however, be made by law for the exclusive use of either of the said languages for any one or more official purposes, either throughout the State or in any part thereof.

Would you need a referendum?

The Gopher

Originally posted by logic1
The main reason for Irish as a requirement besides the whole national pride thing is that if you arrest someone and they only speak Irish you *have to* be able to carry out the arrest in Irish.

Considering that our non English speaking Irish population probably consists of 3 octogenarians in the westernmost corners of the Aran Islands this is a load of ****e.Your more likely to arrest somebody who speaks Navajho Indian only than Irish only.F-uckin muppet laws.
And by the way i think you need something like a B at foundation level Irish,and something like a C in foundation Maths and English.Which basically means most kids in 5th class have the intelligence presently to become a guard:rolleyes:

Sand

Irish should be done away with imo - its dead anyway just time it was taken off life support. At this stage now its reduced to a block preventing people who are able to police perfectly well in any other country (English speaking anyway if you want to split hairs) from policing in Ireland despite the outcry for Gardai. Also been reduced to a means by which drunks get smarmy and waste the Gardais time. Since secondary school Ive *never* spoken to anyone in Irish, and I cant even remember the last time I heard someone speaking Irish -Guards dont need it.

logic1

Originally posted by The Gopher


Considering that our non English speaking Irish population probably consists of 3 octogenarians in the westernmost corners of the Aran Islands this is a load of ****e.Your more likely to arrest somebody who speaks Navajho Indian only than Irish only.F-uckin muppet laws.

That's not true at all. I come from a Gaelteacht where day to day business is done in Irish. Alot of the old people living there have far better Irish than English.

Just because you're not exposed to Irish speaking areas of Ireland it doesn't mean they don't exist.

.logic.