Fine Gael - A Spent Force?

Raskolnikov

With the election pending and many opinion polls bringing nothing but bad news for FG is it too late for them to turn things around and form a government? The signs for electoral doom seem to be everywhere at the moment. In my poll Fine Gael notched up 5 votes whereas all the other major parties (FF, Labour and even the Greens, PD's and Sinn Fein ) got twice that. Obvious my poll isn't representitive of a wide spectrum of people but it could be said to be representitive 18-30 bracket of voters who predominate this board.

On the street and amoungst people i know (18-25 bracket) support for FG is almost non-existant except for those who have fallen under parental influence :P I was recently drinking with a young FG Councillor who was complaining about the fact that he couldn't find any young people who would go out canvassing for the party or put up posters etc. He seemed to think that this was down to disinterest.

He was right in one respect, younger voters were disinterested but not in politics but in Fine Gael as a party. I believe that there slump and there coming defeat in the election will be down to a failure in the party leadership. In there period as Opposition Fine Gael have shown themselves to almost totally ineffective proposing half-baked, vote grabbing schemes instead of attacking the government on issues that it has failed to address (ie the crappy state of health for one) The only real effective opposition has come from Ruari Quinn and Fianna Fail themselves by shooting themselves up the foot with all the recent scandals.

A solution for FG? A new party leader is needed who will actually go out and attack FF where it is vunerable etc sleeze, health. Although i doubt we won't have to wait beyond the next election for this.

Aspro

I don't think Fine Gael are in terminal decline (much as I would like to see it happen) but are rather just victims of complacency and of the period we have been through. They found themselves in opposition at the worst possible time - the height of an economic boom and failed to capitalise on Fianna Fail's corruption and lack of will to tackle society's major problems - health, housing etc.
Fine Gael are seen as no different to Fianna Fail by ordinary people so why would you support Tweedle Dum when Tweedle Dee have been in power and claim to have given you so much from the Celtic Tiger. "It's the economy, stupid".
And then there's the Bertie factor. How could Yawn Bruton or Baldy Noonan cut across the public image of "the most cunning and devious of them all". The Teflon Taoiseach as they call him has managed to ride through scandal after scandal after abuse and none of the shít has stuck to him. Then again, he learnt it from the master, didn't he?
Fine Gael won't lose their core support in this election but they will lose out from those floating middle class voters who want to vote against the government - they will maintain FF in power due to the extra cash in their pockets.
As the boom dissipates FG will most likely take a turn to the left and try to appear "social democratic" making various empty promises from the opposition benches and depending on how deep this current phase of the slowdown gets, who knows how long the next government will last?

Chaos-Engine

FG are in dire straits heading into this election. I'm for some polarisation of Irish politics. It has to be FF or FG. But it looks to be FG that will vanish in the long-run... Hopfully PDs will vanish first ...

As for the short-term. Following defeat(it will happen unless Labour score big time - I can hope) FG will probably elect a new leader. I have seen various pradictions but my hopes lie on one man...

ALAN SHATTER (South Dublin). This man has done much for my mother in helping her get a divorce. Unknown to her that he is the guy that brough all the individual and civil rights bills in.
As a TD, Alan Shatter is a great man but in the wrong party.
I swore to myself that I would never vote FG or FF. But I am afraid Alan Shatter will be getting a vote from me just because he is a TD that has energy and can get things done....

P.S. this isn't because of family issues(my mother votes FF). I was going to vote him before I knoew he assisted my mother any how.... Fingers crossed Liz O'Donnell won't push him out...

Victor

Originally posted by RASKOLNIKOV
In my poll Fine Gael notched up 5 votes whereas all the other major parties (FF, Labour and even the Greens, PD's and Sinn Fein ) got twice that.

FG are always unrepresented in polls for various reaons, including better vote management (FF once ran 4 official candidates in a 3-seater constituecy). I think FG will lose some seats this time around, but FF are unlikely to make real gains (if any).

swiss

It is true that FG have failed to capitalise on many of the terminal problems endemic in the current administration. This could be due to several reasons, chief amongst them being (IMO) the complacency of the electorate in relation to issues like honesty and decency in politics when a government can give them more money in their pockets.

Originally posted by RASKOLNIKOV:

A solution for FG? A new party leader is needed who will actually go out and attack FF where it is vunerable etc sleeze, health.

Fine Gael have actually been denouncing Fianna Fáil from the rafters for each and every scandal that they have been through. It is just that, as the public are weary to the endemic corruption of Fianna Fáil, so too are they weary of the outraged cries by members of the opposition.

It is generally acknowledged that there is (in general) little difference in policy between FG and FF. The main differences are in the manifeso by which they base their election platform. For FG, the main issue is health. FF continually espouse "their" contribution to the burgeoning economy and base this as a reason for re-election.

However, I believe that the difference also lies between the image projected by the parties. Neither party are seen as being dynamic, or youthful. FG in particular are seen as the conservative party of yore. Allegations of corporate donations to FG have also damaged the party, although cries of fowl play by FF are extremely disingenuous and hypocritical in relation to this issue.

I don't think that it is fair to cultivate an 'image' in politics to cater for election. I think a party should stand on it's own ideals and deliver those rather than maintain a pretence based on an image. The electorate won't be coaxed out of their apathy by a projected image, but by an affirmative course of action that isn't undermined by sleaze and inefficiency. From my point of view, I see FG as being the most capable party to carry that out.

pugwall

Past experience shows us that Fine Gael always performs better in the elections as they do in the polls. (Particularly the National Polls)
This election will be fought on a constituency level rather on a national level.

I see Fine Gael, with support from Labor & the Greens, as a viable alternative to the present government. The Fianna Fail led Government of the last 5 years do deserve credit due to the decrease in PAYE. This was a good thing. It must be said though that they failed in alo of areas. The lenght of the hospital waiting lists is disgraceful. Crime has shot up. There is a severe shortage of places of detention for the many young thugs roaming the streets. Social inequality is growing. Homelessness is rising.Our infrastructure is appaling. Dont even get me started on public transport.
The fact of the matter is that this government has had 5 years of unprecedented economic growth and have failed to tackle any of these issues effectively. They have also managed to squander the public 'coffers'. The incoming government faces a HUGE defecit. The present government hjave had their chance and have failed misserably.
The Irish people now have a chance to vote for an alternative. Thats why I'll be voting for Fine Gael, Greens and Labor in the forthcoming election.

Elmo

Will the Greens vote FG into Power? Will They vote at all?

The present situation with the road, crime, health etc. have been building up since the start of the 90's, I think its the fault of not only the government but also the opposition for putting up with the situation.

FG are a weak party, some one this thread has already suggested an new leader. How many leaders in that in how many years?

Alan Dukes was put to pasture when they didn't get into government in 1992 (FG havent been in many governments, how does that work, and then you lose one of FG's best politicans???), to be replaced by John Bruton (His plan to give land to RTE in meath for decentralisation and to use the money to build a better service of RTE, if FG are willing to give this land to RTE why dont they just give to an new state of the art Hospital out side of dublin, yet one thing is that Meath isn't far enough away.) and that bring us to Hep. C scandal himself, he shot himself in the foot with that one (I wouldnt have guess i was only 12 at the time, people forget you brought more to that then anyone else, their were a couple of TV reveiws saying that it was you, but that was it, then you boycotted QA?????)

I dont like the holier then art thou message FG puts across. Will Micheal Lowery Be going up for election this time around again?

Aspro

I dont like the holier then art thou message FG puts across. Will Micheal Lowery Be going up for election this time around again?

Unfortunately Lowry will probably romp home in the polls again, true to form. Until people see an alternative they'll keep voting for these corrupt gombeens. Although at least Liam Lawlor got the shaft from the electorate in pre-election polls before he embarrassed himself any more.

Tipperary North

GreenHell

FG - a spent force, atm it would appear so, they lack an imagine, I don't like FG but as the second largest party in Ireland I suppose they provide some stability. They need fresh younger faces and back that would with the talent needed to run a country. I mean if you look at FG now they look disorganised, appear to have only one means of political debate, that being mud slinging, and they look old and out of touch.

On another note, I can't see any party taking their place, labour don't look that impressive and most of the other parties are going to have put serious grass roots work in over the next five years.