RTE on Sky Digital

irishgeo

i reading an article on RTE in the Star business page. The last line of it said that RTE to launch on Sky had fallen foul of the BCI. i checked out the BCI website and there is no mention of RTE and SKY.

Has anybody heard anything.

icdg

I believe they are considering their options and taking legal advice. But the deal with Sky still stands, for now anyway.

My own feeling is that, in better times, RTE would go to court over this. Have you seen BCI contract applications? They are usually the size of a large book, the Commission requires in-depth financial information, shareholder information, programme schedules etc. (Take a look at some of them at bci.ie ) In fact, RTE would not meet the BCI's own rules regarding ownership, they would need an exemption (to which the other contractors would cry foul. The BCI would also want to issue a general "Call for Expressions of Interest", which it doesn't plan on doing at the moment. The BCI has just began re-allocating the contracts for Independent Local Radio, which is an enormous task which will take up to two years (and needs to be done within that timeframe, as existing contracts begin to expire in 2003). Dealing with RTE would be a distraction.

But with advertising revenue taking a dip, only a small licence fee increase granted, and cutbacks everywhere, RTE may decide that simply negotiating with the BCI is possibly the easier way . And perhaps the BCI would take the view that given the urgency of the situation, the RTE contract application should be dealt with. Then again, the contract negotiations for TV3 took nine years...

It looks like a bit of a wait beyond april, for RTE on Sky regardless of any agreement with Murdock.
If it's the law of the land,it's the law of the land and the licence is at the BCI's discretion.

Perhaps this bit in the legislation wasn't meant for RTE at all??
and was really meant for to prevent any independent company starting up a tv service,transmitted from and to Ireland via Sky digital without being regulated by the BCI?
Perhaps our legislators forgot that their wording would have the perverse effect of putting RTE's attempts to broadcast via Sky digital under the control of the BCI.
mm

Tony

Originally posted by madman
It looks like a bit of a wait beyond april, for RTE on Sky regardless of any agreement with Murdock.
If it's the law of the land,it's the law of the land and the licence is at the BCI's discretion.

Perhaps this bit in the legislation wasn't meant for RTE at all??
and was really meant for to prevent any independent company starting up a tv service,transmitted from and to Ireland via Sky digital without being regulated by the BCI?
Perhaps our legislators forgot that their wording would have the perverse effect of putting RTE's attempts to broadcast via Sky digital under the control of the BCI.
mm

This depends on your interpretaion of the law, I think RTE would have a strong case against the BCI but had probably decided that to negotiate would be quicker than going to court One wonders why Tara did not fall foul of the BCI or why they did not object when Ireland soccer games are broadcast on Sky after all these are RTE uplinks. Perhaps it is not beyond the realms of possibility that some political interference is afoot, the same kind of political interference that prevented bbc becoming available at launch. What the BCI are saying in effect is that outside companies can broadcast what they like but indigenous companies may not partake in an open market, what a farce.



Regards Tony

HighburyHigh

It seems very much as Sky still believe that RTE will be added to the EPG in April. The following is an extract from a mail I received recently from a Penny Harris (colleague of Tony Ball) in response to a mail I sent re. this issue.


"I am happy to advise that RTE has announced that it's three channels will be joining Sky in April and that talks with others are continuing."


Opinions anyone??

Charles Slane

According to an article in today's Irish Times, RTE have now applied to the BCI for a licence.

The article seems to imply that it may be decided within a few days .

I'll try to find the link to the online version.

cableskeptic

Originally posted by Charles Slane
According to an article in today's Irish Times, RTE have now applied to the BCI for a licence.

The article seems to imply that it may be decided within a few days .

I'll try to find the link to the online version.

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/finance/2002/0220/3629473380BZRTE.html

Charles Slane

Thanks Cableskeptic. I don't seem to be able to access the Irish Times online for some reason.

I also received this reply from RTE

"Dear Charles

It is hoped that RTE will be available to Sky Digital subscribers in April, as planned.

Regards

Tom McCarthy"

So it seems that RTE are fairly confident of an early and favourable outcome to their licence application.

Fingers crossed.

Mr Burns

Where do I object to RTE getting a licence? THis needs to be trashed out in public over a long time period.

Excellent

DMC

Progress.

The worst that could happen is that the BCI say no, just for pure spite.

I hope, when RTÉ applied, that they mentioned patchy coverage and that they are transmitting into NI.

Damien.

Clinical Waste

Should we start a tote on whether RTE will be on Sky by April?

dmeehan

i cant believe that the licence application will be decided upon in "a couple of days".

seems to me they have already decided

Is this the first time RTE have ever had to Go to the BCI or it's predecessor?
Does it have any other authority over RTE?
mm

icdg

Yes, its' the first time. The Radio and Television Act 1988 specifically excluded RTE from the IRTC's remit.

Other things the BCI might have juristiction with regard to RTE is over advertising time (previously the Minister's perrogative), codes of practice regarding advertising, programme content etc. (Certainly if it is to get a contract off the BCI it will have to play by the Commissions rules).

If this matter is decided within a couple of days I will be extremly surprised - it would probably rank as the fastest IRTC/BCI application ever in the twelve years its been in existence (Newstalk FM has been in the pipeline for about three years now and still has not signed a contract). As I said before, the BCI may recognise the gravity of the situation and allow RTE its contract. They might not want to destract themselves from the ILR relicencing. Then again, they may say "come back to us in two years when we're not busy".

Tony

Originally posted by icdg
Yes, its' the first time. The Radio and Television Act 1988 specifically excluded RTE from the IRTC's remit.

Other things the BCI might have juristiction with regard to RTE is over advertising time (previously the Minister's perrogative), codes of practice regarding advertising, programme content etc. (Certainly if it is to get a contract off the BCI it will have to play by the Commissions rules).

If this matter is decided within a couple of days I will be extremly surprised - it would probably rank as the fastest IRTC/BCI application ever in the twelve years its been in existence (Newstalk FM has been in the pipeline for about three years now and still has not signed a contract). As I said before, the BCI may recognise the gravity of the situation and allow RTE its contract. They might not want to destract themselves from the ILR relicencing. Then again, they may say "come back to us in two years when we're not busy".

They could say that but RTE could go straight to the high court citing restraint of trade for starters since they will not be broadcasting anything they do not already do now. Since they already have a licience to uplink technically these broadcasts come from outside of the BCI's jurisdiction. Radio Limerick lost it's IRTC liceince and continued to broadcast on satellite without hindrance. I think given the forthcoming election to Minister would be well advised to to "persuade"the BCI to gresae the wheels on this one.

freetoair

Hmmmm,.... I wonder in April will we get a letter from Ian Shepherd of SKY telling us about these three new channels specific to the Irish market along the lines of ....
Due to our efforts in expanding the range of channels to our Irish viewers it will be necessary to apply a small increase in the subscription fees - €4.00 per month !!!

I won't mind getting RTE as part of my standard subscription, but it'll be a cold day in hell if I have to pay for it in addition to paying a license fee !!!!!

Just a thought !

Genghis

I would be very surprised if Sky charge extra for the Irish channels. Their main motive in putting them on there is to reduce the 'channel discrepancy' when you move to satellite. I also think that there would be a legal challenge to any attempt by Sky to charge - RTE is not a subscription channel, it is paid for by license fee out of which it is expected to fund its own transmission.

Whether Sky charge RTE or not is another matter. But I can't see that being the case - it is more of a win-win situation for both parties.

I do think Sky will charge extra to bring the UK channels in, though.

Unlike RTE there we have no right to receive these for free. However, as my recent poll showed, a small increase in return for a full service would be of more interest than the current line-up.

Ba$tard

From http://scripts.ireland.com/technology/newsshowall.cfm?ID=2458

"A decision to reject the licence application would hurt RTÉ, which was hoping to boost its presence in Northern Ireland through the deal."

Laf! the hypocrisy..... Ireland announces they are applying for a license and UTV disappears underhandedly from ROI viewers.....
RTE want to break into the ad revenue market in the 6 counties but wont let UTV break into the market in the republic?

Lovely......Oh to be a fly on a wall in the office of Rupert Murdoch.


I love fair competition,
J.

carrolls

I just seems that once the beaurocratic wing of the Broadcasting Commission of Ireland (BCI)
get involved in anything, they screw it up for everyone.
When the BCI get involved in the Sky/RTE issue,
1: We will eventually be paying more for the Sky package.
2: We will have less channels.
3: UK/NI channel companies will be so browned off with everything that they will
say "Do not need the grief, Goodbye".

Whats the betting that the BCI will start demanding
that BBC, UTV, Channel 4 etc will need a license to broadcast
on the ROI EPG on Sky Digital.

The BCI have virtually Screwed up Chorus and NTl Ireland by
demanding Broadcasting license fees from them.
Then when Sky comes along with their own package and refuses to pay a license to the BCI,
NTL and Chorus are suddenly on a very unlevel playing pitch.


Because cable is a closed network technology,the BCI should have no juristiction
over cable TV.
MMDS and terrestial should be the only TV broadcasting mediums that should be covered by the
BCI because these methods are not closed loop.

Sky Digital is to all intents and purposes is closed loop system because nobody in the
Republic has access to those frequencies except through a SkyDigibox.

BCI please go away, you are not needed. You are irrelevant,
Sky know this and everyone else are slowly getting the message too.

icdg

Ahem...are you confusing the BCI with the ODTR in some of these accusations above, some of which appear to be quite wild?

The ODTR is the regulator for the Cable and MMDS companies. The BCI has no juristiction - *Except* where the companies originate their own content (ie run their own channel). They need a Cable/MMDS Content Contract or Digital Content Contract to cover this. As for cable being a closed system, leakage is not unknown and that gives the ODTR the right to interfere. But the BCI does not have any juristiction over the technical operation of a cable, MMDS, or for that matter direct broadcasting by satellite system.

There is one further area the BCI has juristiction over and that is the Electronic Programming Guide. The BCI has to licence EPGs, furthermore it can force a provider to carry an EPG of its choice.

The *general* simplified rule to remember is: if it has to do with channels or programmes, its the BCI. If it has to do with frequencies, wires or aerials, its the ODTR that regulates.

irishgeo

i just had a thought. i love ther english to have TnaG. i love to see and hear about their reaction it would be great. it would be like the welsh station.

carrolls

One of the points that I made was that the BDS has juristiction over
Cable EPG's but does not have the same juristiction over Satellite
EPG's. If both Satellite and Cable are offering essentially a very
similar package, the fact that Sky can turn around to the BDS and
say "We do not need your permission to do anything" and if the cable
companies do likewise are breaking the law places the cable
companies on a very uneven playing pitch.
Sky is right because the BDS runs aroung trying to license everything
that moves. But cable companies do not have the same flexibility.
Its like if you bought a dog license 10 years ago and your dog dies,
The dog license dept will see that you haven't payed and will remind
you again to pay. Sky Digital are going around like an unlicensed
dog owner boasting about the fact that they have no license and have no
intention of getting one.

I am just simply saying Chorus and NTl should not have to pay millions
in license fees to BDS. It is a tax on free competition.

dmeehan

can the BCI impose its will on sky as Sky are not based within the state?

icdg

Only if Sky is actually originating content within the state. European Union law ("Television without Frontiers", which I believe has already been quoted here today) means that television content is regulated within the originating member state. For example, if Ireland were to ban Formula One racing because of the cigerrete advertising, it could not stop ITV beaming pictures in, if it were legal in the UK.

(Although there also seems to be some reserve powers with regard to other member states being able to ban porn channels, which the UK ITC has excercised in regard to some Dutch channels).