So What if your card comes after you folded?

padser

When i first started playing poker it used to really annoy me if I folded a straight draw, or a flush draw and the card(s) i wanted fell. Even though i knew id made the right call (or thought i had) it still naturally bugged me seeing someone take a big pot with 2 pair when i would have had a flush etc.

However recently since i learnt that the cards are continually shuffled online and when you click (or what you click) determines what card falls it hasnt bothered me at all. I find it the easiest way to look at what would at first glance seem to be a potential straight etc. If i had clicked call then there would be DIFFERENT card there.

Bit of a random thought i know but I jsut thought id share it. Def makes online folding a little easier for me.

Washout

as long as you made the right call or fold based on the odds being offered then you have nothing to be upset about.
For me keeping the EV in the positive on flush and straight draws is the key.

Theres too many fish online who call even though they are not getting the pot odds and even though i may get beaten you just gotta have the attidude of smiling and saying "Keep calling"

on a similar note how many ppl bet on a strong hand to offer pot odds to flush draws and straight draws to average players? something ive never thought about until recently.

The Troll

Prime example of this was $1/$2 last night on VC. I was on the button playing six handed. Got 8T suited. 2folds, 1 Limp, SB Calls and BB raises to $16.

nxt calls, i fold and SB calls.

Flop comes T8T. SB checks, BB pushes, 1 fold and SB calls all in for $160ish squid. BB turns over AA and SB JJ. Neither improves, so BB takes down a monster.

I think my fold was the right move though, so cant really be annoyed. in the long run folding to a raise like that is certainly a good move.

padser

The Troll wrote:

Flop comes T8T. .

That was my original point. From what iv read (both here and on some of the sites themselves) the very fact that you folded rather then calling affected what cards came. Thus if you had called you wouldnt (probably) have hit the house

Lex

padser wrote:

That was my original point. From what iv read (both here and on some of the sites themselves) the very fact that you folded rather then calling affected what cards came. Thus if you had called you wouldnt (probably) have hit the house

Yea, I read an article a few weeks back with someone from Full Tilt (Lederer, I think) explaining the way the cards are contantly being shuffled during a hand to improve protection from people trying to gain access to see what cards are going to come next. So every extra second everyone takes to make a decision will change the cards that are going to be dealt.

Do all other sites use this method I wonder??

Also, I've always wondered whether or not they "burn" a card from the deck before dealing the flop, turn etc ???

padser

Lex wrote:

Also, I've always wondered whether or not they "burn" a card from the deck before dealing the flop, turn etc ???

My understanding of the reasoning behind burning (and this is hearsay so im open to correction) is that it is in case someone has caught a glimpse of the next card when the previous one was dealt. (obviously knowing what card is going to be burnt could be an advantage also but nothing like as much)

If this is true there wouldnt seem to be any reason to burn online.

Fathead

padser wrote:

My understanding of the reasoning behind burning (and this is hearsay so im open to correction) is that it is in case someone has caught a glimpse of the next card when the previous one was dealt. (obviously knowing what card is going to be burnt could be an advantage also but nothing like as much)

If this is true there wouldnt seem to be any reason to burn online.

I always thought that it was in case the top card was marked. ie the burn card. So by burning it you prevent dodgy sorts from knowing the next card out.

Lex

padser wrote:

My understanding of the reasoning behind burning (and this is hearsay so im open to correction) is that it is in case someone has caught a glimpse of the next card when the previous one was dealt. (obviously knowing what card is going to be burnt could be an advantage also but nothing like as much)

If this is true there wouldnt seem to be any reason to burn online.

Yea, I've heard the reasons for the traditon of burning cards.
Just wondering did they carry it on into the electronic form of the game.
Prob not as there is no need for it....but I just always wondered...

Lex

Fathead wrote:

I always thought that it was in case the top card was marked. ie the burn card. So by burning it you prevent dodgy sorts from knowing the next card out.

Thats the reason I heard. Way back in the day when they played with paper cards that would easily get marked/bent etc after a few hands of play.


Prob way off topic! Sorry Padser....got carried away on that train of thought.

The Troll

padser wrote:

That was my original point. From what iv read (both here and on some of the sites themselves) the very fact that you folded rather then calling affected what cards came. Thus if you had called you wouldnt (probably) have hit the house

No. You're implying that the cards aren't randomly dealt. *Most* would say that has no basis in fact

Scotty #

Fathead wrote:

I always thought that it was in case the top card was marked. ie the burn card. So by burning it you prevent dodgy sorts from knowing the next card out.

CORRECT!!

Lex

The Troll wrote:

No. You're implying that the cards aren't randomly dealt. *Most* would say that has no basis in fact

He's not implying that. He's saying that if the cards are constantly being shuffled during the hand, one's actions determine whether the cards are dealt a specific point in time. So if you delay the dealing of the flop, they will be shuffled more times, so chances are that the (random) flop dealt will show different cards.

padser

The Troll wrote:

No. You're implying that the cards aren't randomly dealt. *Most* would say that has no basis in fact

Im not implying they are not randomly dealt.

If key strokes determine where the shuffle stops, and thus what card is dealt, then if you fold, and an Ad comes on the turn This gives no indication of what would have happened had you called. Had you not folded, theoretically it is no more likely that the Ad would have come. It might have but it shouldnt be any more or less likely.

It also means you couldnt ever have someone online saying 'just deal out the last 2 cards there, i want to see what i would have had'.