RE: The eircom dsl roll-out

SantaHoe

I ordered ISDN a while ago, how typical of Eircom that it still hasn't been installed...
I'm wondering if I should cancel my order and wait for DSL to become available at my exchange.
It all depends on how long it'll take for the rest of the Dublin exchanges to be upgraded, are we talking weeks? months? or years?
Apparently my local exchange (northside near DCU) has not been upgraded as yet, and I don't really want to sit around and wait for another year, like I did when NTL released cable in Tallaght.

At the moment this is all I'm concerned about... will I see DSL this side of Christmas? - I think the price will sort itself out in time (with the help of your good selves of course ).

chernobyl

i would go an get ISDN, it will probably work out cheaper for you, but i am assuming you are a gamer [dunno why i do ].

SantaHoe

Yep a gamer among other things
But it'd probably work out at about the same, judging by my phonebills.

d-j-k

What to most people use the internet for? The odd email, browsing for entertainment, banking, general entertainment related things usually.

Why should decent webaccess cost more than say a subscription to Sky Digital or Chorus or NTL 's television services? What do eircom think is so damn amazing about the internet that people will be willing to pay out that much money per month.

OK, it's faster than dial up. If they took that attitude to say phone service we'd all be using manual operator connected calls.

The average home user of the net uses it for leisure reasons, maybe some work related stuff / education stuff too.. but it's not any different to a cable subscription and shouldn't cost twice the price.

DSL is not exactly a fantastic luxury either. Web content is now much more bandwidth intensive and many software companies provide downloadable updates based on the premis that most people have DSL / Cable modems.
e.g. apple's software updates can be 85mb +!!

Someone needs to realise that DSL / internet access is not really worth £79 - 125 ? per month. It's worth roughly the same or less than you pay for your tv package and until it's at that level it will NEVER EVER EVER be a mass market product. but maybe that's what eircom wants...

d-j-k

Can we, as a user group, make some suggestions and perhaps try to come up with a guideline price that we would be willing to pay for ADSL ?

What would make eircom sit up and listen? Could the group publish a pan european price comparison? and circulate this to the media a.s.a.p?

Compare say IRL/UK/F/D/E/DK/NL/F/S/ etc..
and compare with USA
we need to SERIOUSLY embarass eircom and the government, this situation is a complete joke
we should try to make irish consumers realise that this price is just GROSSLY unfair and that despite all the fancy marketing that this is more of the same from eircom; late to the market with a ridiculously over priced product!

Perhaps encourage potential customers (people with more money than sense !) to boycott the product completely, just DONT SUBSCRIBE AT! ALL! until the price comes down.

What would you really be willing to pay??
Price per month: ?
Acceptable cap:XX? GB/mth

chernobyl

Originally posted by d-j-k

DSL is not exactly a fantastic luxury either. Web content is now much more bandwidth intensive and many software companies provide downloadable updates based on the premis that most people have DSL / Cable modems.

you have obviously had no experience with DSL/Cable connection...well i have.
DSL @ only 512/128 browsing was a dream [ie]wham bam, theres the page loaded, and that page and that page and that media stream is so crisp and rich.

i have even seen 10Mbit cable an noticed no real difference in browsing, but how could you improve?

SantaHoe

Yah DSL is sweet.
I used it for a month when I was staying in Canada... charged at a fraction of what eircom are demanding and without a download cap.
So dissapointing to come home to a 56k modem after that
It's like having a dream where you've won the lottery... then waking up.

This thread has gone off in a tangent though, really what I'm wondering is - how long will it take before Dublin has most/all of the exchanges upgraded to provide adsl?
Just thought some of you clued in folks could give a ball-park figure.

SantaHoe

Ideal:
£40 per month.
No cap.

Realistic:
£50 per month
7 GB cap.

Eircom:
Whatever they can extort per month.
As little as they can get away with.

infomat

Originally posted by Dead{o}Santa
I ordered ISDN a while ago, how typical of Eircom that it still hasn't been installed...

Why is it taking so long ... I was connected within 48 hours.
I have ISDN and it is expensive and does not really offer any major advantage.
Be aware, if you have ISDN installed and then you decide to apply for ADSL you will be charged £99 to revert back so that the line may be tested and then if it fails you have to pay £99 pounds again to have ISDN re-installed. I would be inclined to hold on until the situation regarding ADSL becomes clear.

ando

The fasted connection i have seen is 128kbps downstream

BTW, I was told by eircom before this ODTR issue appeared that the most busiest exchanges would be upgraded, the rest by christmas (in dublin). But dont hold your breath, i'm certainly not anymore

R. Daneel Olivaw

That 700MB/day cap that was in the news last week would be quite alright, if it was on an equivalent 30-40/month charge. BUt for the monthly fee, a nice 99 euros, you could expect a 2Mbit download speed DSL connection in any other country.

Look, they are obviously trying to squeeze the market for everything. They have lost loads on shares, etc., . Basically they are just incompetent, can't compete, and know that per minute is a good thing to hold on to.

The fact is that the basic price they are looking for is around 2-3 times what it is for other EU countries and the US/Canada.

And then on TOP of that 2-3x overcharging, they limit it to a cap that is restrictive and makes the whole idea of broadband pointless.

So rather then beign able to logon every evening and putting up with ****ty 56k speed for a month, I can logon and download really fast for a day. Great. Same difference.

Either **** slow for a month
**** fast for a day

That "use your mouse" advert series is the icing on it all though. You think in any other western country they still advertise to get people online? AT all? No, by now, they have movied on from 1994 and trying to people online, at this stage, it's WHich DSL provider? Or which Cable provider has the best deal?

Here we are still being fed "join the internet..." crap.

nahdoic

For £100 a month, I can be on-line for 5 hours a day, everyday based on Eircom's over-inflated per minute charging! I think I'll be sticking to my 56k.

£50 a month, and a 7 gig cap, that is fair to Eircom and to the consumer, I'd be all over that.

for £100 a month, the cap should definitely be 700 mb a day and you would expect a 2Mbit download speed.

This is really depressing. When are we going to stop getting screwed around by Eircom? Just get competitive already, I can't wait till there is another offer made available. Be it, NTL's cable network, Chorus's Powernet, or a 2 way European Satellite internet provider. Then it's bye bye Eircom, you aren't going to get another penny of my money, if I ever need to make a phone call I'll use my mobile just to make sure you don't get another penny, and on the rare occassion if I have to ring a landline that you own, I'll make it the shortest call I have ever made.

Hmmm if Eircom don't get their act together, and stop making all this 'bad will' towards their company, they're going to be out of business in a couple of years. When people won't need Eircom, I can't wait for that day, when we don't NEED Eircom ... ahhh that will be so great.

Urban Weigl

AOL Germany charges just over IR£15 per month for ADSL including VAT. Now let's double that... now we have IR£30. I think that would be a fair price, but only if it didn't come with a cap or came with a high cap. I'm actually not totally against a cap, as long as additional bandwidth is at a reasonable price and charged per GB instead of per MB (IR£3 and rounded to the nearest GB, for example).

The reason I don't think we should be looking at the UK for guidance is because they've simply priced DSL too high for most people. In fact, there was an article in The Register that claimed that the UK had the highest prices for ADSL in the world.

JANER

Originally posted by infomat


Why is it taking so long ... I was connected within 48 hours.
I have ISDN and it is expensive and does not really offer any major advantage.
Be aware, if you have ISDN installed and then you decide to apply for ADSL you will be charged £99 to revert back so that the line may be tested and then if it fails you have to pay £99 pounds again to have ISDN re-installed. I would be inclined to hold on until the situation regarding ADSL becomes clear.

I have Isdn too but what i did was get another analogue line(old number,works out cheaper than the £99) in
even though i am paying rental on 2 phones i have the choice when the adsl thinghy comes along....so i rent 2nd phone at 2 months for £26 if adsl 2 dear i get rid of 2nd phone line
or if adsl ok i get rid of isdn

BTW i am a gamer thats all i really use net for i assume 3 gigs not enough but would 4 gigs be enough
a rough idea anyone?

Paulw

Bottom line - no matter where we look, the price and details eircom have given are way above what everyone else is paying.

The service is the same, but eircom are just greedy !!!

They need to remove the cap AND reduce the price, or at the very least make the cap realistic, plus reduce the price.

Someone in Eircom must see that they can make longterm gains with these reductions since more people will avail of the service. Right now they will make a major loss since very very few will take up the service.

I personally think that everyone should register their interest in the service, but when the eircom sales person calls, let them know that while we want the service, we are not prepared to pay what eircom are asking.

Just my opinion.

infomat

Originally posted by JANER

I have Isdn too but what i did was get another analogue line(old number,works out cheaper than the £99) in
even though i am paying rental on 2 phones i have the choice when the adsl thinghy comes along....so i rent 2nd phone at 2 months for £26 if adsl 2 dear i get rid of 2nd phone line
or if adsl ok i get rid of isdn

BTW i am a gamer thats all i really use net for i assume 3 gigs not enough but would 4 gigs be enough
a rough idea anyone?

Yor bill should be (every second month)
Analogue rental including VAT = 28.488
Isdn rental including VAT = 69.69

This is almost £50 per month without making a single phone call ... this is expensive.

JANER

It is....but i am so hooked on games i wanted to be ready when adsl came out and as you know ISDN lines not included for it.....sure i been paying thru the nose last 2 years at 1p a min 4p off peak

ando

Originally posted by JANER
BTW i am a gamer thats all i really use net for i assume 3 gigs not enough but would 4 gigs be enough
a rough idea anyone?

Long answer:
I worked out that with a 56k modem, playing online for 3hours a day average, I use up around 2GB's a month. I was astonished at the amount of data that is used by the game... so I guess with ADSL, with the more bandwidth available, the usuage will be a whole lot more

PLUS, general surfing the net and downloading (another 2/3 gigs minimum)


Short answer:
3GB is not enough for gamers