CAT5 plates

FrankGrimes

I have installed CAT5 cable in my house while doing a rewire and now need to buy the front plates for it. I have all the cables running to one room and have sourced a rack for those connections on ebay. I need to find the cheapest place to buy the actual front plates for the other connections around the house.

What do I need (i.e. just a front plate or do I need a box behind it and a box to fit the plates into) and what is the correct name for them (is it RJ45 connectors)?

Anyone have any advice on where to get good deals on this as from what I've heard so far they seem fairly pricey?

Muchos gratias

Rew

What u need depends on what you are doing. If you have some way of screwing the plate on to the wall u dont need the box but in most cases you will need the box embedded in the wall to fix the face plate to.

You got a rack on ebay but did u get a patch panel to go in that rack to terminate the cables to?

FrankGrimes

Hi,

The plates will all be embeded in timber stud partition walls so if I get dry-wall socket boxes (which would normally be used for plugs, light switches - I can get these for free) could I screw the plates (what's the proper name?) onto them?

I haven't bought the rack yet, and actually I think I got that wrong - I'll be buying a panel like this and will probably just build an MDF cabinet around it as its gonna be too deep for the stud wall and I'm not shelling out hundreds for a proper cabinet - am I along the right lines?

Rew

FrankGrimes wrote:

Hi,

The plates will all be embeded in timber stud partition walls so if I get dry-wall socket boxes (which would normally be used for plugs, light switches - I can get these for free) could I screw the plates (what's the proper name?) onto them?

Yeah I think you should be OK but worth buying one face plate to check. When buying the face plate make sure you are getting the RJ45 socket to go wit it, I think some come as seperate parts so that you can fir other types of socket to them.

I haven't bought the rack yet, and actually I think I got that wrong - I'll be buying a panel like this and will probably just build an MDF cabinet around it as its gonna be too deep for the stud wall and I'm not shelling out hundreds for a proper cabinet - am I along the right lines?

Yeah thats what your looking for. You may or may not need a croning tool for the face plates and the patch panel. Chances are you will though.

Keep in mind that their can be a fair bit of bulk behind the panel with lots of cables coming in to it so leave space behind it when you mount it. Get plenty of cable ties and secure all the cables so that they dont get pulled. Patch panel should have loops for this. Make sure you get a cable tester as well

B&Q do the face plates as do an electrical supplier so shop around. They can be quite expensive...

FrankGrimes

Nice one. So is it 'RJ45 front plates' I'm looking for - just want to know what to google for?

And is there a good chance the dry-wall boxes will fit the front plates?

Sparky

FrankGrimes wrote:

Nice one. So is it 'RJ45 front plates' I'm looking for - just want to know what to google for?

And is there a good chance the dry-wall boxes will fit the front plates?

yeah the drylining boxes are a standard fit, your RJ45 plates should be the same as a single gang socket or single gang switch plate.

Tenshot

The 48-way patch panel you showed looks fine. You can get a mini 19" rack (4U high, i.e. room for four strips of sockets or whatever) for around €40.

One advantage of using a rack like this is that one side is usually hinged, so by undoing two retaining screws, you can swing it open to get at all the connections at the rear of the panel. Also, you can get a cheap 19" rackmount 16-port or 24-port switch and screw it directly into the panel, so that all the ports are at the same level as your patch panel. CPC have some good value ones for around £30 (16-port) or £40 (24-port) in their latest catalogue, and they are only about 6" deep - order code CS0947821 and CS0947921 respectively; not currently listed on the website.

On the other hand, it's quick and easy to simply mount two blocks of wood, one on either side of the panel, and screw the panel into it directly - you'll rarely need to get at the back of it once it's wired up, and if you do, just undo the screws. A friend did this in his house (inside a cupboard with not too much depth) and it worked out well.

For wall sockets, dry-lining boxes work fine - you get a slightly neater fit with the recessed ones that your electrician probably fitted for light switches, wall sockets, etc. attached to a recessed board in the wall.

For the RJ45 faceplates to attach to the sockets, I usually buy from Deering Communications on Cork St - the last set I got were around €2.50 per socket, and €1 for a single-gang faceplate that accepts two sockets, e.g. about €6 + VAT for every pair. Eurosales in Ringsend (on the corner, behind the library) have similar prices. Other suppliers can charge two or three times this, so it pays to shop around.

When looking at sockets (and patch panels), make sure they are properly colour coded with clearly visible orange/green/blue/brown markings - it makes life a LOT easier when you're terminating the wires if it's easy to see the colours, and some panels/sockets I've come across make it almost impossible to see what the colours should be.

Everything you buy over here will be T568B, which is more or less the standard colour code used for Europe (Orange / Green / Blue / Brown) though occasionally you'll find dual-mode panels with T568A labelling shown as well (Green / Orange / Blue / Brown). Stick with the T568B layout if possible, since it reduces the possibility for confusion. (Obviously, both your wall sockets and patch panel should be wired using the same standard!)

Also check for the depth of the RJ45 socket in the wall faceplates; sometimes they can be quite deep, which is a pain if your wallbox is shallow. Ideally, bring along an actual wallbox with you so you can get an idea how much clearance there will be at the back.

And finally, as mentioned above, you'll definitely need a decent quality Krone punchdown tool for a job like this - expect to pay €20-30 for one.

Rew

What he said...

FrankGrimes

Wow! Thanks lads – that’s some quality info right there.

My stud walls are just over 4 inches deep so embedding a patch panel in them is not an option. Theres only about 14inches between the joists so either way recessing the patch panel won’t work. Do all patch panels come in 19” widths or could I say find a 24 port panel that was only about 12” wide (I have 25 cables but 24 ports could get away with 24 ports)? This would give me the option of partially recessing the panel and screwing it into blocks of wood on the surface of the stud wall – it wouldn’t stick out so much then.

Alternatively could I just use a 19” patch panel but fit it vertically which would then fit between the joists and so allow me to partially recess it while freeing up more ground space? I would then fix the the panel to some blocks of wood and build a cabinet around it.

http://www.Netshop.co.uk and http://www.nst-networkstore.co.uk both seem to be good value on this type of gear and both deliver to Ireland (£10 with Quantum, not sure on Netshop yet).

Both companies have a 24 port patch panel for £30 (Netshop’s, Quantum’s)

With Netshop a low profile (square edge) single face plate with two RJ45 connectors from this page comes to £4.29 inc VAT.

Netshop's KPD2 Economy tool for Krone punchdown blocks is £13.52

With Quantum this bevel edged single faceplate and two RJ45 modules comes to £3.70 inc Vat.

With Quantum they seem to have their own 2A IDC Insertion Tool for £8.99 - its not displayed on the site but I mailed them and they say it does the same job as the Krone tool - should I trust this or stick with a Krone punchdown?

So it looks like Quantum might just shade it - anyone have any preferences of sqaure edge over bevel edge face plates?

I can't make it to an electricial suppliers during the week so it'll be a web order for me but it'd be sound if one of you punters could have a look at the Quantum stuff above and lemme know if I'm getting the right gear (both RJ45 modules and patch panels use IDC). Nice one.

Tenshot

[Missed this reply back when Search was broken... ]

FrankGrimes wrote:

My stud walls are just over 4 inches deep so embedding a patch panel in them is not an option. Theres only about 14inches between the joists so either way recessing the patch panel won’t work.

You probably don't want to sink it into the wall anyway since it would be a bit trickier to wire up, and make any maintenance in the future that bit harder...

Do all patch panels come in 19” widths or could I say find a 24 port panel that was only about 12” wide

19" is the standard size, and I doubt you'll find anything smaller.

I have another friend that decided to go the non-patch-panel route in his house (after some wifely pressure). What he did instead was mount five double-gang sockets vertically in a relatively discrete corner of the room, with four CAT5 outlets per socket, for a total of 20 sockets (16 for the house, and four out to the garage where his main computer gear is). He has a small PBX in the same corner, along with a small network switch. The sockets are flush with the wall, though of course the patch cables coming out of the sockets still take up a bit of room.

It works out about the same moneywise, but takes a little more effort to install. Also, it's harder to keep the cabling neat, since the sockets aren't in such close proximity. Might be worth considering though if you're pushed for space.

(Also, if you have say 25-28 sockets, you could go with a 24-port strip for the main sockets, but put the auxiliary ones into a separate surface-mount double-gang 4-socket box - especially handy for things like outside phonelines etc. coming in that are "different" than normal data sockets.)

Another thing I've found useful: since I don't have a PBX (that would be overkill for an apartment, even for me!), I split my incoming phoneline about four ways by reserving a strip of sockets on the main patch panel for phone extensions, and simply wiring them all together at the back.

For example, if you take a bunch of four sockets and run a single, long CAT5 pair between the blue pins on all four sockets ("frogging"), then you can use the first socket as an input and the other three as output - like a 1-to-3 way splitter. I put two sets of these into my panel and find them handy for all sorts of things. On the other hand, I had 14 ports free (out of 48) when I originally wired up, so I was looking for things to do with them :-)

(Also useful: take two ports, and wire them back to back as a cross-over connection; then you can instantly create a cross-over link for any device by just wiring it through that pair of sockets.)

http://www.Netshop.co.uk and http://www.nst-networkstore.co.uk

Both seem to have good prices, and both types of sockets look very similar to what I use myself (low-profile etc.) Don't forget to get a few blanking plates for sockets that end up with only one connector in them - or you can often get single-gang faceplates with just a single centred hole for an RJ45 fitting, instead of two side-by-side -- this looks better than using a blanking plate for the right-hand side.

With Quantum they seem to have their own 2A IDC Insertion Tool for £8.99 - its not displayed on the site but I mailed them and they say it does the same job as the Krone tool - should I trust this or stick with a Krone punchdown?

I'd definitely stick with the official one - for a fiver in the difference, it's not worth the risk. It might be fine, or it might break your heart. You'll be using it a lot so it's worth getting a decent one.

Here's a pic of the one I use, btw:

So it looks like Quantum might just shade it - anyone have any preferences of sqaure edge over bevel edge face plates?

I like the square edges myself, but personal preference really. You might get a tiny bit more depth with the bevel edges (i.e. the socket may protude out from the wall slightly more) which could be useful in tight situations.

Other things you'll probably want: a pair of electrician's snips and a pair of long-nose pliers, 4" if you can get them, to tidy up any loose wires in the panel; also lots of cable-ties; and if you're going with the patch panel, a few packs of patch panel nuts & bolts, since equipment doesn't always include them. Don't forget to order a buch of short (0.5m or 1m) CAT5 cables for patching with as well.

Good luck with it! The installation will take you a lot of time (especially the first few punchdowns, while you're getting the hang of it) but it's well worth the effort.

FrankGrimes

Wow - thanks again for the quality info Tenshot

Unfortunately I jumped the gun and ordered the stuff from nst-networkstore and it should arrive in a few days.

So I’m stuck with the unofficial punchdown, but if its useless I’ll buy an official one rather than perservere with it.

And yeh I’m just having an ‘eh, duh?’ moment with your suggestion of using 6 double sockets rather than a patch panel. I had originally thought of doing it that way but went against it cos of the effect on appearance it would have and the difficulty in cutting 6 double socket holes so close to each other. But these are fairly low profile (square edge as I prefer them myself aswell) faceplates and I can add the double sockets as I need them so it does seem to be the better option as the more I think of it the more ghastly it seems the patch panel solution will look.

My phone system has been wired completely separately to the computer cables (which I put in myself, electrician did phone lines) and will have its own faceplates (which I assume are RJ45 aswell). The phone line in the box bedroom (where the patch panel/25 faceplates will be) is right beside the computer cables so I could have phone line and computer cable faceplates in one socket. I could then patch the phoneline into a computer cable and then onto anywhere in the computer network – right? Am trying to think of advantages of this, a PBX is overkill right now, but would it be an advantage to have this option for the future when video phone becomes standard?

When you say to get cables for patching would an example of this be joining a device in the sitting room to a device in dining room where both have a cable back to the hub in the box bedroom but no direct line to each other?

For this do I need normal CAT5 cables or crossover CAT5 cables (not sure of the uses of each type)?

So yeh looks like I’ll either try returning my patch panel and rear cable management bar, or if that’s too much hassle I’ll stick them up for sale here on boards.ie.

Oh yeh, would be interested to get opinions on this – I was advised to run in more cables than I’d think are necessary as you never know what you’ll use them for so I went mental and have like 6 cables to the TV, 4 between TV and hi-fi point, 4 in each bedroom, 2 in kitchen, 4 for extension etc. Will such a network add to the resale of my house? I see no harm on wiring up all these cables so as to give me and future purchasers the option of doing some cool stuff with them (I nearly fell over when I got my Windows Media Center machine up and running the other day and realised how damn slick it is and that’s without hooking up the extenders I got in the US ) and the downside is you have a few extra sockets around the place and loads in the box bedroom but would people advise that I should only wire up a few of them that I need or just wire it all up now (not to late to do either option)?

Tenshot

FrankGrimes wrote:

Unfortunately I jumped the gun and ordered the stuff from nst-networkstore and it should arrive in a few days.

Somehow, I had a feeling you might :-)

I had originally thought of doing it that way but went against it cos of the effect on appearance it would have and the difficulty in cutting 6 double socket holes so close to each other. But these are fairly low profile (square edge as I prefer them myself aswell) faceplates and I can add the double sockets as I need them so it does seem to be the better option as the more I think of it the more ghastly it seems the patch panel solution will look.

I guess it all depends on location really... if you are cutting out holes in plasterboard, I'd recommend getting one of those little plasterboard hole saws (they look like this and are available from most DIY stores). It makes it quick and easy. You can use a jigsaw either, but need to be careful not to nick any concealed cables.

My phone system has been wired completely separately to the computer cables (which I put in myself, electrician did phone lines) and will have its own faceplates (which I assume are RJ45 as well).

If you have a choice, AND if the phone cables are just normal 2-pair or 3-pair phone cable rather than full CAT5, then you're as well off wiring the phone cables with normal RJ11 sockets rather than RJ45 sockets - mainly to avoid any confusion that plugging network cables into them will do anything useful.

You can fit RJ45 sockets as well, and they'll work fine (good option if you have phone & network in the same socket); the only slight downside is that because the RJ45 sockets are a little deeper, and usually have a dust cover, it can be a little bit fiddly removing telephone leads from them - you need to use a finger nail to hold the dust cover up while you use your thumb to press the little release tab and then pull the cable out with two other fingers.

Also, when putting an RJ11 phone lead into an RJ45 socket, make sure to push it all the way in until it clicks, otherwise it won't make contact and you'll think it's not working.

The phone line in the box bedroom (where the patch panel/25 faceplates will be) is right beside the computer cables so I could have phone line and computer cable faceplates in one socket. I could then patch the phoneline into a computer cable and then onto anywhere in the computer network – right?

Yes, exactly - except of course, it won't be "on" the network as such, just coming out of one of your other RJ45 sockets.

Am trying to think of advantages of this, a PBX is overkill right now, but would it be an advantage to have this option for the future when video phone becomes standard?

Well, not really since it's unlikely your video phone would be running over standard phone cable anyway, it would almost certainly be running over pure Ethernet. However, it's a handy way to get a normal phone line over to a point near one of your PCs without having to run cables across the room.

If your phone cable is indeed full CAT5 cable, then definitely wire them up as RJ45 sockets, since you can use them as network sockets at a pinch.

Incidentally, a handy trick you can do to get both phone and network to the same location, where you only have a single CAT5 cable running, is to split the cable and wire the blue/brown pairs to the blue/green pairs on one socket, labelled PHONE, and orange/green to orange/green on the other socket, labelled NETWORK. Then the single cable will do you for both phone and Ethernet, and you'll have separate sockets at each end for convenience. It won't support Gigabit Ethernet, but the convenience of having both phone + Ethernet at the same location probably outweighs that, since 100BASE-T Ethernet is plenty fast enough for most people.

When you say to get cables for patching would an example of this be joining a device in the sitting room to a device in dining room where both have a cable back to the hub in the box bedroom but no direct line to each other?

More or less - more a case of you'll have a hub (probably a switch, actually) mounted near where all your sockets are in the box room, and you need some way to connect each socket into the hub - so to allow the sitting room and dining room to co-exist on the same network, they should both be connected to the hub in the box room.

Short CAT5 cables are the easiest way to do this. (Long CAT5 cables are the other way, but you end up with more cable to try and keep tidy!) They're about 1-2 euros each, depending on length. You won't need crossover CAT5 cables, since everything will be plugged into a hub - just as if you had all the computers in the same room.

Oh yeh, would be interested to get opinions on this – I was advised to run in more cables than I’d think are necessary as you never know what you’ll use them for so I went mental and have like 6 cables to the TV, 4 between TV and hi-fi point, 4 in each bedroom, 2 in kitchen, 4 for extension etc. Will such a network add to the resale of my house?

Well, I'd certainly give extra points for it :-)

I've done my own apartment, and been involved in the CAT5 wiring for four other houses (friends & family), and they each have between 24 and 48 sockets. You generally find that no more than half of them are used regularly, but you can't tell in advance which half - and the flexibility of being able to quickly change things around is great.

It's so easy to do the cabling when the house is being built/refurbished vs the expense of doing it later on that I'd say the more the merrier - almost worth running extra cables in the walls even if you aren't going to bother putting sockets on them just yet (just put blanking plates on, or take photos of where the cables are in the wall before closing them up).

Also worth remembering speaker cables - my Dad and brother-in-law both ran speaker cable to points on the ceiling, for ceiling speakers (looped through the wall near the light switch, for a volume control) and it worked out well - they now have discrete background music in every room, individually controllable. Forgot to run CAT5 from the wall sockets though, which would have been ideal for an automated control panel in each room, so for now, it's just a manual volume control. Still very handy though.

I see no harm on wiring up all these cables so as to give me and future I should only wire up a few of them that I need or just wire it all up now (not to late to do either option)?

I'd do them all now unless there's a good reason not to - it's much more difficult to get the energy up to go back and do it later, so it will probably never get done. But that's just me...