My new toy

LundiMardi · 08-09-2005 9:39pm #1

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=7349344437&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT

Oooooh yeaaaahah

feylya · 08-09-2005 9:43pm

That new job paying well then?

LundiMardi · 08-09-2005 9:45pm

feylya wrote:

That new job paying well then?

actually it's paying quite a bit less tbh:(

feylya · 08-09-2005 9:47pm

Ah. Selling your body so?

LundiMardi · 08-09-2005 9:48pm

feylya wrote:

Ah. Selling your body so?

heh, I'd probably earn more recycling coke cans tbh:(

feylya · 08-09-2005 9:50pm

True...

LundiMardi · 08-09-2005 10:10pm

*sniffle*

Ah hopefully i'll get that beaut next week, probably not in time for the gig but ya never know....

feylya · 08-09-2005 10:13pm

Aye. 250 clams though... Not too bad at all. I don't know if one of those would fit into my vision of "the perfect rig" though.

LundiMardi · 08-09-2005 10:17pm

neither do i, i'll find out next week, should be about 270 incl all vats and taxes etc, but with any luck i might get lucky and not get charged, in which case it'll be about 210 or so. Nay too shabby..

I'm getting a tu2 on sat, i would get it online but i want it for the gig so i don't have the luxury of online satisfaction....

feylya · 08-09-2005 10:19pm

Jesus, you could sell that and at least break even if you didn't like it. I like what they can do but I can't see myself using half hour loops

The only tuner I have is in the ME-50 but I like the Korg tuners you can get. Brushed aluminium finish. That said, I don't think you can beat the TU-2.

John · 09-09-2005 11:10am

feylya wrote:

I like what they can do but I can't see myself using half hour loops

That would be the Line6's main selling point to me. It's a great pedal but can be a bit limited and tricky to use but once you get used to it you can do some amzing things with it. I've been GASsing for one for a long long time.

Eoin Madsen · 09-09-2005 12:02pm

feylya wrote:

The only tuner I have is in the ME-50 but I like the Korg tuners you can get. Brushed aluminium finish. That said, I don't think you can beat the TU-2.

I dunno, the TU-2 is not true bypass. While I'm not a true bypass obsessive as such, I think it's not an unrealistic expectation for a tuner. The Korg isn't tb either, but (unlike the TU-2) I reckon it's a pretty simple mod if you can get your hands on a TPDT footswitch that you like. Besides... brushed aluminium!

feylya · 09-09-2005 1:43pm

Who cares if it doesn't work, it looks nice

Aye, true bypass would be easy to get on it I spose. Tell me Eoin, what do you think of the idea that it's bad to have all true bypass pedals in a chain? That you should have at least one buffered pedal to boost the signal?

Ancient1 · 09-09-2005 2:01pm

what do you think of the idea that it's bad to have all true bypass pedals in a chain? That you should have at least one buffered pedal to boost the signal?

Why do you say that, fey?

feylya · 09-09-2005 2:09pm

It was just something I read before. Basically, by adding in "true bypass" pedals, the chain gets longer so you loose some signal but if you have a buffered input at the start (say a stock Dunlop wah), it'll boost the signal so that you don't notice the degradation. I've never been able to test it out for myself and I'd like to get Eoin's opinion on it.

Ancient1 · 09-09-2005 2:14pm

Hm, that's interesting. I always thought that the opposite is the case, but i read Pete Cornish's theory ....makes sense too, tbh, so i don't know what to think.

Eoin Madsen · 11-09-2005 12:11am

feylya wrote:

Who cares if it doesn't work, it looks nice

Aye, true bypass would be easy to get on it I spose. Tell me Eoin, what do you think of the idea that it's bad to have all true bypass pedals in a chain? That you should have at least one buffered pedal to boost the signal?

Assuming you have 5 or 6 pedals and all of them are correctly shielded (externally and internally), I imagine having them all in true bypass would add just under 1 metre to your chain. Which is the difference between a 5m or 6m guitar lead. There is certainly nothing bad in having true bypass pedals, it's just potentially advantagous that the first one be a buffer instead of true bypass (assuming you're using passive pickups).

"Buffering" doesn't exactly boost the signal, it actually involves changing the impedance. This results in less loss of signal over any signal processing (you'd often have a buffer before a passive EQ in an amp, and sometimes before the effects loop). Tbh, no one has ever walked into my studio with an actual guitar buffer afaik (unless the TU-2 is supposed to have one - but if it does, it sucks) so I've yet to sit down with one and A/B the sound. To the best of my knowledge, a buffer should be more of a help over long leads (maybe 10m+) and for signal processing that is active in the circuit at the time. So by all means, get a buffer but there's no reason not to also true bypass as many pedals as you can. The buffer is more useful for this when you're using pedals than when you're bypassing them.

The TC Electronic Stereo Chorus Flanger pedal has a buffer and a good reputation. That'd be my first choice if I was heading in the guitar pedal direction. And the whole "buffer" thing would be a good cover for my 80s chorus fetish.

Fundamentally, by my understanding of amp input stages anyway, a buffer should change your sound - with or without pedals. But as I said, I've yet to sit down with a proper one to find out in what way.

Eoin Madsen · 11-09-2005 12:14am

Just read that article. If you use two foot leads to join your pedals you deserve all the signal degradation you get. :rolleyes:

Incidently, while my opinion is being asked (this is my 15 seconds, and damn I'm going to use it

), I would advocate using expensive effects (like a G-Major or better still, one of the TC Electronic M series) and putting said effects in the amp's effects loop. The less things that get between your pickup coils and the driver valve in the amp, the better, imo. Default in the effects loop and try alternatives when that isn't sounding right, rather than doing the opposite like most people seem to.

SirLemonhead · 11-09-2005 12:31am

Can't help using cable lengths that long I guess if you're talking about rack mounted pedals...

The boss buffers are meant to be pretty decent anyway, arent they? They couldn't really make the TU-2 true bypass with the FET switching system..

Eoin Madsen · 11-09-2005 10:17am

MasterOfSolos wrote:

Can't help using cable lengths that long I guess if you're talking about rack mounted pedals...

I'm pretty sure most rack mounts are designed for insertion into an effects loop or between a preamp and poweramp.

They couldn't really make the TU-2 true bypass with the FET switching system..

Why not? Granted, your signal is passing through an FET, but that in itself doesn't really exclude from the possbility of true bypass. The problem TB is designed prevent is having unnecessary potential dividers in the circuit.

The Mesa Boogie Bottle Rocket uses some transistor switching tricks as well - it's designed to bypass if the pedal loses power, irrespective of the DPDT position. How cool is that? Boss pedals have no signal path if they lose power.

SirLemonhead · 11-09-2005 11:18am

If you want to use a rackmounted midi switching looper, you'd need cables that long I guess.

Would it be possible for boss to have created their electronic switch on the TU-2 without using a FET? I thought the only way to do true bypass in a pedal is with one of those mechanical DPDT switches?

Eoin Madsen · 13-09-2005 12:35am

Well, like I said, it wouldn't be true bypass for the true bypass purist but I imagine it could still fullfill the primary objective of true bypass - which is to stop your signal leeching to ground through various pots and resistors. Maybe not, I haven't seen a schematic tbh. (I presume you'd need a pair of FETs to switch both ends of the circuit anyway, but that's easily done). Either way, it doesn't achieve that and I'd take the disadvantages of a DPDT switch over the sound of a boss tuner bleeding off my top-end any day.

MasterOfSolos wrote:

If you want to use a rackmounted midi switching looper, you'd need cables that long I guess.

How so?

SirLemonhead · 13-09-2005 1:12am

Eoin Madsen wrote:

How so?

Maybe not quite 2 feet long, but you'd need a fair bit of extra length over a standard pedal to pedal connection layout. Depends on how the rack is wired I guess...

Was just me trying to come up with a reason for longer cables than standard. No matter

Eoin Madsen · 13-09-2005 10:53am

MasterOfSolos wrote:

Maybe not quite 2 feet long, but you'd need a fair bit of extra length over a standard pedal to pedal connection layout. Depends on how the rack is wired I guess...

Was just me trying to come up with a reason for longer cables than standard. No matter

Again, I would imagine most rack effects would be in the effects loop, so the cable length would not be the same issue at all.

SirLemonhead · 13-09-2005 2:39pm

Eoin Madsen wrote:

Again, I would imagine most rack effects would be in the effects loop, so the cable length would not be the same issue at all.

If theyre pedals, then most people usually run them through a midi switching system which itself is then run through the preamp effects loop ( or between preamp and poweramp )

Basically lots and lots of send and return jacks, as well as in and outs. Lots of cabling.

Shanannigan · 13-09-2005 5:14pm

nice piece of kit that... you goin loopy then? my mate got one of them... first time he saw it being used was by Joseph Arthur... and in october he's supporting Joseph Arthur... one of those heartwarming tales.... anywho... i'm thinkin of gettin one meself... though not sure whether to go for that one or the boss loopstation... i'm kind of a bit of a boss-head a wee bit

Eoin Madsen · 14-09-2005 11:24am

MasterOfSolos wrote:

If theyre pedals, then most people usually run them through a midi switching system which itself is then run through the preamp effects loop ( or between preamp and poweramp )

Basically lots and lots of send and return jacks, as well as in and outs. Lots of cabling.

The guitar signal goes into the amp, fx loop send: goes into the rack effects unit, fx loop return: goes back into the amp. The controller for the rack is connected with a MIDI cable that sends MIDI signals and doesn't involve sending guitar signals anywhere outside the box. If you're controlling MIDI pedal effects or regular pedals with MIDI switching then they should be at the amp (otherwise why are you using a MIDI controller?). This is the whole point of MIDI controlling, if you're wiring it any way that involves sending your guitar signal back and forth across the room, you defeat the whole system. With that said, even if you do: the effects loop signal is already amplified and buffered - that's what the effects loop is for.

The only thing I'd worry about in an effects loop is the repercussions of sending unbalanced signals on long cable runs (something which buffered guitar signals suffer equally from).

SirLemonhead · 14-09-2005 1:38pm

Eoin Madsen wrote:

The guitar signal goes into the amp, fx loop send: goes into the rack effects unit, fx loop return: goes back into the amp. The controller for the rack is connected with a MIDI cable that sends MIDI signals and doesn't involve sending guitar signals anywhere outside the box. If you're controlling MIDI pedal effects or regular pedals with MIDI switching then they should be at the amp (otherwise why are you using a MIDI controller?). This is the whole point of MIDI controlling, if you're wiring it any way that involves sending your guitar signal back and forth across the room, you defeat the whole system. With that said, even if you do: the effects loop signal is already amplified and buffered - that's what the effects loop is for.

The only thing I'd worry about in an effects loop is the repercussions of sending unbalanced signals on long cable runs (something which buffered guitar signals suffer equally from).

Heh yeah I know how racks work...

If you're using a midi looper you have a rack unit that can store 128 patches or so, like a midi preamp. The looper has a certain amount of relay switched loops in it, that can be turned on and off in any combination per patch. You put all your basic guitar effects pedals into a rack drawer below and wire it up. It's a fair bit of cable as each pedal is on its own loop, so it goes

Input to first loop, send to pedal input, pedal output to return, then loop output to wherever you want to go, most of the time into the input of loop 2, and so on and so on. It's not that uncommon for people to rackmount pedals that way.

I never said that this would necessarily cause 2 feet long cable runs, but it can really add up (especially if you have a patch where all the pedals are in the signal chain at once)

My new toy

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