Still undecided

cormie

Hi,
I'm still undecided about what it is I should be doing in the wood industry. I want creativity, imagination and I want to be able to work on my own and be my own boss once qualified, I want to design pieces of great quality and skill (as much as I can put into it anyway!). I've had experience in woodwork in school up to third year, I did nearly 2 years in Carpentry which I didn't like at all, it's not down my street at all, roofing, stud work etc, not the kind of wood working I want to be doing. I did the college part in Carpentry with FAS too and that was quite enjoyable, not so much the roofing or the building theory parts, as I'm not interested at all in them. But I did enjoy trying to make that perfect joint on a dooror window, taking time (which I did, I never rushed things, I made sure it was done as well as I could have done it). Most of all in that I loved making an oil stone box as there was plenty of carving involved and this is what I love to do.

I'm not too familiar with the industry side of things, I've been suggested Wood Turning and Cabinet Making. I'm not too sure which to pursue. If anyone has feedback on either, please let me know:) Is there a trade that is a combination of the two even? Attached is an image of some of my work, the top two are the oil stone box and the bottom 2 are hand carved joints. I like to concentrate and try to achieve perfection in the piece and enjoy trying to achieve this. The oil stone box has been the most enjoyable thing I've ever done in my experience with woodworking. Hopefully all of this will give an idea of what I would be suited to.

I even went to a career guidance lady who suggested I have to take up something to do with crafts. Even just so I can find out if it's for me or not, she had other suggestions to career wise but said to go for the craft industry for definite.

Does anyone know any master craftsmen who I would be suited to working for? Even the first 6 months un paid or so.

Any feedback appreciated, thanks.

dogg_r_69

Not sure cabinet making is the right one from what you were saying Any cabinet makers I know, none are working in any area you seem interested in 2 are shop fitting Well making the units needed for the shop fitting and from what I've seem You can get away with things being a bit rougher and the others I know are all working for companies making fitted furniture It's a bit more on the skilful side than shop fitting but still no where near what you're looking for
If it is cabinet making you want then I think you will have to search for someone who does the type of work you want But there doesn't seem to be too many Can't think of any off hand

galwaydude18

God that oil stone holder is damn nice! It's a nice little project for anyone doing woodwork in school! I reckon you need to find a cabinet maker that makes bespoke one off custom pieces of furniture. Made to measure stuff like fitted wardrobes, stairs, tables, dressers etc. to a high quality. go into workshops around yours and have a look at the work they do. is mostly solid timber, man made timber they use etc... Have a good look cause some cabinet makers will prefer to use mostly solid timber and make nice dovetail and mortice and tennon joints etc....

Alun

Cormie, have you tried Kingfisher Crafts in Ashford at all? They make custom bespoke furniture, and from what I've seen, some damn fine stuff too. Give Brian Walsh a call on 0404-40504. He already has an assistant, but you never know. I may be popping down there myself today to pick up some turning timber, so if I remember I'll try and ask him if he's interested.

EDIT: I'm afraid he's not interested in taking anyone on right now. There was a place in Newcastle he mentioned whose name I forget ... Beech-something.

As for woodturning as a "career", I don't think you'll get rich very quick. About the only way would be if you were to concentrate on the more "architectural" side of things, staircase balustrades etc, although most of these are made industrially using copy-lathes these days, and you'd only be getting one-offs that would be impractical to do that way. There is a handfull of professional turners out there (mostly in the US) who can make a decent living out of either very expensive one-offs or the more-or-less industrial production of rather unremarkable ash bowls to sell to places like the Kilkenny shop and the like, but I'm not sure that'd be very satisfying. At a hobby level, woodturning seems to consume more cash than it generates on average, at least for me, that is!

Another option that you might consider is antiques restoration. My grandfather did that for years and made a good living from it. There's not a lot of original construction involved. Mainly small repairs, matching grain and colour, cleaning and repolishing, but it might be worth a try?

cormie

Hi there,
Thanks for all the feedback. I actually gave Brian a ring before I noticed your edit. I had a chat and he did say that the kind of work he does is very scarce and the closest to it was that place in Newcastle, Castlebrook Crafts (Where did you get Beech from? haha). His trainee is actually fully qualified now, and he is qualified in the trade of Cabinet Making with FAS.

I asked if by getting qualified in an area like cabinet making could lead to an area like that and he said it would give a good starting mark and he also pointed out the fact he started his time fitting kitchens.

Castlebrook were the only others he is aware of. He said a good place to go to discover others would be an exhibition in the RDS or something similar where I could discover people who work in little alleyway work shops. That is the kind of thing I want.

What would you all suggest I do? Go ahead with anyone I can get with in terms of cabinet making and keep searching whilst with them for someone else? How about a portfolio course for Letterfráck? I don't have allot of examples of my work unfortunately.

Thanks again, and thanks for asking him Alun!

Alun

Glad I could be of some assistance Cormie. My memory isn't what it was, so I don't know where I got that Beech-something from ... when you're as ancient as me ...

Just another thought ... would you consider travelling outside Ireland? I'm sure there would be many more opportunities for this kind of thing in the UK, say. Once you were qualified, you could move back here and set up for yourself.

cormie

I don't think apprentice rates would keep me sheltered abroad. But yes, I would like to move around, then again, I'd like to have a routine of knowing where I'm going to be for the next while.

Is it just a case of sending search parties out to every town to the back alleys or do you reckon I wont have much luck finding anyone in Ireland?

bitbuilder

I would sugest looking on the Craft Council of Ireland website:

CCOI

The link will bring you to a search for all furniture makers linked with them, but there is also a section for wood in general which brings up woodturners and carvers as well. The only requirement for being listed on the site is that you sell some of your work, so you might not find all that many "full time" people on there, but it probably beat walking up and down back alleys as a starting point! I think you can search by county as well which might help as well.

I only know of one person in Ireland wood carving full time, but he suplements his income by giving training courses as well - and he started out doing basic joinery, Ben russel down near bantry - in my book he has the dream life!

Good luck with the search
Les

cormie

I rang Ben, that is what I want!! He does 3 day course which I think I'll have a go of:) Thanks allot!

I'll give that site a look. I think I should just get with a cabinet maker and branch out once qualified. But I want to go to LetterFráck too!! Decisions decisions!

bitbuilder

You won't regret it! I've done 2 courses with Ben, and am considering going again - though I might try to find a woodturning course next.

Glad I could be of help, best of luck with it.

cormie

I tried that website above.. it made matters more confusing, just seeing some of the woodturning work, now I'm wondering should I be doing that instead? I like to work on small pieces and I could incorporate carving into that aswell.

Do you think if I went at that full time a living could be made from it? I'm going to give a few turners a ring anyway. What are your views? BitBuilder, what is it you actually do? Do you just attend these courses for a hobby or are you a woodsman by trade?

bitbuilder

I have got another "day" job, but I am moving towords wood as my primary source of income. Plan is to get house paid off over the next 5 years then pack in the computer stuff completly. I do however make stuff and sell it, bith carving and woodturning, and I did a stint of 6 months making and fitting built in furniture 18 months ago when I fancied a break from computing and to see how I got on and if I wanted to do it full time.

My experience is that there is alot of people in the "craft" world selling stuff at prices that make me question how they make a living, I suspect that alot of craft workers do it to suplement the dole - which means that to all intents and purposes they are able to sell stuff for "pocket money" rather than actually have to run their production as a fully fledged business, with tax, bills, insurance and all that goes along with it!

for an example of wood turning as a profession try this site:
Marketing wood turning

There are a huge number of options available to you, I would think that you might be best looking to get on an apprentiship course with a cabinet maker as a starting point (preferably one associated with FAS) this should give you an intro to various disiplines within wood working as a full time profession and see how you go from there, I would be skeptical of starting out down a narrow path such as carving or turning if you intend to make a career out of it, you would need to become very well known (which takes time) before you could make a decent living out of it - That is just my opinion, I am by no means trying to put you off, in fact I belive that this country could beneft from a massive increase in quality craftsmen!

Whatever you choose all the best with it - PM me if you want more info on any of this.

cormie

Hi,
Thanks again for the feedback.

It just so happened that a College of Further Education in Bray (where I live) was having an open day the day after I rang them, they do a furniture design course. I went down anyway and it seems to be what I'm looking for, they do carving, turning and other areas too which I'd like to get to know. The module even includes stained glass, not much, but it could be good to incorporate it into some pieces. It seems good anyway and from what I've read, I think it would suit me more than letter***** as letter***** seems to be just furniture, tables, chairs etc, where as this is making bowls, lamps and all kinds of things that are more down my street. The only problem is the course is full, but I'm first on the waiting list and he is hopeful that there will be at least one cancellation. So fingers crossed! What do you all think of this option?