ReMax

Dellgirl

I need a bit of advice and some opinions please.
Remax are offering the lowest %age comission on selling property but does this come as a poorer service? Every thing about them seems to do exactly what Sherrys or DNG do - so why the big difference between prices? I dont see why I should pay Sherrys more if i get the same service from Remax.
Advice appreciated, esp from people who have used them or one of the others.
thanks!

Rubens

Got quotes off Remax and DNG before for a house I was selling - same scenario as you insofar that the % were different (Remax lower).

The difference I did note was that DNG had a higher asking price for the house(5k more) so maybe they demand better prices???

Anyway thats my actual experience of it - no doubt a couple of people will post here how completely wrong I am because they know everything about property and I don't (sarcasm)

RJ

MorningStar

Blingarella wrote:

I need a bit of advice and some opinions please.
Remax are offering the lowest %age comission on selling property but does this come as a poorer service?

The REmax model is based on speed. You will get a poor service if you want the best price and are not bothered by time. If you want a quick sale for less money it's a good service. It really depends on how the properties sell in your area. If they sell quickly with other agents I'd skip them.
In saying that many are really independent agents with some good and some bad. It really depends on who you trust. Some agencies seem to go for a lower asking price but want more while others go for a high asking price and will come down.

mjones

Hi,

I am trying to buy a house in Kerry at the moment so I can only speak as a buyer but I prefer Remax. We have been trying to negotiate a purchase of a property in North Kerry with Sherry Fitz and its has been a nightmare :mad: . They do not return calls they do not bother to let us know what is happening and most of all they are 9 times out of 10 off hand on the phone. Yesterday my husband and I rang at the same time to see what would happen, one person said he was out of the office the other he was on the phone ... they can't even get their stories straight!

Remax however are much more approachable and easier to call they are always ready to listen and I trust them a lot more than Sherry Fitz who are trying to get us to pay an extra 15,000 euro for a house that we know is on the market with another agent for much less. :rolleyes:

Good luck with your house sale - if you are selling in Kerry/Limerick let me know I might be interested

ck1

The service you get will generally depend on the individual agent. Remax agents are generally self employed. What you should consider when negotiating a price with them is the actual sale price of your house. As prices have risen over the years here, effectively both estate agents and solicitors who charge their fees on a percentage of the purchase or sale price have given themselves an indirect payrise. A house five years ago would sell for €150k charging an estate agents fee of say 2% gives them €3000 plus VAT at 21% where that house would sell now for say €250k then their fee would be €5000 plus VAT @ 21%. The best way to pick an estate agent is from recommendation from people you know who have used them. Remember the same is for Solicitors, it is not as if they have to do extra work, in the case of estate agents now they really have to do less work as the property market is so boyant.

Thomond Pk

The above advise is very good and I'd like to add that the most important thing is the net proceeds of the disposal. You only get one shot at selling a house and if you have to call ten agents to find the most appropriate one do it.

I almost sold this place in 1998 and between the top pre-sale valuation there was a sliding scale to 60% of that estimate. Eventually I nearly went I a colleague of a freind who explained it perfectly to me; " Not only will some agents promise what they can't deliver or others that will sell too quickly to get a fast commision the agent involved has to see the value in the house or in my case see the value in the house and have the challenge of the client - agent relationship"

The type of house involved is the most important criteria; if a number of comparable properties have sold locally recently and values are known I would lean towards the cheaper end of the agent scale. If the property has any unique characteristics or there is no directly comparable evidence then go for a www.myhome.ie agent such as DNG or Sherry Fitz

Personally I am very sceptical of Re-max as many of their agents have no formal training in the legal or structural issues that potential purchasers want professional advice on and unless your house is identical to a few that have sold recently I would pay the extra 0.5% to get an agent that has gone to the trouble of acquiring formal qualifications.

Remember that 98.5% 0f 205,000 is more than 99% of 202,500

is_that_so

I was under the impression that Remax was an umbrella of real auctioneers, in the same way that Musgraves created the Centra and Supervalu brands.
IMO I think service very much depends on the agent. Two properties beside me have failed to move on account of the price being too high and neither agents were Remax. One was on the market for over four months and a current property has been on market for three months.

Thomond Pk

No the agents pay remax for use of the franchise as opposed to them being salaried, whilst some are MIAVI qualified I have heard of some that are not and dealt with others who really hadn't a notion; particularly on the commercial side.

My own preference in the Dublin region are IAVI qualified firms that aren't too big but have been around a while or hot shots from the larger firms that have set up recently after say 10 years with one or more of the larger agencies. Both of these groups will do deals and know the areas well enough to identify limitations on value and what times of year to release onto the market etc.

Moonbeam

I have viewed alot of houses with Remax and they have always been friendly efficent on time and helpfuil.
The same can not be said for the majority of the rest of them

MorningStar

Moonbeam wrote:

I have viewed alot of houses with Remax and they have always been friendly efficent on time and helpfuil.
The same can not be said for the majority of the rest of them

That's you buying! He is selling. What's good for you doesn't mean anything if it's bad to him. A quick efficient sale for the sellers is fine if they are willing to not get the max price.
Remax training from my understanding is about quick sales to max commision for the agent from what I have read. THey may be independents using a franchise but so is McDonalds and they train them how to operate and most times there is some QC checks. Remax don't want their brand being damaged. Their name represent quick sales in the US.

Dellgirl

thanks guys! Very helpful indeed.
Just one more opinion id like if that's OK. I think the likes of Sherry's come in and quote really high prices that they think the property can achieve just to get the property. Once they are the agent they don't seem adverse to lowering the price as they go along. I think they come in all guns blazing and go downhill from there. Re max on the other hand quote realistic prices and as they have a much lower commission they have to turn over the properties quickly to level up the earnings?
Am I right or completely off the mark?

Thomond Pk

The market moves seasonaly, agents like remax will tell you what you are likely to get on the basis of a quick sale and the values quoted are generally based upon prices acheived early in that season or from the last season. The bigger agencies will through better research and intuitive skills based on experience give a value based upon a three to six month time frame for disposal.

The questions I would ask of all agents would be price for 1> quick sale, 2> market rising and if the market doesn't rise what advertising outlay will I need to get the property noticed outside the immediate district again?

I would also ask what promotional strategy they have, what retained buyers they have on their books that may be interested, what this package will cost and what level of acheivement they have acheived in a month, 2 months, 3 months and how many properties took over 6 months to sell or were withdrawn after 6 months.

It is prudent to agree a timescale for the disposal which gives the agency either 3 months or 6 months to get the sale or the instruction ends.

I would balance the level of commission with the promotional budget and the timescale of the instruction, what may be a small commission may either cost more with advertising or acheive a lower price due to a lack of or potential innappropriate nature of it.

0.5% is the difference which comes to 500 per 100,000 it is not a lot to pay for years of experience and failure to do so could cost 1000's in the net disposal proceeds. I would return to any agent who quoted in excess of 1.5% and attempt to secure that rate. If the fee is lower than that you are unlikely to be given the time required, it is worth remembering that the Remax agent must pay a proportion to the franchise holder and they in turn to remax inc.

I would not want an agent who had no formal education in legal, taxation and planning matters selling my house, as punctual and charming as they may be there is no substitute for knowing the answers to the questions.

babaduck

I work as a mystery shopper & recently had my house valued by 3 different auctioneers to evaluate their service.

Local Joe was smug, way out on his estimate (too high for the market value) and just got on my wick

Remax were excellent - very on the ball - could back up all their claims of success with hard facts, very proactive and I was able to negotiate a flat fee for the work

Sherry Fitz. In general, I'm not a fan. The agent was nice enough but based on their local rep, their high fees and the feeling that you're just another number, I would steer clear. Friends of mine who used them lived to regret it (and one of them is an auctioneer herself!!!). Also a house across from me which was placed with them, and the auctioneer mentioned to me that it was agreed & ready to exchange, fell through. The owners were peed off with SF to such an extent that they went to Remax.

Always get 3 quotes & make an informed decision with any transaction. If you agree to pay an auctioneer or solicitor a % fee, rather than a flat fee, beware. I have a friend who was charged €7500 for selling a house (they bought from new) and buying a new house. They were robbed but it was their own fault because they "didn't like to negotiate" on the fee. Dumb eejits!

rooferPete

Hi,

I had experience with one of the big two metioned above (not Remax), I was told in a very abrupt manner by the agent they were not willing to enter into any further negotiations on the property despite their "For Sale" board being still up on the property.

Three weeks later the deposit still wasn't paid on the property, my reason for approaching them was I was entering into a partnership with the owner of the property next door and the two combined would have meant we had a very viable development site.

The property sold eventually but they left £50,000.00 (disclosed) on the table, of course it wasn't their money but the vendors who in my opinion lost a lot of money due to either corruption or laziness.

Give me the small agent any day at least they are willing to work on the negotiations.

Regards,

Peter.

Dellgirl

Once again, thank you for all your help. I think a Remax agent will be the way to go. They seem far more eager than the agents who have the comfort of belonging to a big firm.
Thomond Pk - are you an agent or something to do with the business?
Babaduck....what a job!! Where do I apply?!
RooferPete - what do you mean they left 50,000 on the table?

ck1

Just thought I would let you know of my personal experience on selling a house in City Centre Dublin last year. I arranged for four agents to view the property, it was my mothers house, they had no idea what I did for a living (I work in tax and finance and have do for a long time) so I just let them waffle. After they finished talking I asked them a few questios and many of them tripped themselves up. They were giving the speil as they all want city centre property on their books. We eventually went with Lisneys at St Stephens Green and could not fault them is any regards. I negociated a fee of 1.25% with them and with the solicitors I negociated a fixed fee.

My mother was moving and as the house was a family home for more than 50 years originally belonging to my grandmother, my mother asked the question as to whether she was a first time buyer. Three of them insisted that she was not and only Lisneys said that they were not sure and she should speak to her solicitor. I had already confirmed to my mother that she was, one estate agent said to my mother when she said that she had heard that she was "well that silly as you have a house to sell, of course you are a second time buyer" she had explained the circumstances as to how she owned the house. By the way, even the solicitor insisted that she was a second time buyer. I had to copy the actual leglisation to him before he admitted he was wrong.

Thomond Pk

CK1 That sounds about right and interesting that your version backs up an actual completed transaction as opposed to enquiries where no result exists. All agencies will negotiate on fees for the type of property they have a niche market for; I incidently went to Lisney in 1998 on this place and they came up with the lowest valuation and I respected the agent for that as she obviously wasn't that interested and didn't try and speil me just to get the deal.

B,

I'm not an agent I work as a planner and all too often see the results of unqualified actions.

Dellgirl

I'm not an agent I work as a planner and all too often see the results of unqualified actions

I knew you knew what you were talking about!

Anyone seen the article in the times? Interesting. i dont know how to post links so if someone could oblige? I cant believe Sherrys were €18 million off the mark on a property. How wrong can you be?! Ill be very happy to see some PROPER guide prices coming in.

ck1

Thomond Pk - I agree, in my field I often see the results of advice given by un qualified persons which often has a massive impact financially!!!

MorningStar

ck1 wrote:

My mother was moving and as the house was a family home for more than 50 years originally belonging to my grandmother, my mother asked the question as to whether she was a first time buyer. .

In fairness you don't ask a brick layer the tensile strength of the wall. They shouldn't have given any answer but if you were to believe them or something said here really would be a bit silly.

Blingarella wrote:

I cant believe Sherrys were €18 million off the mark on a property. How wrong can you be?! Ill be very happy to see some PROPER guide prices coming in.

In fairness auction prices can go nuts and bring up lots of surprises. THere is a problem but the examples given are a bit biased. In the US some states solves the problem by having a law that means the purchase price of property has to be registerd so people can se what is actually happening in the market. Here you have to trust the estate agents or the asking price.

Dellgirl

Here you have to trust the estate agents or the asking price

Neither, as it happens. And theres going nuts and theres GOING NUTS!!!! I mean, c'mon - €18 million - 3 or even 6 maybe, just maybe....but 18 - you've got to be kidding me.

homeOwner

I cant get to a paper, can someone post the details of that guide price story from the Times....where was the house, how much did it sell for in the end, what was the guide?

I cant believe they were off by 18mil. That seems outrageous, unless two people just really wanted it badly and the bidding went all out of control.

Victor

It went for something like €46m, but it had a few acres attached.

MorningStar wrote:

In fairness you don't ask a brick layer the tensile strength of the wall.

Of course not, but just by looking at it he'll tell you the compressive strength*, the usual denfing factor for a wall.

Compressive strength is indicated by block colour.

MorningStar

Blingarella wrote:

Neither, as it happens. And theres going nuts and theres GOING NUTS!!!! I mean, c'mon - €18 million - 3 or even 6 maybe, just maybe....but 18 - you've got to be kidding me.

Yes there is but how many stories have you heard about other auction items that aren't houses selling for more than the guide? Didn't a Irish turf bucket go for many times the guide? Property can be very diffent but when you are talking about certain development potential an extra 18million can jbe worth it. I say a grade 1 0r 2 listed church on the southside go for 5 or 6 times the asking price. Maddness as it was going to cost unbelivebale money to repair and everything was going to take so much time and effort. The guide was reasonable the people bidding weren't.
How many auctions have you been to?

Dellgirl

Ive been to a few but not at that end of the market. I'll wait till I'm rich and have a few more million to throw around! Ive seen people go a bit bonkers with a couple of thousand but never with a load of millions.
Im not in the world where people have millions to bandy about. What would happen to the estate agent who guide priced it? Would they have gotten a bolloking for being so far out or would they have been lauded for achieving a topper of a price?

I cant get to a paper, can someone post the details of that guide price story from the Times....where was the house, how much did it sell for in the end, what was the guide?

i dont know how to post a link - sorry.

MorningStar

Victor wrote:

It went for something like €46m, but it had a few acres attached.

Of course not, but just by looking at it he'll tell you the compressive strength*, the usual denfing factor for a wall.

Compressive strength is indicated by block colour.

After studying engineer I can tell you the tensile stregth of a wall is pretty important. A brick layer does not know any of the figures he knows how to build a wall and may know from experience what looks right but that's it. My point is you ask a specific question to a person who is not qualified they probably don't know the answer and shouldn't be trusted.

MorningStar

Blingarella wrote:

Ive been to a few but not at that end of the market.


i dont know how to post a link - sorry.

But that is the end of the market that they are making mistakes with prices really. The problem is the estate agents don't really see all the development potential. Many of the estate agents will tell you that they price 10-15% below the expected price in the current market. So if you awant to spend €350k look at property for €300k-€320k not at €350k-€400k as many do and then get disappointed and frustrated. It really is a lack of knowledge that makes people assume the absolute worst of agents. I am by no means a fan but they are unfairly viewed on some issues.

to post the link just cut and paste the address from the website! or cut and paste the whole article

Dellgirl

Im not disagreeing here...Im asking advice, which is much appreciated when given. Im not an on-line subscriber to the paper.....btu I did learn how to post a link!!

Right so...who wants to buy a house?!

lomb

it is normal practice to set the miniumum acceptable reserve price of the vendor 15 % OVER the guide price. that alone is totally unethical. its no wonder estate agents are seen as schisters, because they are...

Thomond Pk

I find that agents Do set the guide price artificially low when advertising in the National media to attract interest from a wider audience. This practice is not ethical but everyone is fully aware of it and virtually every potential purchaser will ask the agent what they will feel it will sell for. Early in the sales period which is generally three to four weeks they will not budge from this figure. However in the final week it is advisable if you are considering a bid to ask again telling them that you are going to the trouble of having a survey done and that the survey costs money.

While there will be crazy individual results up and down at auctions there is no real excuse for an agent to be too much more than 5-7% out from the final figure quoted. There will how ever be some bizare results although a lot of this can be put down to purchasers seeing unrealistic development potential.

An over eager agent who knows nothing about the legal, taxation and planning side may factor in too much development value go in at 1.5m and not attract any interest, in the above case obviously two people lost it at the auction which is what every vendor wants but doesn't happen very often. If you attend an auction it is very easy to see from peoples behaviour if they have paid too much or not by their reaction. If anyone ever has an afternoon off going to auctions can be a very educational afternoon.

rooferPete

Hi Blingarella,

What I mean by leaving £50,000.00 on the table is my offer was £50,000.00 higher than the actual selling price.

So they left me with all the money I was willing to spend which was £50,000.00 more than the vendor officially received for the property.

The reason the amount available was disclosed to the agent is I wanted that property because the neighbouring property was already safe under our potential partnerships control.

Regards,

Peter.

lomb

lomb wrote:

it is normal practice to set the miniumum acceptable reserve price of the vendor 15 % OVER the guide price. that alone is totally unethical. its no wonder estate agents are seen as schisters, because they are...

can i say that if a doctor or dentist did that type of thing theyd b struck off, crazy carryon and their certifying/ regulatory body APPROVE of setting guides up to 15% less than the vendor will accept, truely insane.

Thomond Pk

lomb wrote:

guides

That is exactly what it is a guide, it is similar to going to the dentist where the dentist watches you speak with your mouth open but can't quote an exact price for cleaning all your teeth.

The point I made above is that prior to having a survey done ask hard questions of the agent; if at that point you are obviously messed around make a formal complaint to the IAVI. With Remax there is no independent body to complain to just a franchise management structure that works on a pyramid arrangement making money from the complainee.

MorningStar

Thomond Pk wrote:

I find that agents Do set the guide price artificially low when advertising in the National media to attract interest from a wider audience. This practice is not ethical but everyone is fully aware of it and virtually every potential purchaser will ask the agent what they will feel it will sell for.

Except real estate agents have stated in national media that the guide price is based on 10-15% below expecting sale price. Mentioned on the radio several times today alone. It is up to the consumer to be informed but the market should be more transparent. The idea that life is fair by principle is a little nieve. A self regulating body won't stop the current trend. By the time the government react it will be too late

lomb

SUNDAY independant today...
Just 'guide prices' by another name

SHANE ROSS

AUCTIONEERS are reeling from the finding of the report on their shenanigans. They are bravely claiming to "welcome" it. But auctioneers find it hard to recognise the truth. The report's message - that they should no longer be allowed to regulate themselves - is a damning indictment of their history.

"Call in the independent outsiders," is the thrust of the report. These cowboys are unfit to run their own show. The war has been lost. But the battles are only beginning. A rearguard action is being fought over guide prices.

A fudge has already been plotted. The commission to reform the whole dodgy business - which incredibly included three auctioneers - is proposing a successor to guide prices, to be known as "advised minimum values".

Enter guide prices under another name.

The report says only one price should be published. This will be "the auctioneer's true opinion of value at the commencement of the marketing campaign, as given in writing by auctioneer to seller on an obligatory basis". Today, they call these little fantasies "guide prices". Tomorrow they will be called "advised minimum values".

The abuse will live on.

When the auctioneers undervalue a property, as they always do, there will still be no redress. The first-time buyer will be led up the garden path of the property, ambushed, and stuffed again. The leaked report will not address some of the worst abuses, like the way the agents operate sealed bids or their favourite deception - pretending booking deposits have legal standing.

Nor will the misery caused by forcing buyers to pay for a multitude of surveyors' fees be ended. The board of the new regulator will be picked by Minister McDowell, a time-honoured means of imposing political control. Will industry insiders be replaced by party patsies?

The problem - auctioneers policing auctioneers - has been identified.

Do not be too hopeful for any remedies.

Thomond Pk

83 Anglesea Rd is a disgrace guess who the owner is?

lomb

why is 83 angelsea road a disgrace, im sure its a nice period house worth 10 million euro. sure there are LOADS of people in ireland with that for a house. that woman who won 100 million will only be the known 72nd known richest person and probably be the 200 or 300th in reality.

an auctioneers house is it or a property developer?

TwoShedsJackson

I have experience of one Remax agent who came to value our house which we are currently selling. He spent ten minutes in the place, didn't even set foot in the back garden (one of the selling points as it's sunny and mature), and generally gave an impression of not wanting to hang about. His fee would have been 1.25%, as were the other two agents we saw.

He suggested we list the house (a mid-terrace 1940s council house in Crumlin) at 300,000 and we should get 317,500 for it. The agent we ended up going with spent an hour and a half with us the night he viewed it and gave us much sound advice, both on selling this place and buying our new one. He advised listing the house at 340,000.

We were sceptical as that seemed high but we went with it. Within a week we had an offer of 335,000. That then fell through. In the meantime, Remax listed a house, basically identical to ours, the next street up, for 315,000. I then get a phone call from the Remax agent saying he noted we had gone with our agents and that it was on for 340,000.

He told me that was an insane price, that no house of that type had gone for that money etc. etc. The inference was that we were stupid for not going with him. The call pissed me off but I decided ringing back or trying to track down some superior or another to complain would likely be pointless.

Then Remax listed a house, identical to ours, the next street up, at 315,000. A week later, another call from him to say that it had gone sale agreed at 352,000. No mention of how 340,000 was crazy money and were we mad or what etc. etc. He says he has under bidders on that place who want to see ours, will we ditch our agents and let him bring his clients down?

I said I'd ring him back and then didn't bother. His clients aren't blind, they can see the place is for sale :rolleyes: Also his two phone calls and general manner lead me to believe he's an underhand scumbag and I have no interest in dealing with someone like that.

So now our place is sale agreed again at 340,000 and the sale on the Remax place fell through when the buyer realised he was paying daft money.

That's my experience with this particular Remax agent, naturally your mileage may vary, but from what I've heard in general, don't use them if you want the best possible price for your place - they're on commission so all they're interested in is getting that Sale Agreed sign up and the booking deposit in as fast as possible.

lomb

Thomond Pk wrote:

83 Anglesea Rd is a disgrace guess who the owner is?

Trinity Senator Shane Ross, whose day job is business editor of the Sunday Indo. In the interests of full disclosure, here's Sen Ross's entry: Shares: Arcon, Bank of Ireland, Scottish Value Trust (investment trust). Directorships: non-executive chairman of Close FTSE 100 Income and Growth Fund; also of Saltire Fund plc (Edinburgh); deputy chairman of Scottish Value Trust; non-executive director of ING Barings New Russia Fund (London); Invesco AsianetFund; BaringHedge Select Fund (Cayman Islands) ; Haussman Fund (Dublin). The senator also owns 83 Anglesea Road, Dubl in 4, which is rented out. Any other business Edited by Pat Leahy

Victor

Then maybe ReMax are for quick sales at less than maximum prices. That probably suits some people.

is_that_so

lomb wrote:

Trinity Senator Shane Ross, whose day job is business editor of the Sunday Indo. In the interests of full disclosure, here's Sen Ross's entry: Shares: Arcon, Bank of Ireland, Scottish Value Trust (investment trust). Directorships: non-executive chairman of Close FTSE 100 Income and Growth Fund; also of Saltire Fund plc (Edinburgh); deputy chairman of Scottish Value Trust; non-executive director of ING Barings New Russia Fund (London); Invesco AsianetFund; BaringHedge Select Fund (Cayman Islands) ; Haussman Fund (Dublin). The senator also owns 83 Anglesea Road, Dubl in 4, which is rented out. Any other business Edited by Pat Leahy

He has his moments but is mostly self-promoting.

banshcat

I have had nothing but bad experiences with ReMax in North Dublin as I have tried to purchase a place recently. They are just terrible! Very unprofessional. Stick to Sherry Fitz.

Dellgirl

Banshcat...you cant tell half a story! What happened? Why were they so bad?