Hand for Nicky

Hectorjelly

Kes 3451863-14777 Holdem No Limit $0.50/$1
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Hand Start.
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Seat 1 : Rioja has $132.01
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Seat 2 : hectorjelly has $97.50
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Seat 3 : XXX has $96
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Seat 4 : lucky-num-9 has $143.91
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Seat 5 : minkolle has $112
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Seat 6 : cya has $21.75
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : cya is the dealer.
[Jul 25 00:16:03] : Rioja posted small blind.
[Jul 25 00:16:04] : hectorjelly posted big blind.
[Jul 25 00:16:04] : Game [14777] started with 6 players.
[Jul 25 00:16:04] : Dealing Hole Cards.
[Jul 25 00:16:04] : Seat 2 : hectorjelly has 4s Ts
[Jul 25 00:16:06] : XXX called $1
[Jul 25 00:16:08] : lucky-num-9 folded.
[Jul 25 00:16:08] : minkolle folded.
[Jul 25 00:16:09] : cya folded.
[Jul 25 00:16:11] : Rioja folded.
[Jul 25 00:16:13] : hectorjelly checked.
[Jul 25 00:16:14] : Dealing flop.
[Jul 25 00:16:14] : Board cards [2s Qc Ks]
[Jul 25 00:16:17] : hectorjelly bet $3
[Jul 25 00:16:18] : XXX called $3
[Jul 25 00:16:19] : Dealing turn.
[Jul 25 00:16:19] : Board cards [2s Qc Ks 3h]
[Jul 25 00:16:20] : hectorjelly checked.
[Jul 25 00:16:21] : XXX checked.
[Jul 25 00:16:22] : Dealing river.
[Jul 25 00:16:22] : Board cards [2s Qc Ks 3h As]
[Jul 25 00:16:26] : hectorjelly bet $6
[Jul 25 00:16:37] : XXX called $6 and raised $86 and is All-in

What do I do now! I have the the third nut flush. Just sat down so no reads on the table.

NickyOD

AH FFS! Put my puss suit on and fold I suppose. :mad: I've given up trying to put these b*****ds on a hand. :rolleyes:

ocallagh

lads, i think u should try slightly higher limits. from what i read on boards, you are more than prepared for 1-2NL or 2-4NL. i rarely play cash games, but when i do i sit down with 300 or so in a 2-4NL and you never see that sort of play.. ie: "all in on river with or without the nuts"..

NickyOD

I'll be moving up to 1/2 soon enough. I'm just a lot more cautious with my BR than most. I'm also undecided as to whether moving up in stakes in order to avoid bad/eratic players is more or less profitable.

Hectorjelly

I played 24 & 36 all of last year, and played quite a bit of 5 10 at the beginning of this year. To be honest I think I could beat any good nl game up to 25 - 50. At the moment I dont have the bank roll for a sustained bad run at 24, I also havent played a cash game in three months so need practice (Part of me keeps wanting to get all in with AK.) so am grounding myself at 50 1. If I was still working I would be playing higer, but I have to be ultra cautious with my Bankroll.

Also there are many reasons to move up but moving up so you can play better players is not one of them.

The massive overbet on the river can be a very good play, if you use the tactic well. Probably the most successfull nl internet player uses it all the time, Prahlad Friedman. To use it well you have to be prepared to do it with stone cold bluffs, the nuts, and 1 pair hands as well. It means you dont have to worry about building pots so much, and can also make opponents fear coming into pots with you and make their pot control moves worthless.

bohsman

Id more than likely make a tilty call. I have a tendency not to believe overbets.

I think its a call if youre going to win 50% of the time and on that board there are 2 nut hands that beat you but he could also have TJ 45 a lower flush or trips or even 2pair

roryc

Also there are many reasons to move up but moving up so you can play better players is not one of them.

Increase 'profits', meet new players/ fish....

any others?

ocallagh

I think a challenging game stimulates the mind. It encourages you to play better poker and ultimately you do. grinding it out at .50/1 might make you a proft, but you'll play better poker at 1-2 and your game will improve as will your bankroll.

Hectorjelly

ocallagh wrote:

I think a challenging game stimulates the mind. It encourages you to play better poker and ultimately you do. grinding it out at .50/1 might make you a proft, but you'll play better poker at 1-2 and your game will improve as will your bankroll.

Thanks for the advice. I have been worried recently about improving my game but the pots get really scary and big at 1 - 2 and Im not sure id If I could cope with the sharks at that level. My recent tactic of waiting for the nuts then going all in would be sure to fail.

Daithio

What did you end up doing Hector?

Hectorjelly

Well my thinking was, at this level he is pushing with any flush, and I beat a lot of them. So I called, he had AQ for a rivered two pair. God only knows what he was thinking.

NickyOD

Hectorjelly wrote:

Thanks for the advice. I have been worried recently about improving my game but the pots get really scary and big at 1 - 2 and Im not sure id If I could cope with the sharks at that level. My recent tactic of waiting for the nuts then going all in would be sure to fail.

LMFAO! If we move up to 1/2 together at the same time we could hold eachother's hand.

ocallagh

ok- point taken! ... HJ i know you're more than capable of playing at higher limits.. i didn't mean to say you weren't.. though, i stand by what i said and i don't think i could play at 0.50/1 for too long.. it would do my brains in.. I play poker for a challenge.. nothing better than taking down a big tourny.. if I see a decent player waiting for an opponent heads up i'll sit down.. slowly extracting a couple of dollars in low limit games does not appeal to me at the moment but i'm sure i'd change my mind if i were to quit the day job.

sharkfood

ocallagh wrote:

ok- point taken! ... HJ i know you're more than capable of playing at higher limits.. i didn't mean to say you weren't.. though, i stand by what i said and i don't think i could play at 0.50/1 for too long.. it would do my brains in.. I play poker for a challenge.. nothing better than taking down a big tourny.. if I see a decent player waiting for an opponent heads up i'll sit down.. slowly extracting a couple of dollars in low limit games does not appeal to me at the moment but i'm sure i'd change my mind if i were to quit the day job.

Ocallagh,

BR Management becomes probably the most important aspect of your game when your playing for a living.

It seems silly to leave a game your beating easily to move up stakes for a more "challenging" game. Unfortunatly whilst you don't have a job to financially back you, the grind is always going to be the best option.

To the question:

In hindsight, I may of put my opponent on the spiked two pair or the straight.

However, had he have the flush your only behind to Js/Qs. So your a favourite over a wide range of hands your opponent could be holding.

Bizarre move to be coming over the top here for so much, which could mean a couple of things.

1) He has the nuts
2) He likes the river; has spiked two pair, straight or flush

Mostly unlikely that he is bluffing into the pot, so you have to give him credit for some sort of hand.

It's easy for me to say i would have put him on straight or two pair here. I don't believe you would of seen a big of raise if he was holding the nuts. More likely a play you would see at higher stakes against more aggressive and experienced players.

I would of made the call also. Nice hand

SF

NickyOD

sharkfood wrote:

I don't believe you would of seen a big of raise if he was holding the nuts.

Have you read this Hand history?

Unfortunately all in with the nuts is more common than one would hope, but in like Hector said most players play any flush like the nuts so he's going to be ahead here more than 50% of the time.

sharkfood

NickyOD wrote:

Have you read this Hand history?

Unfortunately all in with the nuts is more common than one would hope, but in like Hector said most players play any flush like the nuts so he's going to be ahead here more than 50% of the time.

Hi Nick,

My point being, HJ's opponent would have to have a strong read on him for him to raise so much on the river with the nuts. For example have him on straight or flush. If this was the case, wouldn't he try to get him out of the pot PF or 4ST? I think so, unless of course he had the nut flush draw and was playing for effective odds and to get paid off if the 3rd suit showed. I don't believe this level of thinking goes on in 90% of players minds.

So clearly his opponent had no read at all and called down with 2nd pair and top kicker to spike his two pair on the river, which he believed was the best hand.

However i could see him moving over the top here with any flush, of which HJ is infront to all but two, making him a big favourite over a wide range of hands that his opponent could have. It was a good value call.

I just couldn't of give him credit for the nuts here. Give me a totally different circumstance and i might be inclined to agree with the nut hand, but as this played out at the stakes it did. Id of called here all day long.

SF