NTL billing

Supercell

Its been suggested that NTL are entitled to charge premium rates to their customers for reserved numbers, in this case 1890 which UTVinternet uses. Standard billing for NTL customers is 1.5p per minute off peak, does this mean they can charge that rate on a 1890 number or 1800 number for example? That seems outside of what they are entitled to charge their customers. Can someone clarify this please?

Gladiator

actually 1890 doesnt seem to be a premium rates number,

Victor

As I undestand it, numbers like 1800, 1850, 1890, 1530, 1550 ... 1590 are property of Eircom (they are different from 0800, 0890, etc.).

Normally, you should be billed exactly the Eircom amount, i.e. you should never be charged for 1800, 1550 should always cost 58p per minute or whatever. It is then for the network provider (ESAT, Eircell, etc.) to sort out the bill with Eircom, Eircom then settle their bill with the call receipient.

However, as NTL have a completely separate network (they are not as dependant on ESAT, Eircell, etc. on Eircom's network), they might be charging you to connect to Eircom's network (and then on to UTV). 1.5p / min is the rate Eircom charges other operators (presumably the other operators charge Eircom a similar amount). I doubt if you can beat this rate (unless you are also paying UTV).

I suspect (but don't know) that Eircom don't own 1891 (maybe ODTR?)

BTW I love to call Banking 365 from my mobile.

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Kill, kill, kill the laser mice.

Supercell

Hi Victor, i've been doing some digging around this and am really concerned about it. From what i've read, it seams that this 1890 number is classified as "LOcall" whatever that means, but in Eircoms speak, this means charged at local rates. My biggest concern though is whether Eircom will charge me what they consider to be local rates, ie 1p per min off peak..or are NTL entitled to charge , what they consider local rates..ie 1.5p per min..50% more expensive..very concerning, on my bill..The 1891 prefix seems to much less clear, it appears to be an ideal number, ie 0.8p per min off peak. This may seem small, but for a heavy net user such as myself, it will make an appreciable difference to my phone bill. Next logical question is, who provides internet access with an 1891 number, starting to look like that may even be worth paying a suscription fee for, if reasonable.

Victor

Is your set up as follows?

Your PC -> your modem -> ntl connection -> ntl switch -> ntl broadband -> the world

or do Eircom get in on the act somewhere?

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Kill, kill, kill the laser mice.

[This message has been edited by Victor (edited 14-07-2001).]

Supercell

Its a normal dialup, ie analog modem ->phoneline (who owns it now?)->NTL->World.

Its worth having because i don't get billed for weekend use (almost,only a fiver a month).
But am concerned because i got the impression from the documentation cd that all calls made on this line are now routed through the NTL network (are NTL now leasing my phoneline from Eircom?).

The hope is that they do not have license to charge their own rates though for Eircom owned numbers, ie the 1800's 1890's 1891's etc. What do you reckon ?

Jessica

easiest way to explain this one :

eircom customer calling london - bt

dial from your house go through eircom - eircom route you to eircom exchange in england which will route you to a bt exchange in liverpool which will then pass you to the nearest exchange in london and then to your destination!

do you see where i am coming from ... any time you make call you are on any number of networks to make that call > depending on where you are ringing !

not even eircom can have lines everywhere!!
exchanges talk to each other ....... i.e eircom talks to bt - etc bt talk to ntl !

u see where i am coming from !

as for charges .. don't know alot about that .... but esat are still using eircom lines - as they do not physically go out and install anything in to your house!! only a box - mini exchange that will send you on the right way .. but it is still an eircom line ! you are still paying line rental to eircom - don't know if esat pay this for you with your monthly charges!
not too sure !!

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Jessica

Gladiator

Esat will include the price in a bill,

now what is this box, i didnt get a box with ntl

Jessica

u don't .. ntl do it automatically for you !

where as esat will install a small box about the size of a box of ciggs in to the house just by the phone extension box!

ntl don't - ntl = less hassle !! ahem !

no comment !

Victor

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Gladiator:
Esat will include the price in a bill,

now what is this box, i didnt get a box with ntl</font>

Gladiator, all the box does, is tell the eircom exchange to connect all your calls to Esat and bill Esat instead of you. It also tells the Esat exchange who you are (it will be able to do caller ID anyway).

ntl appear to use software ID instead of hardware ID.

Longfield are you getting any bill from eircom now?

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Kill, kill, kill the laser mice.

Connor112

NTL can do what they wish when it comes to call charges. They can also block your calls to particular numbers. As Meteor do. Try calling a home country direct number on Meteor (eg 1-800 55 00 34). Or any 1800 number from many payphones. Impossible. Consider yourself lucky to have an internet connection for the next 24 hours. Enjoy it while it lasts, even if it only works at 2,400 bps - which apparently is all you are entitled to under the regulations in this third world country.

Connor

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Longfield:
Its been suggested that NTL are entitled to charge premium rates to their customers for reserved numbers, in this case 1890 which UTVinternet uses. Standard billing for NTL customers is 1.5p per minute off peak, does this mean they can charge that rate on a 1890 number or 1800 number for example? That seems outside of what they are entitled to charge their customers. Can someone clarify this please? </font>

Connor112

No part of the numbering space is the property of eircom. Numbering space is a national asset, controlled by www.odtr.ie. One can receive 1800 and 15nx service from any OLO.

There are no numbers beginning with 0800 or 0890

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Victor:
As I undestand it, numbers like 1800, 1850, 1890, 1530, 1550 ... 1590 are property of Eircom (they are different from 0800, 0890, etc.).

Normally, you should be billed exactly the Eircom amount, i.e. you should never be charged for 1800, 1550 should always cost 58p per minute or whatever. It is then for the network provider (ESAT, Eircell, etc.) to sort out the bill with Eircom, Eircom then settle their bill with the call receipient.

However, as NTL have a completely separate network (they are not as dependant on ESAT, Eircell, etc. on Eircom's network), they might be charging you to connect to Eircom's network (and then on to UTV). 1.5p / min is the rate Eircom charges other operators (presumably the other operators charge Eircom a similar amount). I doubt if you can beat this rate (unless you are also paying UTV).

I suspect (but don't know) that Eircom don't own 1891 (maybe ODTR?)

BTW I love to call Banking 365 from my mobile.


</font>

Gladiator

yep you still get an eircom bill for line rental,

Supercell

Yep got the answer to what i was looking for. IE, NTL bill me for all numbers apart from, 1800 and 1891...I still get a bill for line rental from Eircom and 1891 numbers (which my ancient gofree username and password still works on). So its Indigo weekdays and NTL weekends for me now.
Thanks for all the replies

Gladiator

so 1891 number show up on the eircum bill and not the ntl one,

excellent