occupancy clause

Eve1

Hi,
We were granted permission to build our house but it has an occupancy clause attached. We are appealing the occupancy clause on the grounds that it wasn't in the outline. We are dying to get started but the question is though, is it possible to start clearing the site prior to the decion by the appeals board.
thanks,
Eve1

rooferPete

Hi Eve 1,

Is the clause part of a local needs planning permission ? I understand these can be difficult to enforce.

For example if you build the house but forget to repay the mortgage then the clause would prevent the house being repossesed by the lender.

I think very few banks would lend on a property that really is not the security on the borrowing because they can't sell the property to secure their money.

I think this is one of the "Grey Areas" regarding Local Needs permissions, if I were you I would get the best legal advice possible from both a Solicitor and Architect.

There may be a chance that appealing the clause could result in the permission being withdrawn if it was granted on a local needs basis.

I would expect that if you start the building it would be reasonable for the local authority to take that as acceptance of the conditions under which the permission was granted.

I could be miles of on all of the above, I may even have misunderstood the question, the best advice could be from the advisors you have working for you.

.

lomb

rooferPete wrote:

Hi Eve 1,

Is the clause part of a local needs planning permission ? I understand these can be difficult to enforce.

For example if you build the house but forget to repay the mortgage then the clause would prevent the house being repossesed by the lender.

I think very few banks would lend on a property that really is not the security on the borrowing because they can't sell the property to secure their money.

I think this is one of the "Grey Areas" regarding Local Needs permissions, if I were you I would get the best legal advice possible from both a Solicitor and Architect.

There may be a chance that appealing the clause could result in the permission being withdrawn if it was granted on a local needs basis.

I would expect that if you start the building it would be reasonable for the local authority to take that as acceptance of the conditions under which the permission was granted.

I could be miles of on all of the above, I may even have misunderstood the question, the best advice could be from the advisors you have working for you.

.

nah rooferpete, theres an exemption for mortgage holders they can indeed sell it and use it as collateral for a loan.

other than that they cant stop u renting it, so one way or another u can get a return on it. where is the site?
as rooferpete says if u appeal it u may lose all planning?u would have to talk to planning lawyers which means £££

Wobs

Occupancy clauses are fairly standard with all permissions. They are to try and enforce the whole local needs issue as Pete has pointed out. But at the end of the day if you want to or HAVE to sell your house for whatever reason, the clause is hard to enforce.

Also if the time comes that you do have to sell, you can apply to the local authority to have it changed stating your legitimate reasons.

At the end of the day they are only to stop people making a quick few yo yo's.

MorningStar

Wobs wrote:

At the end of the day they are only to stop people making a quick few yo yo's.

I think we can say it is a little more complex than that. I don't want the whole country to be taken over with houses do you? I can see at an individual case how it is nice to build a house and make money but as a whole I think there needs to be better regulations and planning.

Eve, why does the occupancy clause bother you?

Eve1

MorningStar wrote:

I think we can say it is a little more complex than that. I don't want the whole country to be taken over with houses do you? I can see at an individual case how it is nice to build a house and make money but as a whole I think there needs to be better regulations and planning.

Eve, why does the occupancy clause bother you?

I don't mind the fact that there is an occupancy clause, its the fact that it is ten years that bothers me. I don't know where my job will take me in the next ten years.The clause isn't related to local housing needs it is just states that the first occupier must live there for ten years, we have to sign with our solicitor but there is a get out clause for the banks. I never knew if we appealed it that they could overturn the entire grant of planning. Must look into that one asap.
Eve

Macy

What did you say in your planning application, and is it family land? In our application we basically had to give all out ties to the area, show we were committed to the community etc etc. If you did the same, I think you'd find it very hard to argue against the clause.

However, I know a friends solicitor was keen to challenge it when it was on their permission, saying it could be beaten. Whether it would be worth the hassle is a different matter - I mean you could spend 5 years fighting that case, with no building in the meantime.

Personally, I don't have a problem with such clauses. Whilst I'm most certainly not against rural housing, I do think it's fair enough to have some restrictions for locals - I just think some of the "rules" go too far, but the 10 year clause wouldn't be one of them imo.

Also, a point to note. The 10 years starts when you register it on your deeds. Not 10 years from when you build the house.

patrido

when we were looking for our planning permission in co meath, i read the county development plan (all local authorities should have one), and the plan talked about this whole area, and the situations where you are allowed to sell, for example financial hardship. It specifically referred to a section of one of the planning acts

What I'm saying is that I think this may be legislated for, and not just up to the whims and fancies of the individual planners/local authorities. if you find and read the relevant section, it should give you some idea of what is normally allowed, notwithstanding any additional legal argument that can be made.

I'm not a lawyer, so check this out first, but one thing that you can do, is accept the planning permission, do the commencement notice, and start building. Then submit a new application to get the conditions of the original application modified. This way you can fight your case with bord pleanala, the high/supreme court, brussels, even the jedi council and your original permission is not at risk, and you still have your house

A neighbour of mine took this approach with his airfield. He didn't like the restriction on the number of allowed flights (2 per day) so he applied to have it changed to 90 per month. No risk of losing, and he got it quite easily in the end.

if you pm me i can give you the planning reference number, and you can look up the wording on the meath co co website.