drilling into wall, pipes, cabels? etc...

LegacyUser

i have to put up 2 mirrors, one in the sitting room over the fire place, and one in a downstairs toilet.

how do i know if there's water pipes, or electric cabels in the wall before i drill?

also, i'm not sure how to put up the sitting room mirror? is it like hanging a picture?

rooferPete

Hi Paperclip,

We use a "Stanley Intellisensor Digisacan", sounds real technical basicaly it is a Stud Finder, and detects cables and pipes in the wall, I think they are less than 100 euro.

There are dearer and cheaper units available, we like these because they do what we want without the need for a "Degree in Understanding"

Depending on the weight of the mirror over the fire place you may need to drill into the wall and get a good fixing into the wall, I know I used three on a big mirror over the mantle in my home.

The bathroom I presume is a small mirror fixed above the sink, normal plaster board plugs should work on these, I have seen some held in place on ceramic tiles using adhesives.

I expect a simple stud finder should be available for around twenty five euro, or you might try trial and error setting the drill depth at 12 mm and gently pushing a nail into the hole to try and feel for pipes and cables.

It used to be that there would no wires or cables unless there was a rad or socket in the line of where you are drilling, I wouldn't be so confident today so buy or borrow a simple stud finder.

.

Macy

Think Argos have a couple of options, one I think with a Laser Level.... Which brings me to Laser Levels - worth the money?

MorningStar

A machine to detect is fair enough but generally over kill.
If the house is really old you could have pipes and the like anywhere but a modern build is generally easy to tell.

Sockets are are fed wire from the ground so don't drill anything below a socket.
Switches are fed from celing so don't drill anything above a switch.
Water pipes aren't typically hidden in walls here so you tend to be able to see them or know where they are through boxing.

If you really are unsure play it safe.

I would be very surprised to believe that standards are being ignored now but I will stand corrected from a modern builder.

rooferPete

Hi Morning Star,

Six months ago I would have given a similar answer to yours, we had an emergency call just before Christmas, any sensible person would have thought the same as the customer.

They were putting up curtain rails in the new apartment, radiator a standard fit below the window, but exactly in line where any curtain rail would be fitted some 150 mm to the side of the window they drilled straight into the heating pipe.

I think everyone would expect the pipes to be buried in the screed but not in this case, I have the photos stored because we keep records for the insurance companies.

I agree that the old house should comply with your common sense rules, the same as I have for years, the new construction appears to be making up the rules or guidelines on each new development.

In the attached photo you should see the vent to the left, the repaired pipe and the window to the right, I know it doesn't make sense

.

kadman

Detection is the proper way to go first, and then the fitting of any mirrors, pictures ect,.

There are no constants to where pipes cable runs ect., are supposed to be located. Years of working on construction sites, has taught me one thing. Assuming a pipe or cable should be in one place is one thing, ensuring its there is another.

Use a stud/cable/pipe finder and be 100% happy that you wont be calling a plumber, electrician, security installer, tv guy, in to repair their install that you have drilled through.

Check twice , drill once.

kadman

mad m

rooferPete wrote:

Hi Morning Star,

Six months ago I would have given a similar answer to yours, we had an emergency call just before Christmas, any sensible person would have thought the same as the customer.

They were putting up curtain rails in the new apartment, radiator a standard fit below the window, but exactly in line where any curtain rail would be fitted some 150 mm to the side of the window they drilled straight into the heating pipe.

I think everyone would expect the pipes to be buried in the screed but not in this case, I have the photos stored because we keep records for the insurance companies.

I agree that the old house should comply with your common sense rules, the same as I have for years, the new construction appears to be making up the rules or guidelines on each new development.

In the attached photo you should see the vent to the left, the repaired pipe and the window to the right, I know it doesn't make sense

.

I would of said no way until i seen the pic,thats just crazy,or just pure bloody laziness,fecking cowboys.Well i suppose the way to go is the detection route.Didnt Aldi/Lidl have those pipe/wire detectors awhile back for next to nothing?.

kadman

Hey Rooferpete,

I think you'll have to start a "Constructions from Hell " thread with that pic.

Thats magic,

kadman

rooferPete

Hi Kadman,

Sad to say but if I loaded up even a portion of the photos I have of modern construction I might just frighten the buyers of Irish property and cause the Construction Industry to go into a recession :mad:

The two photos on this are the same job, in one you can see the radiator.

Nothing makes sense anymore

kadman

Lovely jubbly Rooferpete.

I take it you are finding it hard to employ tradesmen with x ray vision then. .

If that was a hot pipe, you could have used thermal imaging equipment. Is that not part of the modern day roofers toolkit then.

I've seen you using the dark side of the force Rooferpete. So you are human after all. :rolleyes:

Sorry for going off topic. But I think those types of photos are ideal for a " how not too " thread. :eek:

As always Rooferpete, your posts are top notch.

Just waiting for the someone to post, " move the curtain rail to the left, and cover up the hole with the curtain, no need to repair" :eek:

kadman

rooferPete

Hi Kadman,

Thankfully the drilling of the hole was not by me or my staff

I have a 24 / 7 / 365 emergency service for some clients, while roofing is my specialty general contracting has always been part of the business, plumbing is part of the roofing trade so I had to learn the basics as a pup .

I have been looking at the Thermal Imaging Equipment as part of energy assesments for insulation values as well as leak detection, hopefully I will have unit before the end of this year.

I hope every home owner who views those pics will be helped in some way, I don't set out to scare people maybe I just see too much abuse in the industry on a regular basis it does annoy me.

You have no idea how hard it can be walking into someones pride and joy to correct a problem like that, the customers were fitting the curtains ready to spend the first night in their new home.

By the time we left the carpet had been dumped and the owners making alternative arrangements for a place to sleep but the leak was fixed.

When they called the agent the Christmas Party was in full swing and they couldn't get an intelligent answer from anyone they spoke to

It wasn't my place to say but running pipes like that I wonder would they have an intelligent answer at the best of times ?


.

Macy

MorningStar wrote:

Sockets are are fed wire from the ground so don't drill anything below a socket.

Wouldn't be so sure, especially in a TF/Stud wall. All our cables are fed from the loft.

MorningStar

OMG!

I haven't read the regulation lately and it has been a while since I did read them but I was sure that certain regs on pipes and electric cabling.

I know regs can sometimes be a bit woolly by saying things like "where possible".

That pipe has to be considered the work of cowboys. Is there any legal action that can be taken against the builders?

Anybody else feel like we have been building the slums of the future since the the mid 90s

rooferPete

MorningStar wrote:

OMG!

I haven't read the regulation lately and it has been a while since I did read them but I was sure that certain regs on pipes and electric cabling.

I know regs can sometimes be a bit woolly by saying things like "where possible".

That pipe has to be considered the work of cowboys. Is there any legal action that can be taken against the builders?

Anybody else feel like we have been building the slums of the future since the the mid 90s

Hi MorningStar,

No recourse on the builder or the "tradesmen" in fact I heard later that the verbal reply from both the builder and property management company amounted to a thinly veiled, "What are you still complaining about isn't your problem fixed".

That type of customer service annoys me, over €200,000.00 handed out and being paid back for the next thirty years and it's basically if you didn't buy it we had a que waiting.

I remember the inner city when it was slums, the "Gregory Deal" did a lot of cleaning up and making peoples lives better, I remember apartments for £50,000.00 and I walked away because all I could see was the potential slums of the future.

Wasn't I the fool, I could have bought them and sold at a massive profit or maybe greed would have blurred my vision and I would be holding very tainted goods for the near future.

Sorry Paperclip,

Your topic has taken a lot of turns and you still haven't hung those mirrors, to summarise :

Ensure you have good fixing points for the heavy mirror, if it is wide three may be the best way to go with a wire tie not "String", the bathroom should be simple enough.

You might consider using a sharp screw driver like a phase tester to gently punch the holes if you are fitting plasterboard plugs.

.

MorningStar

rooferPete wrote:

Hi MorningStar,
I remember the inner city when it was slums, the "Gregory Deal" did a lot of cleaning up and making peoples lives better, I remember apartments for £50,000.00 and I walked away because all I could see was the potential slums of the future.
.

I know what you mean but the market now is different. With the poorly built property being the slum creater not the area. There seems to be a few problems with the modern builds like sound transmission that will cause the properties to have a poor resale value when the market slows down. I would guess that will slowy drag them down the the property market. It's just a theory but I don't know many people who plan on living in an appartment forever

amerden

rooferPete wrote:

Hi MorningStar,


Your topic has taken a lot of turns and you still haven't hung those mirrors, to summarise :

Ensure you have good fixing points for the heavy mirror, if it is wide three may be the best way to go with a wire tie not "String", the bathroom should be simple enough.

.

What I normally do when I'm hanging a heavy mirror is plug the wall with a good size plug and then I super glue a washer approx. twice the size of the screw head onto the end of the screw so that when I hang the mirror there is less lightlyhood of the wire slipping off the end of the screw, but make sure that the wire is up to the weight.