Forgive me father for I have sinned.

Fatboydim

I don’t know what it is about the regular Wednesday game in the Westwood Galway, but it certainly brings out the worst in me. I can never seem to get the tactics right. True the blind structure and “double” rebuy makes it like playing a speed freeroll on line, with one example last night being six limpers call preflop around to the button. Button raises all in and gets four players [some with bigger stacks] to go all in too. So we see 10 10 / 9 9 / AK / A 10 / J J – AK wins button was on 99. – I sensibly folded pre-flop and didn’t limp in with my Q9 suited. So I make it to the break with 20k in chips without having to rebuy at all – I’ve played solid poker and seem to have some respect from the table. I decide to add a op up so start after the break with 25k. A couple of good hands later I’ve got around 33k and then it happens… I seem to lose it.
The play inevitably tightens up once it becomes a freeze out. With the blinds at 400 / 800 I raise to 3000 with pocket tens… A player on my immediate left recently joined the table with a short stack and seems to be a bit of a calling station. So far he’s had the goods when the cards have been played out to the end – but he’s played too many hands and in conversation with him I know he’s one of those players who thinks “suited” makes all the difference. So I’ve mentally marked him down as loose aggressive. One other player calls – and they are solid enough but very low stacked. Flop comes J Q K rainbow. It’s a terrible flop for me but gives me the open ended straight draw. One or both of these players could have part of it. The loose aggressive player could have anything from a small pair to the nutz. For some reason I put him on a small ace and the short stack on AJ. I think it’s worth trying to get the shortstack on their own as even though I know I’m behind there’s about 10k in the pot and the shortstack is going to be all in for another 1300. So it’s worth the risk as long as I can get matey out. So I bet 6k. He thinks about it and eventually goes all in. for 14k more. Now I really should walk away – shortstack calls as expected – I’ve been in a pot with this guy a few hands before when I raised to 2k with AK pre-flop [blinds at 300 / 600] he flat called – I bet at Q high flop for another 2k – he goes all in – I fold he shows aces. – So this now looks like an overbet or bluff to me, there’s now around 38K in the pot. If I call and lose I’ve got 10k left – I call – he has KJ and I don’t improve on turn or river. I’m kicking myself. Normally I would have walked away from the hand after the flop. I’ve needlessly thrown away 20K. I build the 10k back up to around 22k and find myself with A10 in mid position I limp in until a shortstack on BB has committed two thirds of his chips he has bet around 6k and has 3k left. I decide A 10 is good enough to go all in with given that there are three limpers behind me. Unfortunately one of the players limped in with AK [A player I have respect for too as I dealt an STT that he won] and calls me for all but 700 of my chips. A ten hits the flop but the river gives him the straight. I’m gutted…. My bad play has thrown away any chance I had of making the final table.

I’ve realised that this tournament is my bogey tournament – I am destined never to win it and I have no one to blame but myself.
:mad:

Pokerevents

Conor Ainswoth and Niall a.k.a Hammon from Clare were heads up for about 45mins. Conor eventually getting the better of it for first. Niall (one of the top european players on-line) was 4 to 1 aginst in stack size but fought back to evens and I felt he was unlucky not to win.
Go back dealing fatboy. Heh heh.

Culchie

Fatboydim wrote:

The loose aggressive player could have anything from a small pair to the nutz. For some reason I put him on a small ace and the short stack on AJ.

Not just picking or commenting on this particular hand, but I often see posts like this where people say that put someone on such and such a hand, and are extremely narrow in their range of hands, when they do this.

I wasn't sitting at the table, so it's a general comment, but I think you/we/poker players sort of think we are psychic sometimes, and talk ourselves into knowing what the other guys has.

I'm not saying you can't narrow it down to a range of hands, based on historical play, position etc.... but to such a narrow and specific hand is dangerous.
You say he could have anything, but then convince yourself it's a small Ace to suit your situation/circumstance.

As I said, it's a general observation of alot of players (me included) rather than the specific hand you were talking about.

califano

Fatboydim wrote:

I decide A 10 is good enough to go all in with *given that there are three limpers behind me.

*All the more reason not to go all in i'd say. If you get 3 limpers behind you you cant count on taking them all off with your all in. More than likely one of them will call. So you'll usually be going into a showdown on a play like that against 2 players and with A 10 you will surely be behind.

So yeah you were right it was a bad play there.

Hectorjelly

rounders123 wrote:

*All the more reason not to go all in i'd say. If you get 3 limpers behind you you cant count on taking them all off with your all in. More than likely one of them will call. So you'll usually be going into a showdown on a play like that against 2 players and with A 10 you will surely be behind.

So yeah you were right it was a bad play there.

At a loose table AT will often be the best hand after 4 limpers.

NickyOD

Pokerevents wrote:

Conor Ainswoth and Niall a.k.a Hammon from Clare were heads up for about 45mins. Conor eventually getting the better of it for first. Niall (one of the top european players on-line) was 4 to 1 aginst in stack size but fought back to evens and I felt he was unlucky not to win.
Go back dealing fatboy. Heh heh.

It's easy for Hamman to be considered one of the top online european players when he plays 99,000 online tournaments a month.

only joking.

califano

Hectorjelly wrote:

At a loose table AT will often be the best hand after 4 limpers.

One day im gonna comment on something you agree with Hectorjelly!!

Remember they were 'limpers' to the big blinds initial raise as i took it.

NickyOD

Fatboydim wrote:

I don’t know what it is about the regular Wednesday game in the Westwood Galway, but it certainly brings out the worst in me.

It can be dificult to play your usual A game against eratic players. All you can do is draw from memory on how they've played previous hand but since their range can be so wide its very hard to find the balance between showing them respect and puttng them on nothing. In one of my recent games with maniacs I bet the flop and turn on a board whcih came Q-2-3-K with KQ and a guy reraised me all in on the turn with 99 only to hit his 2 outer on the river. The following week I raised the same players blind with 77 and we see a flop whcih comes 8-8-8 and he bets out on it. "Get the **** outa here!!" I figure my pair is good so I put him all in thinking he is dumb enough to call with high cards. He calls and turns over A-8 for flopped quads. Bollocks! I would much rather play with tight predictable rocks than hoards of maniacs.

Hectorjelly

rounders123 wrote:

Remember they were 'limpers' to the big blinds initial raise as i took it.

The big blind cant make an initial raise.

califano

Hectorjelly wrote:

The big blind cant make an initial raise.

When the action came around to big blind he raised is what i meant.

Hectorjelly

rounders123 wrote:

When the action came around to big blind he raised is what i meant.

Your right sorry I misread the OP

Fatboydim

Pokerevents wrote:

Go back dealing fatboy. Heh heh.

Gis us a job

Mind you I might have a stab at that Connacht Cup first.

NickyOD

Fatboydim wrote:

Gis us a job

Mind you I might have a stab at that Connacht Cup first.

I'll see you there fatboy. Best of luck. You're gona have to tell me your real name though. lol. Imagine the looks I'll get when I get moved to your table "Hey Fatboy, Nice Stack!"

Jaden

I make small amounts of money playing Microlimit games on-line, (VC). This pays for my entry into the Westwood game. Try as I might, I always, and I mean always go out at the same point. I vary my game, my image and my strategy, to no avail. Come 30-19 players left (3-4 tables), out I go.

The game itself is a bit of a mix. Most people are dead money, with plenty of rebuys early on. Once the freezeout kicks in after the break, you'd think people would get tighter - alas no. With blinds going up, people will gamble with low PP, Ax or any two broadway cards. Going all-in WILL get callers, unless it's a really, really scary flop (all suited or paired/tripped.

On playing this tourney I can advise:

Gamble early if you intend to rebuy. It's €75 in, but €50 to rebuy, which you can do twice.

I never top-up. (Sorry Fintan!). Top-ups are €50 for 5K in chips, but at that stage the blinds are 400-800 (or is it 300-600?). If you are low stacked, it's simply not enough to scare anyone off pots.

There are always alot of limpers, so if you limp EP or MP, be prepared to call a raise. Since the rebuy limit was raised to 2, more and more people will gamble on marginal pocket cards. If the flop comes K 6 8, you could bet that someone is holding K8os, even in a preflop 8xBB raised pot.

It might all sound random, there is a group of people who consistantly seem to make the final table. Any final table is usually more than half comprised of this group. I've watched these people play, and I still can't figure out what they do differently.

It's worth doing once or twice if you're around Galway. I'm sure Nicky doesn't like this tourney, cos the wallpaper in the room is all wrong, and everyone is a complete manicial muppet, but I like it. Will be over in the Fitz on Sat/Sun, just to see how the other half lives.

Fatboydim

NickyOD wrote:

I'll see you there fatboy. Best of luck. You're gona have to tell me your real name though. lol. Imagine the looks I'll get when I get moved to your table "Hey Fatboy, Nice Stack!"

Reminds me of when I first started using the internet back in the days.. I was living in London at the time and a big Chelsea fan.... I used to post on the Chelsea Forum and at the time of registration couldn't think of a name - My wife used to call me Bagpuss - so that's the name I used. A few of us regular chatters decided to meet up before a game. The guy organising it was called Molly and described himself as Very large and hairy with a beard. You know what I look like Nicky - But I actually went to the designated pub and there were several large hairy bearded guys... I went up to one who looked seriously hard and was amongst a group of guys with shaved heads and tattooed necks "Are you Molly I'm Bagpuss?" How I escaped with my life I'll never know.

So to save you such embarassment it's Len.

NickyOD

Fatboydim wrote:

Reminds me of when I first started using the internet back in the days.. I was living in London at the time and a big Chelsea fan.... I used to post on the Chelsea Forum and at the time of registration couldn't think of a name - My wife used to call me Bagpuss - so that's the name I used. A few of us regular chatters decided to meet up before a game. The guy organising it was called Molly and described himself as Very large and hairy with a beard. You know what I look like Nicky - But I actually went to the designated pub and there were several large hairy bearded guys... I went up to one who looked seriously hard and was amongst a group of guys with shaved heads and tattooed necks "Are you Molly I'm Bagpuss?" How I escaped with my life I'll never know.

So to save you such embarassment it's Len.

rofl. ok fatboy. nice stack!

careca

Culchie wrote:

Not just picking or commenting on this particular hand, but I often see posts like this where people say that put someone on such and such a hand, and are extremely narrow in their range of hands, when they do this.

I wasn't sitting at the table, so it's a general comment, but I think you/we/poker players sort of think we are psychic sometimes, and talk ourselves into knowing what the other guys has.

I'm not saying you can't narrow it down to a range of hands, based on historical play, position etc.... but to such a narrow and specific hand is dangerous.
You say he could have anything, but then convince yourself it's a small Ace to suit your situation/circumstance.

As I said, it's a general observation of alot of players (me included) rather than the specific hand you were talking about.

I think thats a very good point culchie. I am definetly in that category and its something I have been trying to get out of lately. I find I am doing a lot better at reading hands now that I've tried to be less specific.

The idea that we convince ourselves of someones hand in order to suit our situation is interesting. I'm sure some head shrink would tell us the real reason for this, but I thinks its so that the very few times we get it right we can pat ourselves on the back. And unfortunately thats few and far between.

Hectorjelly

From time to time you can put people on two specific cards, but I love when people say things like:

I had AA and raise it up, X moves in and I put him on Ax so I call.

bohsman

From time to time you can put people on two specific cards, but I love when people say things like:

I had AA and raise it up, X moves in and I put him on Ax so I call.

if you put them on JTs you would have to fold the aces as you cant be risking your stack on a cointoss

JuliusFranco

i always seem to be able to spot when people have AT... don't kow why but maybe it's because of their inner struggle (this is a good hand - not it's not - yes it is - no it's not..)

califano

Hectorjelly wrote:

From time to time you can put people on two specific cards, but I love when people say things like:

I had AA and raise it up, X moves in and I put him on Ax so I call.

I like it lol
Like opponent on KK and he was folding!