dazed and confused about what to do

babykiten

As per my previous thread - me and the boyf have been havng huge problems after 6 years together and after moving countries I left him over 2 weeks ago.

I packed up and left the house without really a goodbye, which wasnt nice, but i didnt see any other way, his mate was there who lived with us too.

Im staying with friends, but it is their house and i feel wierd! i have been drinking alot the past two weeks and sometimes i feel so alone just wandering london and thinkin why the hell are we apart and then i think of some valid reasons that i am not with him.

I have sacrificed alot to get here, and there wasnt any option of me going back home, im making some new mates but it isnt the same as what we had planned together- travellin, children, a home, being together.

I am getting mixed vibes from him, hes really confused. He says he doenst want to go back to all the arguing and that i have to stop telling him what to do (i got on his case about an email i found in his wallet, all this porn i never knew existed?, and him taking recreational drugs and smoking hash around the house).

Maybe im very narrow minded but i expected him to grow out of this ? Hes approaching 30 this year. Thing is, although he denies it, i think these are symptoms of him not being happy as a person inside. I thought it was all down to me, but i think he has problems and sometimes he is a little depressed and turns to fantasy or something? I cannot go back to the way things are but he says he wants to talk about possibly working things out. im stuck - help!!

WhiteWashMan

ok, i think you have two issues here.

first, you have to figure out this whole boyfriend and getting abck together thing.

you left for a reason. write down all the reasons you left him. in black and white. im sure theres a large list. put down every damn thing you hate about him, the relationship, the things around the relationship, the times he lsot the head for no reason at all, the times you were upset, the times youve been disappointed or embarassed.
be honest, put it all down. it will probably be a long list to be honest.

now, put down all the great things. everytime he made you breakfast in bed, the good times you have, all the great things about him that you really loved.

now, make a third list.
put down the things you miss.
this is really important.

are the things you miss, directly related to him, or could you actually substitute any person in there. do you miss the closeness and the hugs, and the feeling of stability?

because thats not him, thats you with a 'body'. this is impotant, because in the first few weeks you will feel miserable. you will feel awful, and lonely, and the desperation (yues, desperation) to get rid of that feeling is what drives people who should never be together, back together!
hell, have a rebound fling to get over it.
but put those three lists together, and let us know what you come up with. i thin kyou will find a long list of why you shouldnt be together, and a long list of things you miss, but are not actually directly related to him, but to the feeling of closeness that people get with friendship.

the second thing...

you got to figure out the first one first, and then you have to figure out what the **** you are going to do. you cant sleep on your friends couch for the rest of your life.
you need to figure out what you are going to do, where you are going to do it, and how the hell you are going to get there.

i know this, i slepot on my friends floor for a week after i broke up with my last partner, and i was scruffy and scraggy and generally not in a good way. but then i copped on and moved into an apartment and got on with my life.

so, ignore all that, and read this:
figure out why you moved out, and stay moved out, and get closure on it.
figure out where your life goes from here. its not that scarey...

whippet

it sounds like you needed to get out. You are obviously two different people with different outlooks.

I assume you are in your late 20's, you have a more holistic view of the world whereby your boyfriend still wants to live in a protected enviorment.

Constant arguing as you described it related to incompatibility, boiling over frustrations in regular differences of opinion no matter how small.

What you are feeling over the last two weeks is a natural grieving process, you have just cut off a significent part of your life and no longer have the percieved security that you thought you had.

I could be predictable and tell you to lay off the booze, but as long you don't depend on it enjoy some nights out and keep yourself occupied.

You could use this change in circumstance to re-evaluate what you want and what you can do. Take it as an opportunity to look on the future with out blinkers as opposed to having a relationship to consider with every move.

Your boyfriend sounds like someone who is really dependant on those around him, even at 30 years of age he needs someone to 'stop telling him what to do', if he was mature enough nobody would have to tell him this. His dependance is hitting him now and he wants you back, but not the arguments. Unless he is willing to totally change his lifestyle and you set down clear markers in the sand this will never change.

Despite what he might say remember that you left for a reason and you shouldn't go back if this reason still exists.

babykiten

WOW, they are very good statements, thanks so much guys.

Im 25 and i do have a more holistic view of the world. Im currently staying in my friends room in her house and we are very good friends, but i dont feel at home there either.

Thats the whole thing, i feel he is trying to get me back and only on his terms, so if that is true then its best it stays ended.

*Sassy*

Great replies so far guys. I completely agree and don't have much to add.

From what I've seen of your posts here, this relationship is well and truly over. You need to get your own place, cut all contact with him COMPLETELY. I know that sounds impossible, but I absolutely guarantee you that after a few weeks/months you will find that you are getting on with things and more hopeful about the future. I'm also pretty sure you will look back on him and see him for who is has turned into, and not who he used to be.

If he decides to get off his arse and do something about his life, that's up to him. But don't stick around waiting for it to happen. Get on with your own life and leave him to his own devices.

babykiten

i think ive really got to the point where I am accepting that i may never go back to him, and to be honest, its not that bad.

I have agreed to meet him later and i am preparing. I need to be very clear about my boundaries and stick with them.

I think i will write that list.

I need to keep my cool tonight, i hope i can do this!!?

Beruthiel

babykiten wrote:

I need to keep my cool tonight, i hope i can do this!!?

just make a huge effort to keep cool and logical in your comments,

remember why you left in the first place, people don't change unless they want to badly enough and from what you have said about him so far, he doesn't seem like he really wants to - so, that concludes that ye both want different things from life - he'd want to be saying some mighty important things tonight for that to change

*Sassy*

Good luck babykitten, let us know how it goes! Write that list, bring it in your bag and go over it in the toilet if you have to!!!

Don't go drinking with him, it's a BAD idea.

And finally, no matter what he says, just picture how things would be if you went back to him. Do you REALLY see him changing drastically? Don't think so.

whippet

whatever you do this evening do not even leave a hint that there maybe a way back for him, this will really show weakness on your part that can be exploited.

Don't loose site of the reasons that you left, nothing will have changed in 2 weeks, emotions will run high and impossible promises will be made. Use this opportunity to end it properly and I would suggest a total cut off of communications. You may have ideas of 'how could I not have him involved in my life at all' but soon enough you will realise how much one way traffic dominated your relationship.

For the record I am a bloke speaking. I was dumped in similar circumstances a few years back and looking back now I realise what a desperate boyfriend I was. I didn't cheat, loose my temper or was abusive .. but I totally took the girl for granted. Only when I then got involved with a girl who actually bullied me and treated me like I treated my ex did I realise what the concept of 'give and take' was.

babykiten

hi guys, thanks for the advice.

I met him last night and it went OK.

He said to me 'come home' and when we start trusting each other, then we should go for a commitment. I didnt go home with him, went back to my mates.

Im exhausted and need time out, (plus ive developed a beer potser and dull skin from all the last fortnights partying)! so i havent agreed to do anything just yet. I do want him, but need to feel things are more concrete, how? i dont know. I need to set limits.

I have said i wont move home yet, although id love to, i dont want to share with his mate anymore, so therefore i can see no other way just yet.Help!!!?

He is still a bit 'cool' for my liking so rather than spending the wknd together as he suggested, im flying back home to see my family, when he found this out he called straight away and sounded a little dissapointed and said hed re-arrange to see me early next week.

The problem is, id feel too wierd 'dating' again til we get our own place, and also that may make him think of fun, rather than a committed relationship which is what i want.

How do i work this one!?

up for anything

Another poster with a me, me, me attitude. You've had nothing positive to say about him (Why on earth do you love him then!). According to you he is a beer drinking, drug using, possibly unfaithful, immature brat. Well then, you're well shot of him and shouldn't go back and shouldn't be looking for advice on "how to work this one". That phrase in itself is distasteful.

I could be wrong but maybe this is his point of view.

I broke up with my long term girlfriend and moved to England to get away from her. On a visit home we got back together again (maybe one of those frequent times I lost the use of my senses while drinking and taking recreational drugs) because she made it impossible for me to say no. I escaped back to London but she followed me over and moved in with my friend and I (he's not very happy about it) - how could I say no, I'm a weak guy and she's pretty domineering.

Since then she's made my life a misery with her nagging about my social life, my friends, how much I drink, when I do drugs occasionally. She tells me how much she gave up to come over here and be with me. She even goes through my wallet and private stuff. When she found my porn collection she went ballistic and called me disgusting. I mean don't most of you guys out there go for porn at one time or another. She doesn't get that the fact that I enjoy porn has nothing to do with her or a lack in her. She goes on about our future together, buying a house, getting married, having kids etc. I feel suffocated and trapped. My behaviour towards her has deteriorated as time has gone on. I did outrageous things in the hope that she would give up on me and go home. I know I'm a bit spineless and should just tell her outright that it's over but I did love her until she became this bunny boiler type and I don't like the thoughts of hurting her so I'm hoping she'll do it for me.

Anyhow she moved out without telling me a couple of weeks ago. Since then I feel like the weight of the world has been lifted from my shoulders but my problem is that she is now making me feel guilty so I make all the right noises about getting together again but I'm trying to tell her that I want it to be on my terms. No more her trying to make me into someone I'm not and someone I'm not ready to be. Maybe this makes me a prize bastard. What do you think?"

Two sides to everything and on what you've said I'd say you are as much in the wrong as he is. Stop being so manipulative and sneaky and try and mature a little. If you love him stop trying to change him. Your low self-esteem is colouring the way you perceive him and the things he does. The world doesn't revolve around you and your feelings and he doesn't do the things he does to get at you maybe it's just because he enjoys them.

LegacyUser

........................Two sides to everything and on what you've said I'd say you are as much in the wrong as he is. Stop being so manipulative and sneaky and try and mature a little. If you love him stop trying to change him. Your low self-esteem is colouring the way you perceive him and the things he does. The world doesn't revolve around you and your feelings and he doesn't do the things he does to get at you maybe it's just because he enjoys them.

Not saying your right or wrong. You could be the girls boyfriend for all I know.
Thing is with these PI things you can only work with what information you are given and
perhaps by the nature of a personal issue which concerns one side of relationship, you would tend to get just that,
one side of a relationship.
Although, I agree with the fact that your post could make the OP question what's going on in her bf's head,and its possible you're right, it doesnt serve any other purpose. Cos you see, she asked for help, he didn't.
regardless of the above, do you think *she* should go back? Thats kinda the point isnt it?

To the OP..
Dont go back just because your all over the place.
Your friends house isnt your home, but "home" isnt a nice place either and I cant see you feeling better going back there.
You've drank alot, abused your body and your in an unfamiliar place thats all it is.

Its horrible to be discomoded. But as far as i can see from the information you've given there is no point in going
back. Stay where you are and cut off all contact. Test yourself.

Dont even consider thinking about it until at least a few months time. You'll only end up in the same situation as you left.
If you weren't happy with that then its not going to change just like that.

I'd say to see him was nice for you. Its familiar and comfortable for that time that your there, if a little distant.
But question whether the conversation went well and there was some logical progress rather than if seeing him gave you a little hope and eased that "unfamiliar lost" feeling you have. Because in two months you'll be comfortable enough where you are. You get used to anything.

up for anything

I'm neither her boyfriend or one of her boyfriend's friends.

The above is an attempt to make her see that she has to take some responsibility for the situation she is in instead of encouraging her in the delusion that she is the wronged person in the relationship. The guy she is describing in her posts is pretty much like 50% of 30 year old males I have known over the years. He is neither a saint or a sinner, just a normal guy who maybe doesn't want to be tied down yet and have all his actions dictated by a girl who has a lot of growing up to do herself.

I can't see the point in giving her any more advice other then to look inside herself. Read all her posts, not just the ones on this thread and you will see that she is blind to anything other then hangin on to him and some nebulous future with him.

babykiten

up for anything wrote:

Another poster with a me, me, me attitude. You've had nothing positive to say about him (Why on earth do you love him then!). According to you he is a beer drinking, drug using, possibly unfaithful, immature brat. Well then, you're well shot of him and shouldn't go back and shouldn't be looking for advice on "how to work this one". That phrase in itself is distasteful.

I could be wrong but maybe this is his point of view.

I broke up with my long term girlfriend and moved to England to get away from her. On a visit home we got back together again (maybe one of those frequent times I lost the use of my senses while drinking and taking recreational drugs) because she made it impossible for me to say no. I escaped back to London but she followed me over and moved in with my friend and I (he's not very happy about it) - how could I say no, I'm a weak guy and she's pretty domineering.

Since then she's made my life a misery with her nagging about my social life, my friends, how much I drink, when I do drugs occasionally. She tells me how much she gave up to come over here and be with me. She even goes through my wallet and private stuff. When she found my porn collection she went ballistic and called me disgusting. I mean don't most of you guys out there go for porn at one time or another. She doesn't get that the fact that I enjoy porn has nothing to do with her or a lack in her. She goes on about our future together, buying a house, getting married, having kids etc. I feel suffocated and trapped. My behaviour towards her has deteriorated as time has gone on. I did outrageous things in the hope that she would give up on me and go home. I know I'm a bit spineless and should just tell her outright that it's over but I did love her until she became this bunny boiler type and I don't like the thoughts of hurting her so I'm hoping she'll do it for me.

Anyhow she moved out without telling me a couple of weeks ago. Since then I feel like the weight of the world has been lifted from my shoulders but my problem is that she is now making me feel guilty so I make all the right noises about getting together again but I'm trying to tell her that I want it to be on my terms. No more her trying to make me into someone I'm not and someone I'm not ready to be. Maybe this makes me a prize bastard. What do you think?"

Two sides to everything and on what you've said I'd say you are as much in the wrong as he is. Stop being so manipulative and sneaky and try and mature a little. If you love him stop trying to change him. Your low self-esteem is colouring the way you perceive him and the things he does. The world doesn't revolve around you and your feelings and he doesn't do the things he does to get at you maybe it's just because he enjoys them.

To be honest- i think that is pretty cruel and you almost could be my boyfriend from the way that you think.

Its obvious you feel pretty strong about it.

There are two sides to every story- you are correct, but you have been nasty in your approach and giving advice

babykiten

thanks for the useful and practical advice tired.

up for anything

Maybe I'm being a bit cruel to be kind but you've said it yourself "you almost could be my boyfriend from the way that you think". I think that statement says it all. Stop looking for a happy ending. You're not going to find it with that guy or any guy until you look look to your own behaviour in this relationship and stop trying to garner useless sympathy and start looking at the advice you are being given.

babykiten

im not looking for sympathy, im trying to understand if i was being unreasonable and explore my own faults.

You really are cut up deep enough to write a big long email about it, maybe its something closer to home for you?

To honest, its unfeeling and cruel people giving advice that spoil it. I was trying to discuss this. Not gain sympathy and besides, no matter what you say- i am the one thats paying.

I obviously asked for advice, as i still love the guy, but when you only confirm what i think, then yes, he is an awful person, cos i was not brought up to neglect any person or be 'spineless'.

babykiten

up for anything wrote:

. The guy she is describing in her posts is pretty much like 50% of 30 year old males I have known over the years. He is neither a saint or a sinner, just a normal guy who maybe doesn't want to be tied down yet and have all his actions dictated by a girl who has a lot of growing up to do herself.
.

Then perhaps he shouldnt have pretended he loved her and wanted to be with her for six years should he? Perhaps he shouldnt be 'spineless' as u describe and saved her alot of hassle and pain, and relcating country.

Why dont you think about that? cos i have

WhiteWashMan

up for anything wrote:

The world doesn't revolve around you and your feelings

you were doing well up to this point.

for this girl, her world does revolve around her.
why shouldnt it, its her world?

quite frankly, if she is not happy with the guy, she should just not go out with him. find someone she is happy with.

she just has to stop being stupid and talking to him, or trying to change him or whatever.

if its not going to work, its not going to work. believe it or not relationship do not need a huge amount of work. and anyone that says they do is not enjoying a great relationship.

personally, id want to be in a great relatiosnhip than an ok one i have to owrk at, that i have to change a lot of things about myself for, that i have do things i dont want to do.
im happy in a realtionship where i can be myself, where my partner is herself, where we fit perfectly together and rarely fight.

the OP should just move on. there are too many wrong things in this relationship, she knows it, they wont get fixed. stop wasting your own time, and let him get on with his partying.

WhiteWashMan

up for anything wrote:

The above is an attempt to make her see that she has to take some responsibility for the situation she is in instead of encouraging her in the delusion that she is the wronged person in the relationship. The guy she is describing in her posts is pretty much like 50% of 30 year old males I have known over the years. He is neither a saint or a sinner, just a normal guy who maybe doesn't want to be tied down yet and have all his actions dictated by a girl who has a lot of growing up to do herself.

mmm, i think you are taking this all a bit personally to be honest.

as always in a realtionship it takes two to tango, and i have not really seen anything about being wronged or anything.
i have seen that this relationship is not right for either of them, and so they should split. you appear to have taken it to a different level. havent recently been dumped have you?

as for 50% of 30 year old males, please, thats just silly.
if someone is like that, then they should have the balls to stand up and say 'hey, im wasting your time. you want one thing, i want another, lets break up now because i cant give you what i want'. its her fault that shes stupid enough to hang around for so long and not see it.

as for the girl needing to grow up, has this all come from your reading of your own diatribe on 'a view from the other side'?
sounds to me like someone who is in a situation and just wants advice.

you make an awful lot of assumptions. in this case, it would appear you have made and ass out of just u.

babykiten

i know i should move on, and i have to a big extent, i think if id of been back home when this happened it would have been easier.

Cos id of had my family, close friends, could of went back home til i got on my feet.

I know i shouldnt love him, but its very sad and very hard after all this time to see what WAS beautiful, to decline into dust. im crying as i write this, (in work), cos i always thought he was th guy for me, to marry someday.

If i wanted to be cruel to him and hurt him, then why do i care so much?

Cos i did love him, but now i know i cant get him to join me, he is in a different place right now, with totally diff priorities.

*Sassy*

Hi Babykiten,

So sorry to hear you're upset. From your last post there it seems you know you have to try and move on. I really feel for you, I'm in a long distance relationship and we will have to relocate if we want to be together all the time (after almost 4 years we will have to do something soon). I know how difficult it must be to cut yourself off from the one person who's supposed to be your rock at a time like this. It's not easy leaving your friends and family. I just want to wish you the best and hope that you are strong enough to make a go of it without him. With my limited knowledge of your situation I think it would be in your best interests. I know right now you probably feel that you'll never have what you used to have with anyone else. But I've heard of so many people who've broken up with their first major love and gone on to be in extremely happy relationships.

WhiteWashMan

like me

up for anything

What I was saying to the OP doesn't come from any personal feelings of my own getting mixed up in her situation. I've been married for quite a long time now and content with my life.

"Then perhaps he shouldnt have pretended he loved her and wanted to be with her for six years should he? Perhaps he shouldnt be 'spineless' as u describe and saved her alot of hassle and pain, and relcating country." The OP's post I quoted from just shows how she is seeking to make him the scapegoat. The way of the world is that relationships change over time because people mature or don't mature. It doesn't mean that he didn't love you during the relationship just because he may not now. People can't be made to love to order.

"as for 50% of 30 year old males, please, thats just silly.
if someone is like that, then they should have the balls to stand up and say 'hey, im wasting your time. you want one thing, i want another, lets break up now because i cant give you what i want'. its her fault that shes stupid enough to hang around for so long and not see it." You are not making any allowances for human nature. If everybody had the backbone to stand up and say how they felt, what they thought - the world might be a better place or indeed a hell of a lot worse. There are very few people, in my experience, who will stand up and completely honest.

Also my post was far from being a bitter, abusive denunciation as you'll see if you read it again.

Lochaber

babykiten wrote:

I know i shouldnt love him, but its very sad and very hard after all this time to see what WAS beautiful, to decline into dust. im crying as i write this, (in work), cos i always thought he was th guy for me, to marry someday.

If i wanted to be cruel to him and hurt him, then why do i care so much?

Cos i did love him, but now i know i cant get him to join me, he is in a different place right now, with totally diff priorities.

I think the most important thing to keep in mind - and I am kinda making an assumption here but from what you've said sounds like the case - is that those beautiful times were a long time ago. He's acting the way he is because he's moved on, he's not that person and now you have to move on too. It may sound a bit harsh and sure it might hurt like hell but it's the truth.

It's tempting to try to give it another go and if you really, truly, hand on heart, 100%, believe that things could work out and that the two of you won't be back in the same place in 6 months then go ahead, talk it out and try to work it but... I think you know how likely that really is....

babykiten

up for anything wrote:

The guy she is describing in her posts is pretty much like 50% of 30 year old males I have known over the years.
QUOTE]


I think you should get your facts right and back them up before you make such a silly statement

up for anything

Stop being so petty. I was, if you check out the quote, referring to the guys I HAVE KNOWN. Not 50% of all 30 year olds.

Beruthiel

well, lets leave it at that shall we folks?
no need to be givin' it loads on a friday
B

babykiten

Will do B- Thanks for the advice everyone.

Beruthiel

no probs babykiten
best of luck with whatever you decide to do