Hand from boards game

Imposter

Here's a hand from the boards game. What would you do?

Seat 1: LennieL (4080 in chips)
Seat 4: oscarf (2030 in chips)
Seat 5: Briano (3195 in chips)
Seat 8: Imposter1 (5695 in chips)
oscarf: posts small blind 75
Briano: posts big blind 150
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to LennieL [6d 6h]
Imposter1: raises 350 to 500
LennieL: calls 500
oscarf: folds
Briano: folds
*** FLOP *** [Qd Qc Qh]
Imposter1: checks
LennieL: bets 1000
Imposter1: raises 4195 to 5195 and is all-in

LennieL: calls 2580 and is all-in
*** TURN *** [Qd Qc Qh] [Ks]
*** RIVER *** [Qd Qc Qh Ks] [4s]
Imposter1 said, "good call"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Imposter1: shows [4h 4c] (a full house, Queens full of Fours)
LennieL: shows [6d 6h] (a full house, Queens full of Sixes)
LennieL collected 8385 from pot
Briano said, "gc"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 8385 | Rake 0
Board [Qd Qc Qh Ks 4s]
Seat 1: LennieL (button) showed [6d 6h] and won (8385) with a full house, Queens full of Sixes
Seat 4: oscarf (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Briano (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 8: Imposter1 showed [4h 4c] and lost with a full house, Queens full of Fours

Hitman Actual

I think I had to call... I had a good think about it and thought I was ahead. If you had just called the flop bet, I would probably have released the hand had you shown any strength after that, but the all-in looked like a semi-bluff with Ax or Kx (x being fairly big). I decided if you had a higher pair, so be it, but I didn't think you had. I wasn't expecting to be ahead of a smaller pair!

Maths-wise, I was getting about 2/1 on the call, so it probably was correct, but I haven't looked into that yet. Anyway, you came back well to get it heads-up. In fairness, I lucked out against Oscar (when he was all-in with JT and I hit the 5 on the river) and Brian (when he was all-in with 88 against my Q8 and I hit the Q). But I think my calls against those two guys were correct as well!

bohsman

Fantastic raise Imposter, very close call from Lenny but the call was as good as the raise.

Lenny not sure about your call against Muso but you had to call against me, it was 500 from your 10k stack into a 2500 pot, I wanted you there with those cards, it was my fault anyway with my tilty call with 99 against your A10 on a 10 high flop stupid call

Hitman Actual

bohsman wrote:

Fantastic raise Imposter, very close call from Lenny but the call was as good as the raise.

Lenny not sure about your call against Muso but you had to call against me, it was 500 from your 10k stack into a 2500 pot, I wanted you there with those cards, it was my fault anyway with my tilty call with 99 against your A10 on a 10 high flop stupid call

I was surprised that you didn't raise pre-flop with your 99- I would have been gone in a heartbeat. As for the call against Muso, I had a big stack and was raising most hands when you guys were in the blinds. I had decided that I wasn't gong to lay down any hand to a re-raise, simply because you might have been playing back at me with a weak hand.

Imposter

The reason I posted this is that I think the range of hands i'd have would put me ahead here. I'm just trying to figure out what range people would have had me on

If you consider this call in terms of what the pot is laying him it is a good call but that ignores the survival aspect of tournament play. So much to consider here imo.

If I was in Lenny's position (against a player like me - similar 'style') i probably would have folded. But then again that is down to my impression of myself which probably doesn't tally with what ye think (and what i'd like to know).

bohsman

I was hoping for a low flop to try and trap someone on the flop and as I say I was on tilt after the AK AT hand a few hands earlier

Hitman Actual

Imposter wrote:

The reason I posted this is that I think the range of hands i'd have would put me ahead here. I'm just trying to figure out what range people would have had me on

If you consider this call in terms of what the pot is laying him it is a good call but that ignores the survival aspect of tournament play. So much to consider here imo.

If I was in Lenny's position (against a player like me - similar 'style') i probably would have folded. But then again that is down to my impression of myself which probably doesn't tally with what ye think (and what i'd like to know).

If it's any consolation, one of the main reasons I made the call was because I thought you were good enough to make a semi-bluff move with a hand that I'm ahead of... Ax, Kx, etc. I know it was for all my chips, but I really thought I was ahead! (after a fair bit of thought admitedly)

bohsman

Imposter, I tought you played a good agressive game which might make it easier to put you on a semi bluff, Im glad nobody bet on you in the Heads Up

Imposter

lenny_leonard wrote:

If it's any consolation, one of the main reasons I made the call was because I thought you were good enough to make a semi-bluff move with a hand that I'm ahead of... Ax, Kx, etc. I know it was for all my chips, but I really thought I was ahead! (after a fair bit of thought admitedly)

Edit: change of plan - too much info

I was including some of those hands too but there was a lot of hand would have put me miles ahead: 77-AA and any Qx (realistically with the x 10 or better)

Imposter

bohsman wrote:

Imposter, I tought you played a good agressive game which might make it easier to put you on a semi bluff, Im glad nobody bet on you in the Heads Up

I think you'll find someone did but i'm hardly likely to win it out.

NickyOD

Imposter wrote:

The reason I posted this is that I think the range of hands i'd have would put me ahead here. I'm just trying to figure out what range people would have had me on

would basically be putting you on any pair here, although looking at the preflop raise of slighly more 3BBs it doens't look like KK/AA because you would probably want action with those hands but then again this is pretty much your standard raise with most hands. A Queen is actually also possible here because if Imposter reads Lenny's pot size bet as having a pair it would be correct for him to push now rather than let a danger card like the King land on the turn and scare Lenny off it. I would have to give you respect for a pair here which puts you on 22-55, (4 hands I beat) or 77-JJ or indeed the Queen (6 hands against which I'm screwed, 8 if my read on him not having AA/KK is wrong) Although I'm slightly more likely to be behind here I would take a look at the stacks and see that calling and winning gives me a serious chip lead and folding leaves me in third, although not in terrbile shape by any means. I think I would probably fold this more often than I would call here but it would have a lot to do with how Imposter had been playing and how much he had been pressurising up to that point. I can't see him pushing without a pair here anyway so I think calling is a gamble.

NickyOD

Imposter wrote:

Edit: change of plan - too much info

Ho ho Ho!

Imposter

NickyOD wrote:

Ho ho Ho!

Exactly.

Thinking about this hand after the game yesterday I think your right Nicky. I may not have pushed with AA or KK but it probably would have been the thing to do as you won't get credit for having those hands.

Lenny had put in a few tasty bets into pots where I checked the flop before that. I had pretty much decided before I checked that I was going all-in, providing his bet was similar to before (about pot size). This might widen my hand range in Lenny's favour but not by much. He fell for my play beautifully but just forgot to fold! :rolleyes:

Hitman Actual

OK, there's one thing that's been niggling me about this hand, and it's this: the general consensus is that Imposter was likely to have a pair better than sixes in this spot, but if he had a pair between, say, 77-JJ, surely he will put in a bet on the flop rather than give me a free card to hit a K or A. (Thats what I did with my 66!). Even with a pair lower than 66, you will probably put in a bet of some sort of bet to see where you stand, and ease off if you get called.

I called his pre-flop raise meaning that I could easily have a big Ace, and only flat-called because I dont want to get involved too heavily with the chip leader. And if you had a Q here, would you go all-in... I doubt it very, very much.

I think it was Ciaffone who said that usually your first instinct in a hand is the right one, and with the all-in my gut feeling was that I was ahead (for the wrong reason,admitedly: I put Imposter on Ax or Kx). But when the cards were shown, I really wasn't expecting to see a pair 77-JJ!

Hectorjelly

Imposters move looks like standard play by AK. AA or KK has the hand locked up, why play it so fast?

Imposter

lenny_leonard wrote:

but if he had a pair between, say, 77-JJ, surely he will put in a bet on the flop rather than give me a free card to hit a K or A. (Thats what I did with my 66!).

I called his pre-flop raise meaning that I could easily have a big Ace, and only flat-called because I dont want to get involved too heavily with the chip leader. And if you had a Q here, would you go all-in... I doubt it very, very much.

You called every raise I made preflop, not just this one (maybe you folded once, but there was no way you had a hand every time I raised).

You also bet out every time I checked the flop. I knew you were going to bet and as I said before if it was similar to before (ie not too big or small) then I was going all-in. I had to take the chance that you hadn't a top hand (Qx, KK, AA).

Hitman Actual

Imposter wrote:

You called every raise I made preflop, not just this one (maybe you folded once, but there was no way you had a hand every time I raised).

You also bet out every time I checked the flop.

I doubt very much that I called every raise you made pre-flop... I'm not in the habit of calling raises, that doesn't sound like me at all! (BTW, can I still download the hand histories even though the tournie is over?)

But I agree, I did bet most flops when you checked them to me, and they were pot size bets, so I can see now why you made the move. I just wasn't tuned into that at the time!

Edit: I'm still happy with my call and my reasons for making them.