Gay people and prejudice

Shabadu

Firstly, a massive boo-urns to everyone who holds a different attitude twoards anyone because of what box you happen to have put them in. Regardless of their gender, race, or sexual orientation, a predjudice is a predjudice. You either think of and treat people as equals, or you don't, and if you don't I know what that makes you in my opinion.

Something that really pisses me off is straight guys attitudes twoards lesbians. Guys always comment when my best friend and her mot are walking holding hands. Like all they really need is 'a good shagging'. Tbh I shared a flat with them once and a good shagging doesn't appear to be a problem for them. Ffs, it's not a porno guys.

rsynnott

Shabadu wrote:

Something that really pisses me off is straight guys attitudes twoards lesbians. Guys always comment when my best friend and her mot are walking holding hands. Like all they really need is 'a good shagging'. Tbh I shared a flat with them once and a good shagging doesn't appear to be a problem for them. Ffs, it's not a porno guys.

Sadly, many gay guys' attitudes towards lesbians are fairly bad as well. You'd think we, as a minority group, would have figured out that discrimination isn't the best idea, but you come across incredibly racist and classist gay people, sadly.

Boston

rsynnott wrote:

Sadly, many gay guys' attitudes towards lesbians are fairly bad as well. You'd think we, as a minority group, would have figured out that discrimination isn't the best idea, but you come across incredibly racist and classist gay people, sadly.

I wouldn't say they don't like lesbians, I'd say it's more a case of they don't like women. Theres plenty of lesbians that don't like men as well. On the classist issue, yep thats fairly plain to see in some people. People are people, just because they are part of a minority doesn't mean jack. The Irish where the scum of the UK, branded as drunken,violent,wasters. You would figure we wouldn't have a problem with minority groups at home, wouldn't yea?

mycroft

MobileInfantry wrote:

I know I don't speak for everyone but I think a large majority would agree with me when I say that its not a valid comparison as such - for such as argument to be put forward it would really have to be of two sides which are 50/50 each.

Speaking as part of the silent majority you seem to think you represent, the only thing thats disgusting here is some bigoted little troll, starting off a sentence "Now I'm not homophobic" and then calling it unnatural, and then backtracking when presenting that it happens among other species, and throughout our own cultural evolution.

Starks analogy about civil rights in the US is spot on, and you've chosen to ignore it, because it shows you your bigotry in all it's glory.

Shabadu

rsynnott wrote:

Sadly, many gay guys' attitudes towards lesbians are fairly bad as well. You'd think we, as a minority group, would have figured out that discrimination isn't the best idea, but you come across incredibly racist and classist gay people, sadly.

This is true, but most of my gay male friends aren't part of the scene and tend to be a lot more tolerant, and have more lesbian and straight female friends. This is just from what I've seen, i'm not saying it holds true for the majority.

Most gay guys I know are in serious relationships tend not to scream 'BREEDER!!' at me when they see me coming with the buggy, whereas some of the few I do know who are in 'the scene' (whatever that is, I hear it's quite a big thing apparently ;P) do not tolerate people who aren't very attractive, or thick, or women.

e38418

i have such a low opinion of homophobics,dont see why its more acceptable to be homophobic nowadays than it is to be racist.......idiots should be dropped in a big hole and let them turn on eachother

Boston

What does it matter if gays guys don't like women, or lesbians don't like men, or the "beautiful ones" don't like the "minger ones". This is a thread where people have talked about people being beaten and kicked to the ground for kissing. Get some propective. I don't care what people think once they don't act on it, or express themselves to me. People have a right not to like you, once there not bigotted about it.

Gadgie

LiouVille wrote:

People have a right not to like you, once there not bigotted about it.

Surely if their sole reason for not liking you is because you are male/female/ugly/whatever, then that is being bigoted?

rsynnott

Oh, also, down with attractive people

Boston

Gadgie wrote:

Surely if their sole reason for not liking you is because you are male/female/ugly/whatever, then that is being bigoted?

So what though if they keep it to themselves. lots of people have reasons for not liking lots of other people. I dislike the current generation of Dublin women, I don't think I've ever met a Dublin woman I liked. I tend to dislike feminists, I tend to dislike stereotypical gay men, I tend to dislike stereotypical "Irish lads". So what though, I don't make an issue out of it. It's not a requirement everyone likes everyone else. Being bigoted about it is holding view points like padser or mobil infantry, that just because you don't like someone means they don't have the same rights as you, they are less then you and not a person, that they are wrong and unnatural,and you have the right to shove you're opinion of them in their face.

damien

LiouVille wrote:

I dislike the current generation of Dublin women, I don't think I've ever met a Dublin woman I liked. I tend to dislike feminists, I tend to dislike stereotypical gay men, I tend to dislike stereotypical "Irish lads". So what though, I don't make an issue out of it.

It's like rain on your wedding day...

Boston

Sorry there Damien, but far too far over my head.

Shabadu

LiouVille- do you not see that you saying you don't like Dublin women is the same thing as someone saying they don't like homosexuals? You dislike them because of what they are, rather than who they are. That is bigotry, imo.

Gadgie

LiouVille wrote:

Sorry there Damien, but far too far over my head.

He's quoting Ironic by Alanis Morissette...

Boston

Shabadu wrote:

LiouVille- do you not see that you saying you don't like Dublin women is the same thing as someone saying they don't like homosexuals? You dislike them because of what they are, rather than who they are. That is bigotry, imo.

No I dislike a certain type of women which allot of young Dublin women seem to mimic. It's far from what they are and more who they are. O and wouldn't a major part of bigotry be hatred?

Shabadu

I dislike the current generation of Dublin women, I don't think I've ever met a Dublin woman I liked.

This ^^ is not the same thing as this:

No I dislike a certain type of women which allot of young Dublin women seem to mimic. It's far from what they are and more who they are.

Either way, it's presupposing someone's personality. I don't like a lot of Dublin women either, but some of them are my best friends. You can't really presume you're not going to like someone because of where they are from.

Boston

Shabadu wrote:

This ^^ is not the same thing as this:

Thats what I ment when I said current generation, aka young dublin women. Never said I dislike all dublin women.

Shabadu wrote:

Either way, it's presupposing someone's personality. I don't like a lot of Dublin women either, but some of them are my best friends. You can't really presume you're not going to like someone because of where they are from.

You meet enough of a certain type of person, you can honestly say you don't like that type of person, and you can spot this type of person within afew minutes of talking to them. Maybe I didn't explain myself as well as I could, but I think you know what type I'm talking about. I don't think it's biggoted by any stretch of the imagination.

Shabadu

Ok, I get what you mean now.

RuggieBear

some of my best friends are young women from dublin but.....

Shabadu

Cheeky.

rsynnott

A "certain sort of person", eh? Wonderful

Boston

Whatever rsynnott. I somehow think you completely missed the point :rolleyes:

damien

LiouVille wrote:

You meet enough of a certain type of person, you can honestly say you don't like that type of person, and you can spot this type of person within afew minutes of talking to them. ... but I think you know what type I'm talking about.

Exactly the same diatribe used by Padser and his mates. Pre-judging people by their peers or their company or their heritage is just the same as what he did. It's ignorant and backwards. You seem to like letting people know you're the exception to some homosexual rule yet going by your own standards people would be allowed to pre-judge you on your peers. The only difference between you and Padser when it comes to pre-judging seems to be the strenght of prejudging.

rsynnott

I am not a racialist, but, and zis is a BIG but...

Boston

damien.m wrote:

You seem to like letting people know you're the exception to some homosexual rule

Actually all I want is this comment explained.

Sangre

LiouVille wrote:

No it isn't. Padser and his mates had a clear hatred and distain for homosexuals, they also had no reason for feeling that way.

Of course they could have a reason, social, political, religious or biological.

Just because its directed at you doesn't make it any difference from your prejudice.

Boston

Sangre wrote:

Of course they could have a reason, social, political, religious or biological.

Just because its directed at you doesn't make it any difference from your prejudice.

Of course, but do enlighten us on your views of nortsiders mine dickie chum.

Sangre

Now you're prejudging me.

Kevin_rc_ie

I prejudge people all the time. The key difference is I allow my prejudgements to be forgotten if evidence is presented that makes them incorrect.

Boston

Sangre wrote:

Now you're prejudging me.

No, I've actually listened to you, and read quiet allot of your posts.

Sangre

Anyway I've nothing against Northsiders, they make great garbage men.

My point was you're prejudiced against people but then horrified that people could be biggoted to homosexuals. I just pointed out that there are valid opinions to be predjuiced against them.

Boston

Sangre wrote:

My point was you're prejudiced against people but then horrified that people could be biggoted to homosexuals. I just pointed out that there are valid opinions to be predjuiced against them.

of course there is, there are some undeniable facts about the gay-community, the scence and the culture, which allot of people don't like. But allot of gay people arn't in the "gay-community", on "the scence" or relate to "the culture", and just because someone is, may say very little about that person. I'm well aware of the fallacy of judging a whole group of people based on experience, or lack there of, of a few. But the orginal point hasn't been argued at all, so I take it as a given that it doesn't matter whether someone likes someone else, once they stay the hell out of your face about it?

rsynnott

Sangre wrote:

Of course they could have a reason, social, political, religious or biological.

Just because its directed at you doesn't make it any difference from your prejudice.

Okay, let's address the 'reasons' mentioned for hatred.

Social: Gay people do no obvious harm to society. If you can show me an example of people suffering because of the presence of gay people I'll be impressed.

Political: As far as I know we are currrently without a major gay-bashing political faction.

Religious: No major religion both prohibits homosexuality and condones hating those who are prohibited by that religion.

Biological: Homosexuality is present in most higher mammals and elsewhere.

But I agree that he has no grounds for on the one hand objecting to irrational prejudice (against gay people) and on the other hand espousing irrational prejudice (against various random groups mentioned above).

Sangre

Just because you don't agree doesn't make a reason any less valid.

KdjaCL

Shabadu wrote:

Something that really pisses me off is straight guys attitudes twoards lesbians. Guys always comment when my best friend and her mot are walking holding hands. Like all they really need is 'a good shagging'. Tbh I shared a flat with them once and a good shagging doesn't appear to be a problem for them. Ffs, it's not a porno guys.

Are you not prejudging all straight guys? Or are you subtly agreeing with your topic ?


Kdjac

damien

LiouVille wrote:

Actually all I want is this comment explained.

I have no time for people who selectively edit and erase their comments. Revisionism and obfuscation are not admirable qualities.

rsynnott

Sangre wrote:

Just because you don't agree doesn't make a reason any less valid.

The 'reasons' you've given need backing up; on their own, none provide clear grounds for hating gay people, and only the religious one provides clear grounds for denigrating gay people.

Boston

Actually sod this, back to the party political line.

All women are wonderful and like your mother. They never play guys, they never use sex a weapon, and are purely angelic. Dublin women are especially nice. The growing trend of stuck up, manipulative birds is a work of the media, never see them myself.

All Gay men are saints, the scene is full of people looking for loving relationships.The culture is diverse and full of substance, and is in no way image centred. while the Gay community is one of the most excepting, non-judgemental, and welcoming one I've ever known.

Those feminists are true freedom fighters, and really work for equality of the sexes, if by equality you mean proportional discrimination. Us men really shouldn't ever question them, after all we've allot to be ashamed off.

rsynnott

Quite right

Sangre

rsynnott wrote:

The 'reasons' you've given need backing up; on their own, none provide clear grounds for hating gay people, and only the religious one provides clear grounds for denigrating gay people.

Who said hate?

I couldn't be bothered backing them up, their not my views

Shabadu

KdjaC wrote:

Are you not prejudging all straight guys? Or are you subtly agreeing with your topic ?


Kdjac

Jaysis Kdjac, was it not fairly obvious that I was talking about straight guys who shouted things at my friends? I'm sorry that you inferred I meant all straight guys. Also, this is not 'my topic' it was split off from another thread, and happened to be split on my post.

the_syco

What I find amusing now, is that some guys find gay guys repulsive, but don't care if its gay women. The same for some ladies: they don't care about the gay lads, bu don't like the gay ladies.

And I know gay ladies are called lesbians, but its funny... its almost as if half the population don't consider the gay ladies a "threat", but the gay lads are.

Stark

Also, this is not 'my topic' it was split off from another thread, and happened to be split on my post.

Yeah, you win a prize for that.

Shabadu

Hooray! A fabulous hat would be nice, please.

hazimel

the_syco wrote:

its almost as if half the population don't consider the gay ladies a "threat", but the gay lads are.

Urgh, I know what you mean. That really annoys me. I think lesbianism is far more socially acceptable than male homosexuality. Though I think most lesbians would agree that while it's cool to be more accepted socially, they'd probably be quite upset at the fact that the only reason they are being accepted as such is probably because hetero men like the idea of women having sex with one another. It's not exactly a big win for liberalism.